K guys looks like I'm going to be doing a custom install in the back seat of my '99 Dodge Ram Pickup, largely for show and appearance purposes. This setup will include 3 (or 4, undecided at this point) JL 12w6v2's powered by either a 1000/1 JL amp (if I go with 3 subs) or 2 1000/1 JL amps (with the 4 12's set-up). Problem is I think this will be WAY too much bass for everyday driving. I'd only want it cranked up at shows and the occasional showing off. Is there a way for me to minimize the output of these to the same point as say, 2 average 10's or 12's would put out without hurting crispness, overall sound quality, or causing distortion in the sound? Basically, I want the BIG BOOM set up for special occasions but considerably less bass when just driving to work or whatever. Also a VERY big concern of mine is keeping a good clean sound (which is why I'm choosing either top of the line Boston's or Focal's for my speaker set-up) so keeping those crisp clean mids and highs are also very important. I'm quite new to car audio so I apologize if this is a stupid question (I've heard of turning down the gain on the amp....not sure if that's what I want to do or not). Thanks again!
-Mike-
Replies (12)
compvr15s on 09/16/2003 19:53:24
you can leave the gains on the amp the same but use your cd player to adjust the bass. what type of cd player do you have, i know most cd players have adjustable crossovers and things of the such, when everyday driving id have the bass set to maybe -6 or sumtin like that then when you want to show off set it to 0 or +3 and that will make a difference, i dont know if it will make the difference you are looking for. other than that you can get the remote bass gains, i dunno if jl has them or not but they run from the amp through a phone cable upto a remote that you place in reaching distance and you can use the knob to adjust the bass that way. id neither of them ideas are desired then you will more than likely have to adjust the gains for each application. good luck, sounds like a killer system in the making
Swez on 09/17/2003 07:37:52
The other option I see here, is to run only one system... a single amp and dual subs for daily driver. The other amp/speakers can be disconnected by pulling the REM lead or installing a switchable REM to control which amps will be on/off as you wish.
NOTE: When using the REM feed off the HU to turn on your amps, know that most HU's can supply a +12 volt supply with ~250-300 mA of current. That's generally 2- 3 devices before overtaxing the REM circuit in most HU's. Here, a relay sytem with multiple taps will work out well. Using the REM lead on the HU to power the solinoid coil in the relay, additional power taps off the relay output will work very well here as this is a 12 volt, 30A relay circuit.
We can show you how this is accomplished and if you plan to run more than 2-3 devices off the REM lead... will need a relay circuit.
Swez
mJonesie on 09/17/2003 12:28:58
I right now just have a low-end Kenwood after-marked CD deck but shortly after putting in this system (in theory anyway) I will be putting in the new Kenwood In-dash DVD Player, the KVT-915. That's another concern about not having TOO much bass is I will be playing movies and video games and such so I'd actually want to hear the rest of the movie, not just when a cannonball drops in Pearl Harbor if ya know what I mean. I would imagine the Kenwood would have ample bass control capabilities.
As far as the remote bass gains, I will have to check with JL on that.
Also, Swez, with disconnecting the two subs and amp as mentioned, would that be a fairly easy process? I mean would I just have to reach back and unplug a cord to do this or would it require more attention? Ease of use is also important. Any other ideas?
-Mike-
ttocs on 09/17/2003 17:27:55
you could wire a seperate switch that would cut the remote turn on to the amps you wish to turn off. You could also pull the fuse on the amp, disconnect the rca's..... There are a million ways to shut an amp off..
Swez on 09/17/2003 21:01:08
Like ttocs said.. a simple switch system will do the job. Just break the REM connection to the amp and it will not come on.
Swez
mJonesie on 09/20/2003 13:23:25
One other thing is the JL amp I'm looking at using to power the system comes with the following feature that I found per their website at http://www.jlaudio.com/amps/10001.html
Bass EQ:
parametric with variable boost up to 15dB and Remote Bass Control (optional)
Would this be something that would be a very needed or desired feature due to my needs? It only mentions boosting the bass UP, nothing about powering it down, but if it had the ability to increase the normal bass shouldn't it also possess the ability to DEcrease it?
-Mike-
compvr15s on 09/20/2003 19:46:21
you can use this to turn down the bass. instead of setting your gain so high you will be adjusting the bass boost. i have this function on my kicker amps i just didnt want to tear the car apart again to run the cord. i dunno why they didnt make it a gain adjustment control but you will just have to turn down the gain and turn up the boost. when you set the boost on the amp make sure the controller is all the way up, so then when you want to turn it down you just have to turn the know,then when ya want full bass turn it back to full. but i dont recommend using high bass boost. so wait for others to comment
Swez on 09/21/2003 09:22:31
Also, when you get your new HU... get one that has the ability to control sub output to your amps. You can cut the bass via the HU and not have to mess with the rest of the system (full range) settings this way. This will give you better control from the drivers seat on how much bass you desire.
If you still wind up with too much bass, can always cut of the 2nd amp & subs as noted earlier.
Swez
mJonesie on 09/22/2003 12:22:44
Here is the HU unit (or at least a quite similar HU unit) that I am getting. Couldn't quite tell if it had the features you guys were referring to. I got the info off www.kenwoodusa.com/produc...ctId=2375.
Here it is:
KEY FEATURES
- Built-In Single-Disc DVD/CD Player
- DIN-Size In-Dash Mounting
- Full Bandwidth Power (less than 1%% THD): 22 Watts x 4
- Full-Function Remote Control: Grip-Type
- LCD Screen: 6-1/2" Wide; Retractable
- Maximum Power: 45 Watts x 4
- Preouts: Front, Rear, and Non-Fading
- System E's + Advanced Crossover System
- System Q EX Sound Control
- Touch Screen Control with New Graphic User Interface
- Widescreen (16:9) Aspect Ratio
GENERAL FEATURES
- DIN-Size In-Dash Mounting
- Dual-Zone Audio Control: with Optional Adaptor
- Finish: Silver/Black
- Full-Function Remote: Grip-Type
- High Voltage Preamp Output: 4.5V
- Iso-Mount Capability for Japanese Vehicles
- PowerSlide/B.M.S. Interface: with Compatible Amplifier
- Programmable Security Code System
- Semi-Automatic Retractable Screen
- System E's + Advanced Crossover System
- System Q EX Sound Control
- Tone Control: Bass, Treble
- Touch Screen GUI Control: Brand-New Design
- Touch-Tone Buttons: Defeatable
AUDIO FEATURES
- Attenuator with Smooth Volume Return: -20dB
- Audio/Video Inputs: 2
- Audio/Video Outputs: 1
- B.M.S. (Bass Management System)
- Dual-Zone Control
- Electronic Audio Control (Volume, Balance, Fader)
- Front/Rear Fader
- High Voltage Preamp Output: 4.5V
- Loudness Control
- Low Output Impedance (80 Ohms)
- Plus/Minus Power Source
- Preouts: Front, Rear (Gold-Plated)
- Source Tone Memory
- System E's + Advanced Crossover System
- System Q EX Sound Control
- Tone Controls: Bass, Treble
Will this HU unit have the features that are needed for what I'm trying to accomplish? Thanks guys!
-Mike-
Swez on 09/23/2003 08:39:09
Hard to say what that model can do... looks like everything but cook your meals! GRIN
Do you have a model number as the address noted returned and error 404 code.
The BMS function may hold the key to your question about bass controls. Not sure what that feature can do. I note the non fading sub output here and that's a plus... but need more product info to tell if you have gain control managment for the subs in the HU you are considering.
Comments? MODEL # would help a lot
Swez
mJonesie on 09/24/2003 17:14:18
Yeah sorry about that link not working. The model number I am referring to is the KVT-911DVD.
-Mike-
Swez on 09/24/2003 19:10:29
OK, now we're getting somewhere... the BMS function is a filter network to allocate only lows to the subs. The site gives no additional details as to other function control features that BMS will operate as a bass limiter.
However, the Q EX parametric EQ may have enough band control to do what you want. It seems to me that you can preset the three different ranges (Low, Med & Highs) to given presets and control output gain in each category independent of other.
You'll have to review the owners manual for set up parameters of this feature... but my guess, you can set the LOW EQ bandwith and gain out here and attenuate as needed to reduce the bass when you activate this preset. This might work out after some reading and testing.
Swez
-Mike-
Replies (12)
compvr15s on 09/16/2003 19:53:24
you can leave the gains on the amp the same but use your cd player to adjust the bass. what type of cd player do you have, i know most cd players have adjustable crossovers and things of the such, when everyday driving id have the bass set to maybe -6 or sumtin like that then when you want to show off set it to 0 or +3 and that will make a difference, i dont know if it will make the difference you are looking for. other than that you can get the remote bass gains, i dunno if jl has them or not but they run from the amp through a phone cable upto a remote that you place in reaching distance and you can use the knob to adjust the bass that way. id neither of them ideas are desired then you will more than likely have to adjust the gains for each application. good luck, sounds like a killer system in the making
Swez on 09/17/2003 07:37:52
The other option I see here, is to run only one system... a single amp and dual subs for daily driver. The other amp/speakers can be disconnected by pulling the REM lead or installing a switchable REM to control which amps will be on/off as you wish.
NOTE: When using the REM feed off the HU to turn on your amps, know that most HU's can supply a +12 volt supply with ~250-300 mA of current. That's generally 2- 3 devices before overtaxing the REM circuit in most HU's. Here, a relay sytem with multiple taps will work out well. Using the REM lead on the HU to power the solinoid coil in the relay, additional power taps off the relay output will work very well here as this is a 12 volt, 30A relay circuit.
We can show you how this is accomplished and if you plan to run more than 2-3 devices off the REM lead... will need a relay circuit.
Swez
mJonesie on 09/17/2003 12:28:58
I right now just have a low-end Kenwood after-marked CD deck but shortly after putting in this system (in theory anyway) I will be putting in the new Kenwood In-dash DVD Player, the KVT-915. That's another concern about not having TOO much bass is I will be playing movies and video games and such so I'd actually want to hear the rest of the movie, not just when a cannonball drops in Pearl Harbor if ya know what I mean. I would imagine the Kenwood would have ample bass control capabilities.
As far as the remote bass gains, I will have to check with JL on that.
Also, Swez, with disconnecting the two subs and amp as mentioned, would that be a fairly easy process? I mean would I just have to reach back and unplug a cord to do this or would it require more attention? Ease of use is also important. Any other ideas?
-Mike-
ttocs on 09/17/2003 17:27:55
you could wire a seperate switch that would cut the remote turn on to the amps you wish to turn off. You could also pull the fuse on the amp, disconnect the rca's..... There are a million ways to shut an amp off..
Swez on 09/17/2003 21:01:08
Like ttocs said.. a simple switch system will do the job. Just break the REM connection to the amp and it will not come on.
Swez
mJonesie on 09/20/2003 13:23:25
One other thing is the JL amp I'm looking at using to power the system comes with the following feature that I found per their website at http://www.jlaudio.com/amps/10001.html
Bass EQ:
parametric with variable boost up to 15dB and Remote Bass Control (optional)
Would this be something that would be a very needed or desired feature due to my needs? It only mentions boosting the bass UP, nothing about powering it down, but if it had the ability to increase the normal bass shouldn't it also possess the ability to DEcrease it?
-Mike-
compvr15s on 09/20/2003 19:46:21
you can use this to turn down the bass. instead of setting your gain so high you will be adjusting the bass boost. i have this function on my kicker amps i just didnt want to tear the car apart again to run the cord. i dunno why they didnt make it a gain adjustment control but you will just have to turn down the gain and turn up the boost. when you set the boost on the amp make sure the controller is all the way up, so then when you want to turn it down you just have to turn the know,then when ya want full bass turn it back to full. but i dont recommend using high bass boost. so wait for others to comment
Swez on 09/21/2003 09:22:31
Also, when you get your new HU... get one that has the ability to control sub output to your amps. You can cut the bass via the HU and not have to mess with the rest of the system (full range) settings this way. This will give you better control from the drivers seat on how much bass you desire.
If you still wind up with too much bass, can always cut of the 2nd amp & subs as noted earlier.
Swez
mJonesie on 09/22/2003 12:22:44
Here is the HU unit (or at least a quite similar HU unit) that I am getting. Couldn't quite tell if it had the features you guys were referring to. I got the info off www.kenwoodusa.com/produc...ctId=2375.
Here it is:
KEY FEATURES
- Built-In Single-Disc DVD/CD Player
- DIN-Size In-Dash Mounting
- Full Bandwidth Power (less than 1%% THD): 22 Watts x 4
- Full-Function Remote Control: Grip-Type
- LCD Screen: 6-1/2" Wide; Retractable
- Maximum Power: 45 Watts x 4
- Preouts: Front, Rear, and Non-Fading
- System E's + Advanced Crossover System
- System Q EX Sound Control
- Touch Screen Control with New Graphic User Interface
- Widescreen (16:9) Aspect Ratio
GENERAL FEATURES
- DIN-Size In-Dash Mounting
- Dual-Zone Audio Control: with Optional Adaptor
- Finish: Silver/Black
- Full-Function Remote: Grip-Type
- High Voltage Preamp Output: 4.5V
- Iso-Mount Capability for Japanese Vehicles
- PowerSlide/B.M.S. Interface: with Compatible Amplifier
- Programmable Security Code System
- Semi-Automatic Retractable Screen
- System E's + Advanced Crossover System
- System Q EX Sound Control
- Tone Control: Bass, Treble
- Touch Screen GUI Control: Brand-New Design
- Touch-Tone Buttons: Defeatable
AUDIO FEATURES
- Attenuator with Smooth Volume Return: -20dB
- Audio/Video Inputs: 2
- Audio/Video Outputs: 1
- B.M.S. (Bass Management System)
- Dual-Zone Control
- Electronic Audio Control (Volume, Balance, Fader)
- Front/Rear Fader
- High Voltage Preamp Output: 4.5V
- Loudness Control
- Low Output Impedance (80 Ohms)
- Plus/Minus Power Source
- Preouts: Front, Rear (Gold-Plated)
- Source Tone Memory
- System E's + Advanced Crossover System
- System Q EX Sound Control
- Tone Controls: Bass, Treble
Will this HU unit have the features that are needed for what I'm trying to accomplish? Thanks guys!
-Mike-
Swez on 09/23/2003 08:39:09
Hard to say what that model can do... looks like everything but cook your meals! GRIN
Do you have a model number as the address noted returned and error 404 code.
The BMS function may hold the key to your question about bass controls. Not sure what that feature can do. I note the non fading sub output here and that's a plus... but need more product info to tell if you have gain control managment for the subs in the HU you are considering.
Comments? MODEL # would help a lot
Swez
mJonesie on 09/24/2003 17:14:18
Yeah sorry about that link not working. The model number I am referring to is the KVT-911DVD.
-Mike-
Swez on 09/24/2003 19:10:29
OK, now we're getting somewhere... the BMS function is a filter network to allocate only lows to the subs. The site gives no additional details as to other function control features that BMS will operate as a bass limiter.
However, the Q EX parametric EQ may have enough band control to do what you want. It seems to me that you can preset the three different ranges (Low, Med & Highs) to given presets and control output gain in each category independent of other.
You'll have to review the owners manual for set up parameters of this feature... but my guess, you can set the LOW EQ bandwith and gain out here and attenuate as needed to reduce the bass when you activate this preset. This might work out after some reading and testing.
Swez
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