Since it is the holiday's I figured this is a good time to bring this up. Maybe some of you have visitors or are guests at this time and can help shed some light on things here. Do be careful of what you post! With others around in the house, someone could see this and could get offended....
My lady and I had a little spat about sleeping arrangements. Not that I wasn't willing to compromise, but she had already made plans without at least asking for my suggestions. Seeing that it is her parents maybe she wanted to take the initiative to make sure they are comfortable.
Anyways, what should be the sleeping arrangement where there is enough room to accomodate?
5 adults (2 couples) & 3 teenagers
2 queen size beds in two rooms (including master)
1 king size pullout sofa and another full on the
loveseat (living room)
2 twins in the last room
With 1 couple & the 3 teens as the hosts, who goes where? Who should give up their bedding?
Boy/ this might get interesting....
Replies (11)
ttocs on 11/23/2007 10:27:57
I never was a mathmaticitian or a good speller but that looks like you have 5 people, and 5 beds......... Whats the problem???
Ash on 11/23/2007 10:50:24
Sorry there ttocs, that should've been 5 adults + 3 teenagers...
The problem is my girl wanted us to give up our bedroom for her parents when the oldest teenager has his own room with a queen bed to accomodate them equally.
Call me a little old fashioned, but the way I figured the youngens should be in the living room with the adults in their own rooms being that they stay up the latest playing their video games and all...
Why should I give up my comforts over someone that lives free?
swez on 11/23/2007 12:28:53
Hum, this is a tough call. But it can also lead to a better sense of how a couple makes strategic decisions together later. If I come of a bit too direct here, it's because experience has taught some very hard lessons about when to bend, when to draw a line in the concrete and when to put a #12 boot in the offender's booty. (Are you ready for this spin?)
What is really the issue here is a matter of hospitality, reasonable accomodations and enough space for the adults to be comfortable while the kids make it a camping adventure in the living room or other open spaces.
This is also a lesson in boundary setting as well. If not done early in a relationship, this kind of stuff piles up for a series of other showdowns later. (Not recommended... a nip in the bud now, is a good plan for less chaos later) I made that mistake once... but not anymore! Compromise is wonderful, but neither party should accept getting the short end of the stick for very long.
Do you both agree about the need for good boundaries and what that looks like? If yes, this will all pan out in time. If "He" has solid boundaries and "She" does not, it's chaos and lots of work to get things back on the same page. As presented, "She" does not respect certain unclear boundaries or is not aware of a need for them while the "He" party needs to be more clear about how decisions like this are made as a team. It goes both ways as He and She are equals, but may see things from very different perspectives. (Expect that as it's normal and very common) No man can understand the mind and thought processes of a woman. We were not designed the same way.
Here, it's negotiation time. (Maybe even a "pardigm shift" is called for if this is a chronic situation) Things like this will come up a lot over time. Now is a very good time to sit down, talk it out and both He & She listen carefully to the whole story. Yes, we can bend on some matters and still be OK. But some issues require a firm stand and full agreement on what is and what is not doable.
The host(s) need not give up their "private space" to anyone if they both do not agree to do so in full accord. That's a private domain and it should remain that way, no matter who the guests are... period!
Adults come first and making them comfortable is always a good plan. Kids need their space too, but can be asked, (nicely or pointedly as needed) for some short term concessions. (2-3 nights at most) If they can be lead to making a game out of the whole ordeal, all the better. "Hey kids, you guys are going camping for a few days, but here are the rules..."
If they are older, let them be part of the solution so that they feel their opinions are heard. They may have a brilliant solution and feel good about getting the chance to see it happen. (Family meeting time)
Frankly, there are several sides to this equation and none of them warrant a deep rift. However, as presented, you and your woman are not on the same page at the moment. That's a tough spot when one partner makes an "Executive Decision" w/o receiving input from the other equal partner affected by that decision. (I know you are a fair-minded man and can bend when needed) But there are limits. Find them and then work out a plan that works for the whole sha-bang.
However, there is time to sort this all out and come to a resonable compromise.... "I am not giving up my bed for any visitors...period" !!! (That's a very fair position to take) What other options would you like to propose dear? (This one is off the charts and off the table)
This is kinda like saying... "Honey, my parents need a car for the week and since I have to go to work, your car is being loaned out". Do you think she'd swallow that one easily? Nope... and we would not either if the shoe were on the other footy.
The only real compromises I see here are:
1. Check out the hotels in the area and offer to pay a portion of the bill as the budget permits. That way, the guests have their space and your family has theirs too. That's how most families handle visits when space is limited.
2. Double up on the kids and see how they respond to a few nights of camping out in the living room. (They may love the idea?) Get their inputs and let them express legitimate issues.
3. Giving up your private domain is not an option unless both parties willingly agree it to be the best option. (This has to be a no grudges held this time, but we will not do it this way in the future)
Swez
PS One thing to remember about being a good house guest.... guests are like fish... after about 3 days, things begin to stink. If we have an out-building type Guest House available, that's a great option. But for those of us who don't, short-term flex is possible... but only when all parties agree on the arrangements BEFORE the offers are extended.
trunkisloud on 11/23/2007 13:24:04
dr.swez in the house..what is your time slot again?? i need to set the dvr to record......jk...i know that when i was young i had to give up my digs for company...and i would ask that my kids do the same...outta respect to the guests..i mean im sure that they didnt just invite themselves over...word.
Ash on 11/23/2007 14:09:35
Man, Swez you hit the nail on the head!!!!
swez on 11/24/2007 01:13:06
Don't blame me... LOL Am just calling them as the issue is presented and drawing on years of experience, making similar mistakes and learning from past errs.
You're a bright guy... trust your gut, be gentle, patient and leave room for unplanned challenges when wading into unfamiliar waters. Mistakes are not the issue. Learning and making good mid-course corrections are the keys to any successful experience.
Bless you my brother, (And your woman as well)
Dave
swez on 12/8/2007 12:32:05
Has this one been resolved to a workable degree? Sure hope so as time is getting to the bare wire.
BTW, your input on my dilemma was very timely as well. I tried the "nice guy approach" for a time and noted it has is not only ineffective, but became a "dumping ground" for the other party in question.
He railed me the other day for a series of non-issues. I responded back with a firm and stearn warning... "Don't tread on my good graces as I am more than willing/able to bite your head off as needed."
Well, my boss got wind of the matter, pulled me aside and gave some well-timed insights as to what is really going down here. "OK, now that I have said my peace, we can move on". (We are all stressed now and compounding the matter will do little good) Hold off and bend as things will get better soon. The main goal is running "Plan A" as best we can. The rest can be sorted out later. (OK... that's doable and I'll remain focused on Plan A for now)
My boss supported my position completely and asked that I stay out of the fray as best as possible. Having earned my respect, I will follow his suggestions and stay out of a full and overly crowded kitchen.
Friday was a great day in all. I did not have any confrontations with the "JERK" in question. I left the offender two V-mails:
1. "Am tired of your BS and will not back down anymore"!!! (The grace period is well over and past due) You have exceeded my patience and will pay a heavy price if you cross this line in concrete.
2. If you want to ride a bull like me, plan to end up on your azz as I will indeed fling you into the dumpster... (It's not my fav plan, but if you insist, I'll be happy to give you a ride you'll not soon forget and regret much of it later)
As of today, all is quiet and well with the world! Thanks for your input as I was so enmeshed in the forest, the trees were invisable.
Cheers Mate,
Swez
PS Like brothers, we have many similar traits and tolerances. If one crosses that line, expect a "life lesson" that is sure to bring home the mail. Hoping your mail was sent and well received. (Mine was sent too... but time will tell how well it was received)
Ash on 12/8/2007 16:11:35
Unfortuantely there were some other underlying issues to be dealt with and that incident was just a fuse...
The good thing is that now everything (at least on my part) has been layed out on the table. Now that we see it all, it is time to deal with it and I refuse to any sweeping under the rug treatment.
I've always been partial to communication as long as both parties are willing to listen with the intent to understand each one's perceptions. However if that small but important point cannot be reached then there is no need in going further. It is time to let go...
I've made myself clear of this so there can be no excuses and have let her know that I am very serious. I can easily walk away with no regrets, scorn, and any other related bull that may follow. Tough love baby! Sounds harsh I know, but with the mentality of people these days you have to let them know not to mistake tolerance for ignorance.....
swez on 12/8/2007 16:38:10
Amen there bro... am reading your mail and you are reading mine as well.
May be reading between the lines a bit too much here, but I detect one fed up man who's just about had enough of the status quo. If things don't change, it's time to pack and move on. Life is too short to endure foolishness, a win-lose (or lose-lose) scenario very long. If we've given it out best shot and the other parties are not cooperating, it's time for a well planned exit strategy and cut additional losses when possible.
This is true of friendships, jobs and non-binding relationships. Just because others act foolishly and we try to be tolerant and patient, does not mean we are unaware of what's really going on. We cannot change others, but we do have the power to speak the truth calmly, stand by our guns and if things do not change, it's time to walk away. Yes, it's messy at times. But even more so if we remain and allow the status quo to continue unabated.
I get it bro.... I really do!
Swez
Ash on 12/8/2007 20:17:55
As usual, you know how we "mind up". True that! I am pretty much fed up, but I give all a fair chance to amend or at least realize their wrongdoings. We are all human and we all make mistakes.
I take part blame in this situation as I haven't communicated like I should have when problems arised. I have toned my temperament down perhaps a bit too far in a attempt to rectify my past behaviors to the point that I am overly passive at times.
My ex told me before parting after 13 years that with my anger & attitude someone was going to kill me out of fear or I was going to seriously hurt or kill them. I took heed since we had been together for so long and had to know me by then. I asked peers & coworkers if that seemed true. To my surprise they agreed and I then proceeded to change for that was not the man I wanted to be. It hurt to know that people around me actually feltt that way about me. Fear is just the tip of the iceberg and eventually turns to other negative things. I didn't want to be that kind of person. It just wasn't me.
Maybe now I have gone a step backwards too far, but it's hard to keep your composure when it's easy to see through people. The bigger challenge was to overcome myself rather than unleash rage on others. Call it over compensating I guess?!!
This is the result of a shy & quiet kid that was bullied one time to many. Once I learned how to speak up for myself, it became a bit out of hand and tolerance was zero! Not good!! I knew I was too bright for that and in the process of change became to complacent with being too easy going.
For those reading this and not getting it: Who, what, and how you are will reflect that in relationships. Sometimes you gotta step back before proceeding because we all could use a good look in the mirror at times. The best way to influence change in others to change one self as we tend to lead by example and not word of mouth. Still you have to recognize that we all are responsible for only ourselves and cannot affect everyone around us.
Hopefully things will work out, but if not, I now know I can walk away without shame or hate. I would actually wish her the best in improving her life and move on.....
swez on 12/8/2007 21:52:50
Oh... I so get that overshoot stuff. Like you, I was once determined to right every wrong, fix every mistake and take charge of all I could get my hands on. (Control freak?... hope not) Then, the axe came down, beat me to a pulp and cured my over-bearing attititudes. From there, I became too complacent and more tolerant of the status quo then was healthy. That over-shoot was not good either.
Now, it's more about picking battles that can be won or a good compromise, (A draw and negotiable as time goes on) can be reached in due time. I no longer feel the need to win everytime. But a lose-lose scenario is not a good option either. If there is a reasonable middle ground for all parties involved, that is worth negotiating. If not, it's time to cut losses and move on peacably and learn from the process.
No, we cannot do this alone and are designed to do so alone. The more wise community input we have available, the better the options list will be in the long run. Peace of mind is not giving up and giving in. It's more like weighing out all seen options, what is best for all and if that is not possible, cash in the chips, learn a tough lesson and move on as a wiser and more experienced person.
Ash, I'm in your corner and would not suggest pulling the plug until all other options are weighed, discussed and hashed out. There is a balance point here to search out. Only the wise and discerning person will find it. (But we have to explore many options before we cut and run) May I suggest biding a little time more, express your fears, concerns and hurts to the lady in question? If she is plugged in, a fresh insight will come and things will eventually pan out, If not, you have done the best you can, end this chapter in the book of life and time to move on. (Rewrite old scripts and learn from the process)
"Mistake are only human and we all make then one or twice". But when we relive the same mistakes over and over again, that's not a mistake... it's blind spot, (Or character flaw we cannot see) and we need outside help to overcome them in the future.
You have much wisdom/experience to draw from at this juncture in life. But as with all things, we all need "outside the box" input before making the next step forward. There is no hurry or rush. The lessons learned are beneficial and expediant later. I commend you for your honesty and openess. Others will see this in time and great respect will be the crowning reward at a later time. Accept this stuggle for a little more time and see if the light comes with your lady. If not, then it's time to move on and be wiser for the future.
Again, may God bless you for the extra effort and due dilgence later,
Dave
PS I stress God for a very good reason. If you only knew my past struggles, defeats and now victories, there's only one way to explain them... "God's intervention". Believe it or not, my "God" is using you as a human guide post right this minute. He is also using me to reflect HIS wisdom back in your direction. I am not that smart and these are not my words alone. Take it or leave it, but God is in this with a better outcome then either of us can imagine on our own.
Word up....I am not ashamed to admit inadequacy in some matters, and give credit where credit is due. It's not me speaking my friend... we have much more than worldly wisdom available... just being humble enough to ask, is the first step.
My lady and I had a little spat about sleeping arrangements. Not that I wasn't willing to compromise, but she had already made plans without at least asking for my suggestions. Seeing that it is her parents maybe she wanted to take the initiative to make sure they are comfortable.
Anyways, what should be the sleeping arrangement where there is enough room to accomodate?
5 adults (2 couples) & 3 teenagers
2 queen size beds in two rooms (including master)
1 king size pullout sofa and another full on the
loveseat (living room)
2 twins in the last room
With 1 couple & the 3 teens as the hosts, who goes where? Who should give up their bedding?
Boy/ this might get interesting....
Replies (11)
ttocs on 11/23/2007 10:27:57
I never was a mathmaticitian or a good speller but that looks like you have 5 people, and 5 beds......... Whats the problem???
Ash on 11/23/2007 10:50:24
Sorry there ttocs, that should've been 5 adults + 3 teenagers...
The problem is my girl wanted us to give up our bedroom for her parents when the oldest teenager has his own room with a queen bed to accomodate them equally.
Call me a little old fashioned, but the way I figured the youngens should be in the living room with the adults in their own rooms being that they stay up the latest playing their video games and all...
Why should I give up my comforts over someone that lives free?
swez on 11/23/2007 12:28:53
Hum, this is a tough call. But it can also lead to a better sense of how a couple makes strategic decisions together later. If I come of a bit too direct here, it's because experience has taught some very hard lessons about when to bend, when to draw a line in the concrete and when to put a #12 boot in the offender's booty. (Are you ready for this spin?)
What is really the issue here is a matter of hospitality, reasonable accomodations and enough space for the adults to be comfortable while the kids make it a camping adventure in the living room or other open spaces.
This is also a lesson in boundary setting as well. If not done early in a relationship, this kind of stuff piles up for a series of other showdowns later. (Not recommended... a nip in the bud now, is a good plan for less chaos later) I made that mistake once... but not anymore! Compromise is wonderful, but neither party should accept getting the short end of the stick for very long.
Do you both agree about the need for good boundaries and what that looks like? If yes, this will all pan out in time. If "He" has solid boundaries and "She" does not, it's chaos and lots of work to get things back on the same page. As presented, "She" does not respect certain unclear boundaries or is not aware of a need for them while the "He" party needs to be more clear about how decisions like this are made as a team. It goes both ways as He and She are equals, but may see things from very different perspectives. (Expect that as it's normal and very common) No man can understand the mind and thought processes of a woman. We were not designed the same way.
Here, it's negotiation time. (Maybe even a "pardigm shift" is called for if this is a chronic situation) Things like this will come up a lot over time. Now is a very good time to sit down, talk it out and both He & She listen carefully to the whole story. Yes, we can bend on some matters and still be OK. But some issues require a firm stand and full agreement on what is and what is not doable.
The host(s) need not give up their "private space" to anyone if they both do not agree to do so in full accord. That's a private domain and it should remain that way, no matter who the guests are... period!
Adults come first and making them comfortable is always a good plan. Kids need their space too, but can be asked, (nicely or pointedly as needed) for some short term concessions. (2-3 nights at most) If they can be lead to making a game out of the whole ordeal, all the better. "Hey kids, you guys are going camping for a few days, but here are the rules..."
If they are older, let them be part of the solution so that they feel their opinions are heard. They may have a brilliant solution and feel good about getting the chance to see it happen. (Family meeting time)
Frankly, there are several sides to this equation and none of them warrant a deep rift. However, as presented, you and your woman are not on the same page at the moment. That's a tough spot when one partner makes an "Executive Decision" w/o receiving input from the other equal partner affected by that decision. (I know you are a fair-minded man and can bend when needed) But there are limits. Find them and then work out a plan that works for the whole sha-bang.
However, there is time to sort this all out and come to a resonable compromise.... "I am not giving up my bed for any visitors...period" !!! (That's a very fair position to take) What other options would you like to propose dear? (This one is off the charts and off the table)
This is kinda like saying... "Honey, my parents need a car for the week and since I have to go to work, your car is being loaned out". Do you think she'd swallow that one easily? Nope... and we would not either if the shoe were on the other footy.
The only real compromises I see here are:
1. Check out the hotels in the area and offer to pay a portion of the bill as the budget permits. That way, the guests have their space and your family has theirs too. That's how most families handle visits when space is limited.
2. Double up on the kids and see how they respond to a few nights of camping out in the living room. (They may love the idea?) Get their inputs and let them express legitimate issues.
3. Giving up your private domain is not an option unless both parties willingly agree it to be the best option. (This has to be a no grudges held this time, but we will not do it this way in the future)
Swez
PS One thing to remember about being a good house guest.... guests are like fish... after about 3 days, things begin to stink. If we have an out-building type Guest House available, that's a great option. But for those of us who don't, short-term flex is possible... but only when all parties agree on the arrangements BEFORE the offers are extended.
trunkisloud on 11/23/2007 13:24:04
dr.swez in the house..what is your time slot again?? i need to set the dvr to record......jk...i know that when i was young i had to give up my digs for company...and i would ask that my kids do the same...outta respect to the guests..i mean im sure that they didnt just invite themselves over...word.
Ash on 11/23/2007 14:09:35
Man, Swez you hit the nail on the head!!!!
swez on 11/24/2007 01:13:06
Don't blame me... LOL Am just calling them as the issue is presented and drawing on years of experience, making similar mistakes and learning from past errs.
You're a bright guy... trust your gut, be gentle, patient and leave room for unplanned challenges when wading into unfamiliar waters. Mistakes are not the issue. Learning and making good mid-course corrections are the keys to any successful experience.
Bless you my brother, (And your woman as well)
Dave
swez on 12/8/2007 12:32:05
Has this one been resolved to a workable degree? Sure hope so as time is getting to the bare wire.
BTW, your input on my dilemma was very timely as well. I tried the "nice guy approach" for a time and noted it has is not only ineffective, but became a "dumping ground" for the other party in question.
He railed me the other day for a series of non-issues. I responded back with a firm and stearn warning... "Don't tread on my good graces as I am more than willing/able to bite your head off as needed."
Well, my boss got wind of the matter, pulled me aside and gave some well-timed insights as to what is really going down here. "OK, now that I have said my peace, we can move on". (We are all stressed now and compounding the matter will do little good) Hold off and bend as things will get better soon. The main goal is running "Plan A" as best we can. The rest can be sorted out later. (OK... that's doable and I'll remain focused on Plan A for now)
My boss supported my position completely and asked that I stay out of the fray as best as possible. Having earned my respect, I will follow his suggestions and stay out of a full and overly crowded kitchen.
Friday was a great day in all. I did not have any confrontations with the "JERK" in question. I left the offender two V-mails:
1. "Am tired of your BS and will not back down anymore"!!! (The grace period is well over and past due) You have exceeded my patience and will pay a heavy price if you cross this line in concrete.
2. If you want to ride a bull like me, plan to end up on your azz as I will indeed fling you into the dumpster... (It's not my fav plan, but if you insist, I'll be happy to give you a ride you'll not soon forget and regret much of it later)
As of today, all is quiet and well with the world! Thanks for your input as I was so enmeshed in the forest, the trees were invisable.
Cheers Mate,
Swez
PS Like brothers, we have many similar traits and tolerances. If one crosses that line, expect a "life lesson" that is sure to bring home the mail. Hoping your mail was sent and well received. (Mine was sent too... but time will tell how well it was received)
Ash on 12/8/2007 16:11:35
Unfortuantely there were some other underlying issues to be dealt with and that incident was just a fuse...
The good thing is that now everything (at least on my part) has been layed out on the table. Now that we see it all, it is time to deal with it and I refuse to any sweeping under the rug treatment.
I've always been partial to communication as long as both parties are willing to listen with the intent to understand each one's perceptions. However if that small but important point cannot be reached then there is no need in going further. It is time to let go...
I've made myself clear of this so there can be no excuses and have let her know that I am very serious. I can easily walk away with no regrets, scorn, and any other related bull that may follow. Tough love baby! Sounds harsh I know, but with the mentality of people these days you have to let them know not to mistake tolerance for ignorance.....
swez on 12/8/2007 16:38:10
Amen there bro... am reading your mail and you are reading mine as well.
May be reading between the lines a bit too much here, but I detect one fed up man who's just about had enough of the status quo. If things don't change, it's time to pack and move on. Life is too short to endure foolishness, a win-lose (or lose-lose) scenario very long. If we've given it out best shot and the other parties are not cooperating, it's time for a well planned exit strategy and cut additional losses when possible.
This is true of friendships, jobs and non-binding relationships. Just because others act foolishly and we try to be tolerant and patient, does not mean we are unaware of what's really going on. We cannot change others, but we do have the power to speak the truth calmly, stand by our guns and if things do not change, it's time to walk away. Yes, it's messy at times. But even more so if we remain and allow the status quo to continue unabated.
I get it bro.... I really do!
Swez
Ash on 12/8/2007 20:17:55
As usual, you know how we "mind up". True that! I am pretty much fed up, but I give all a fair chance to amend or at least realize their wrongdoings. We are all human and we all make mistakes.
I take part blame in this situation as I haven't communicated like I should have when problems arised. I have toned my temperament down perhaps a bit too far in a attempt to rectify my past behaviors to the point that I am overly passive at times.
My ex told me before parting after 13 years that with my anger & attitude someone was going to kill me out of fear or I was going to seriously hurt or kill them. I took heed since we had been together for so long and had to know me by then. I asked peers & coworkers if that seemed true. To my surprise they agreed and I then proceeded to change for that was not the man I wanted to be. It hurt to know that people around me actually feltt that way about me. Fear is just the tip of the iceberg and eventually turns to other negative things. I didn't want to be that kind of person. It just wasn't me.
Maybe now I have gone a step backwards too far, but it's hard to keep your composure when it's easy to see through people. The bigger challenge was to overcome myself rather than unleash rage on others. Call it over compensating I guess?!!
This is the result of a shy & quiet kid that was bullied one time to many. Once I learned how to speak up for myself, it became a bit out of hand and tolerance was zero! Not good!! I knew I was too bright for that and in the process of change became to complacent with being too easy going.
For those reading this and not getting it: Who, what, and how you are will reflect that in relationships. Sometimes you gotta step back before proceeding because we all could use a good look in the mirror at times. The best way to influence change in others to change one self as we tend to lead by example and not word of mouth. Still you have to recognize that we all are responsible for only ourselves and cannot affect everyone around us.
Hopefully things will work out, but if not, I now know I can walk away without shame or hate. I would actually wish her the best in improving her life and move on.....
swez on 12/8/2007 21:52:50
Oh... I so get that overshoot stuff. Like you, I was once determined to right every wrong, fix every mistake and take charge of all I could get my hands on. (Control freak?... hope not) Then, the axe came down, beat me to a pulp and cured my over-bearing attititudes. From there, I became too complacent and more tolerant of the status quo then was healthy. That over-shoot was not good either.
Now, it's more about picking battles that can be won or a good compromise, (A draw and negotiable as time goes on) can be reached in due time. I no longer feel the need to win everytime. But a lose-lose scenario is not a good option either. If there is a reasonable middle ground for all parties involved, that is worth negotiating. If not, it's time to cut losses and move on peacably and learn from the process.
No, we cannot do this alone and are designed to do so alone. The more wise community input we have available, the better the options list will be in the long run. Peace of mind is not giving up and giving in. It's more like weighing out all seen options, what is best for all and if that is not possible, cash in the chips, learn a tough lesson and move on as a wiser and more experienced person.
Ash, I'm in your corner and would not suggest pulling the plug until all other options are weighed, discussed and hashed out. There is a balance point here to search out. Only the wise and discerning person will find it. (But we have to explore many options before we cut and run) May I suggest biding a little time more, express your fears, concerns and hurts to the lady in question? If she is plugged in, a fresh insight will come and things will eventually pan out, If not, you have done the best you can, end this chapter in the book of life and time to move on. (Rewrite old scripts and learn from the process)
"Mistake are only human and we all make then one or twice". But when we relive the same mistakes over and over again, that's not a mistake... it's blind spot, (Or character flaw we cannot see) and we need outside help to overcome them in the future.
You have much wisdom/experience to draw from at this juncture in life. But as with all things, we all need "outside the box" input before making the next step forward. There is no hurry or rush. The lessons learned are beneficial and expediant later. I commend you for your honesty and openess. Others will see this in time and great respect will be the crowning reward at a later time. Accept this stuggle for a little more time and see if the light comes with your lady. If not, then it's time to move on and be wiser for the future.
Again, may God bless you for the extra effort and due dilgence later,
Dave
PS I stress God for a very good reason. If you only knew my past struggles, defeats and now victories, there's only one way to explain them... "God's intervention". Believe it or not, my "God" is using you as a human guide post right this minute. He is also using me to reflect HIS wisdom back in your direction. I am not that smart and these are not my words alone. Take it or leave it, but God is in this with a better outcome then either of us can imagine on our own.
Word up....I am not ashamed to admit inadequacy in some matters, and give credit where credit is due. It's not me speaking my friend... we have much more than worldly wisdom available... just being humble enough to ask, is the first step.
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