Hi guys. a quick question....i have a 10 inch Alpine Type S in a sealed enclosure running off of a Kenwood KAC 8101D...the sql is nice but id like something thats also louder at higher volumes as mine is not. But, im tight on space and funds :(. My amp fits nice where it is and i wouldnt want a bigger one... SO my question is....will it make a difference for me to switch to a more powerful sub...possibly a type R or something from JL? or is changing the amp gonna be the better choice...id obvy like to do both..but at this point i cant...also ive always wondered what would make more difference.
Replies (32)
ace23 on 10/10/2007 18:10:00
personally i believe that a bigger amp always makes much more of a difference than swithcing a sub unless if your planning on switching the enclosure that sub is in or getting a bigger sub. i dont think by swithching a sub your gonna get much louder you'll prolly just get better sound quality but then again that also depends in the type of enclosure the sub is in. hope that helps you a lil bit
cplkittle on 10/10/2007 19:15:44
ported box instead of sealed
a more efficient sub
If you change the sub, the amplifier output has to match the wattage needed for the sub. If you buy a bigger amplifier, the sub has to be able to handle it.
gsandha99 on 10/10/2007 19:42:03
thanks guys....i dont wanna change to ported just because i like the sound of a sealed much more.....maybe a more efficient sub...any suggestions.? something decent in price?
cplkittle on 10/10/2007 19:57:19
amp specs:
Maximum Output Power (14.4V): 1000W
Rated Output Power (14.4V)
200W at 20-200Hz 0.5%THD (4 Ohms)
400W at 100Hz 0.5% THD (2 Ohms)
500W at 100Hz 1.0%THD (1 Ohms)
notice they are rated at 100Hz, most people don't want to hear anything above 80Hz from a sub.
This is not a 1000 watt amplifier. it has a 40 amp fuse
let's do some math
40 amps x 14.4 volts = 576
class D amplifiers are 80% efficient so let's subtract 20% = 460
RMS is 70% of max, so 70% of 460 is 322.5
This amplifier is actually 322.5 watts RMS, 460 watts peak at 1 ohm.
Now we can better choose a sub.
try this for example:
Powerbass XL-10D 300w RMS, 600 watts peak, 91dB1w/1m
http://www.powerbassusa.com/products/subwoofers/xl_subwoofers.html
gsandha99 on 10/10/2007 20:08:00
nice...so how do i know if i am pumping 14.4...im pretty sure my battery is 12v...correct? also...if we dont want to hear anything above 80hz, does that mean that the rated power is below what is actually being pumped? also...i guess the type S isnt the greatest of all subs...am i right....i am heading to a dealer who carries Hertz and JL subs....i think im gonna choose one of them...any suggestions?
cplkittle on 10/10/2007 20:25:55
type S subs are not bad. One of the cleanest sounding systems I have ever put together had 2 type S 10's.
The battery usually rests at 12-12.4 volts. The alternator puts out anywhere from 13-14.4 volts when the engine is running.
Even though the kenwood amp is overrated, I do give them props for listing the frequency in which they attained the output peak.
Your situation is a common one. You want more bass. The upgrades and more efficient sub will only give you a little more of what you are wanting. One month from now, you will get used to it again and that craving for more will come back. You are doing the right thing though by asking questions and trying to understand how to meet your needs.
If I had to guess, I would say that you are not going to be happy unless you add a second sub and upgrade to an amplifier that can handle both.
Ash on 10/10/2007 20:27:06
In order to get more volume from that amp you will need to upgrade to a pair of efficient 4 ohm subs that will match that amp in power (200rms each). Which Type S do you have? Single voice coil, dual, 2 or 4 ohm load per coil? Give the model # and we can give you a more definitive answer.
Cplkittle is right on with the ported. That would be the quickest and cheapest way and will net another 3db especially in the lower range. That amp is equipped with a subsonic filter and is capable of running that configuration. Not a bad option at all!
However, since you prefer sealed, only runnning a pair with the same efficiency of the Alpine or better will net you at least another 3 DB which is equivalent to a doubling in power. The con in more efficient speakers is the larger amount of airspace they require.
Box volume also will play a role in this as well. As we go larger in volume trying to play deeper notes, you will lose overall Spl. Smaller less bottom end, but more impact and more robust bass. Staying with a mid Q around .8 - .9 is ideal for auto sound. Depending on an individual tastes Qtc's around 1 works okay too with more output.
400 watts rms isn't bad if you can use efficient subs to convert it to sound properly, Going higher in power will not necessarily give more output unless it is a considerable increase (700- 800 rms). Still cheaper to do a pair of subs than have to reconfigure amp and subs altogether.
gsandha99 on 10/10/2007 20:33:10
hmm...this is more complicated that i thought...its a single voice coil, 4ohm.....so...i guess the next best option is upgrade sub..or add another...which includes changing the box..which i dont want to do because of space constraints...ill go to the my dealer on friday...do some tests...and let you guys know what i come up with...thanks for all the advice...oh...and im gettin the big 3 done baby! 8awg ok for that?
Ash on 10/10/2007 20:34:43
Use 4 awg to be sure.
Exactly how much space do you have available?
gsandha99 on 10/10/2007 20:35:56
ok...sounds good.....do you know where i can set the gain on a MC245 soundstream 4 channel amp by any chance?
Ash on 10/10/2007 20:41:25
It needs to be matched to the output voltage of whatever source is feeding it. That can also depend on the power handling capabilities of the speakers it's running.
swez on 10/11/2007 00:45:14
All good inputs here. Looked back at your Type S, it is a 4 ohm SVC sub and very low efficiency in a sealed box. A more efficient sub in a well matched enclosure would allow this amp to give more bass.
The Alpine SWR -1022D is a good step up in power handling, great SQ in a small sealed box, (0.7 cf) and can be wired for 1 ohm loads. The only drawback here, this sub is low efficiency too. A ported box would add +3dB more SPL near the tuning frequency and would not be a bad consideration. (Figure about 425-450 watts RMS from this amp at 1 ohm) That's not bad, but a more efficient sub choice would give more SPL from this modestly rated amp. (Say, 88dB SPL @ 2.83 volts or a tad more)
http://www.crutchfield.com/S-kcNtnM2yPzZ/App/Product/Item/Main.aspx?g=520&i=500SWR1022&tp=111
JL subs are also a great SQL sub. However, they are low efficiency and very expensive at retail prices.
Your 4 channel amp is a great little amp and if using aftermarket speakers with good efficiency would make a huge improvement over cheap stock speakers. To get even more power from this amp, consider 2 ohm speakers/channel in front, 4 ohm Coaxials in back.
Swez
gsandha99 on 10/11/2007 11:13:34
WIll my Kenwood amp be able to handle a 1 ohm load? and also...how would you wire the SWR - 1022D to handle a one ohm load? Any other suggestions for subs which are high efficiency in sealed enclosures? i really hate ported...:) and ive got JBL's running off my 4 channel...they sound great :). thanks for any input guys...this site is awesome.
gsandha99 on 10/11/2007 11:16:43
Also, would my kenwood be able to pump the Type R? it seems really power hungry
Ash on 10/11/2007 15:22:37
According to the specs within the manual, (unless I looked at the wrong one) that amp is only 2ohm stable. Still not bad....
One problem I forsee here is that you want to save space, but still get more output through an efficient sub. Unfortunately, that's just not how it works as the more efficient the sub, the bigger the box it will require (usually). It's either that or be prepared to give up some low end output or. You can't have all 3 (Hoffman's iron law).
gsandha99 on 10/11/2007 16:20:02
that makes sense...i think i will go ahaead and purchase a dual voice coil sub as it will be handle more wattage which the amp will produce.
ace23 on 10/11/2007 16:58:56
have you thought about getting shallow mounting subs i now pioneer and kicker offer them. it sounds like you really want to save space so you might want to look in that direction just an idea.
gsandha99 on 10/11/2007 17:30:38
I am going to purchase a SWR1021D...its a 2ohm + 2ohm......so does that mean that i can only wire it to 1ohm or 4ohms? or can i still wire it to get a 2ohm. Because my amp is the KAC 8101D as mentioned above..the best performance would be at a 2ohm load since my amp will not be stable at 1ohm.....and how would i wire it to get a 2ohm load? please advise!
ace23 on 10/11/2007 18:07:30
you can only get a 1 ohm or 4 ohm load out of this sub which isnt the best for your amp. you would have to wire it to 4 ohms becouse of your 2 ohm amp if you wire down to 1 this could end up frying your amp which isnt good. and no you cant get a 2 ohm load out of this sub
ace23 on 10/11/2007 18:11:03
if your going to get the type r i suggest you getting the SWR-1242D this is the sub you want to get. its a duel 4 ohm sub which means you can wire down to 2 ohms which will benefit your amp becouse it puts out the most at 2 ohms
cplkittle on 10/11/2007 22:52:15
The amplifier is 1 ohm stable according to the manual from kenwood:
http://manuals.kenwood.novenaweb.info/languages/EN/support/manuals/KAC-8151D.pdf
The 8151 and the 8101 apparently have the same manual
this is directly from the manual:
Audio Section
Max Power Output ..........................................................................................................1000 W กม 1
Rated Power Output
4 ohms 200w x 1
2 ohms 400w x 1
1 ohm 500w x 1
gsandha99 on 10/12/2007 01:56:12
but i wonder if that is just the listing...as in..just telling that at 1ohm the sub would be putting out this much....how do we know if it is 1ohm stable for sure? should it not list it at all? dont all amps list 1ohm readings regardless of whether they can support it or not?
cplkittle on 10/12/2007 10:16:18
no, if they are not stable at 1 ohm, they will not list an output for that resistance.
If they give an output for 1 ohm, it will work at 1 ohm.
gsandha99 on 10/12/2007 11:54:22
omg...man..thanks...i was hoping it would...im drooling...and i think i might wet myself....i am going to purchase the Type R dvc 2ohm on saturday...its gonna sound loud...anyone have a diagram for how to wire a 2ohm+2ohm sub to produce 1ohm for me?
cplkittle on 10/12/2007 13:36:29
all positive terminals to the positive on the amp
all negative terminals to the negative on the amp
this is called parallel wiring, and will give you a 1 ohm load.
gsandha99 on 10/12/2007 13:54:43
awesome...saturday cant come any slower...
gsandha99 on 10/12/2007 13:55:11
what are your guys thoughts on a yellow top?
cplkittle on 10/12/2007 14:19:31
yellow tops are great.
I have one, and it helps alot! Also, if you leave the lights on all night or run the battery down to nothing with the stereo, just turn everything off for 2 or 3 hours and the battery magically rejuvenates itself to a point, and you can crank your car again. It's like the batteries in an old flashlight that you run down. Pick it up a day later and it has power again. Plus you can almost completely discharge a dry cell or gel cell 50+ times before significant damage is done. Discharge a wetcell car battery twice and it is gone.
yeah I like them.
gsandha99 on 10/12/2007 15:05:59
wow...nice....are they pricey? i think in canada they are about 275...i might have to make a trip down to the states if they are much cheaper
gsandha99 on 10/13/2007 00:37:46
alright guys....some news......my sub current type S has passed away...welll...kinda...it comes back from time to time....it has been dieing lately...and if i push on the cone...it will start working....so im guessing it has something to do with a lose connecting in the woofer terminals...because when i push it in...it will flutter and sort of work...and if i take it out of the box...and play with the wires..it will start working again...this is ok..because im gettin the type R tommorrow...and wiring it at 1ohm anyways...so it should be fine...i thought it could be the amp....but ive ruled that out....anyways..hopefully running my amp at 1ohm will be ok....it says it can handle it soo....can we trust kenwood? i guess we gotta find out.....wierd how the sub died on me though..i was gonna sell it...oh well
SQLThump on 10/13/2007 02:29:12
Your sub has more than likely lost a connection under the dustcap. When you can push the cone in and get some response, this is usually caused by something hanging on by a thread.
I guess you probably don't care to fix it since you are getting a new sub, but keep in mind that there is always a reason why things like this happen. This was probably caused by overexcursion, and causes off that include poorly macthed enclosures and subs, overpowering, or poorly matched bass boost and gain.
Be extra careful when you install your fresh new Type-R, becaues it really sucks when history repeats itself.
swez on 10/13/2007 07:27:04
Wow, a lot of fresh threads this week... all good inputs too.
Yes, an Alpine 2+2 DVC 10" will work on this Kenwood amp. This amp is rated at about 500 watts RMS @ 1 ohm loads. As for wiring the coils for a net 1 ohm, here's our wiring wizard for your needs:
http://img8.imageshack.us/my.php?image=1dvcparallel1yl.jpg
Seems like the right time to buy and SWR as your present sub is crapping out and fixing it to last is not an easy task. A few things that causes this type of failure are:
1. Too large a box
2. Amp gain settings are incorrect
3. Too much bass boost used
4. Amp distortion is high and damaged the sub (1-3 will cause this)
The SWR 1022D is a good choice for this amp as it is 1 ohm stable and nets ~500 watts RMS at 1 ohm. (Good match here) However, your sealed enclosure needs to be measured so you have the proper internal airspace to make this sub sound its best.
In this case, recommended sealed range is 0.5 - 0.8 ft^3. (cubic feet air space) For best SQL performance, the optimal range is 0.65 ft^3, (+/- 0.05 ft^3) Do you know the internal air space of this box now? If not, need to measure it internally so we can determine what to do next.
We need to know the following external measurements for Rectangle or Cube box dimensions:
Height:
Width:
Depth:
Board thickness:
If this is a wedge design, we need these details:
Height 1
Height 2
Width:
Depth:
Board thickness:
Once we know these parameters, then we can calculate the inner dimensions for you and recommend and adjustments as needed.
FYI: The sub displacement is 0.05 ft^3 for this sub.
About battery upgrades, the Optima Yellow Top, (Deep Cycle) is a very good choice to both start your car and power the amps. Here, you'll want a model that can deliver ~700 CCA's. (Cold Cranking Amperes) As Kit mentioned, this Gel Cell is superior to OEM, (Factory) batteries. These do not need fluids, can be run down to dead >300 cycles and last much longer than typical lead-acid batteries. (Run an OEM battery to dead about 3-5 cycles and it's trashed)
Finally, do you have access to a Multimeter? (AC/DC voltage, amperes, Ohms tester) This is an inexpensive diagnostics tool and can be used for many things. Any serious DIY'er will have one on hand for the many things it can do. When setting amp gains, the sub amp should measure 22 volts AC into a 1 ohm sub load. (500 watts continous) Will give more details later OK?
Comments?
Swez
Replies (32)
ace23 on 10/10/2007 18:10:00
personally i believe that a bigger amp always makes much more of a difference than swithcing a sub unless if your planning on switching the enclosure that sub is in or getting a bigger sub. i dont think by swithching a sub your gonna get much louder you'll prolly just get better sound quality but then again that also depends in the type of enclosure the sub is in. hope that helps you a lil bit
cplkittle on 10/10/2007 19:15:44
ported box instead of sealed
a more efficient sub
If you change the sub, the amplifier output has to match the wattage needed for the sub. If you buy a bigger amplifier, the sub has to be able to handle it.
gsandha99 on 10/10/2007 19:42:03
thanks guys....i dont wanna change to ported just because i like the sound of a sealed much more.....maybe a more efficient sub...any suggestions.? something decent in price?
cplkittle on 10/10/2007 19:57:19
amp specs:
Maximum Output Power (14.4V): 1000W
Rated Output Power (14.4V)
200W at 20-200Hz 0.5%THD (4 Ohms)
400W at 100Hz 0.5% THD (2 Ohms)
500W at 100Hz 1.0%THD (1 Ohms)
notice they are rated at 100Hz, most people don't want to hear anything above 80Hz from a sub.
This is not a 1000 watt amplifier. it has a 40 amp fuse
let's do some math
40 amps x 14.4 volts = 576
class D amplifiers are 80% efficient so let's subtract 20% = 460
RMS is 70% of max, so 70% of 460 is 322.5
This amplifier is actually 322.5 watts RMS, 460 watts peak at 1 ohm.
Now we can better choose a sub.
try this for example:
Powerbass XL-10D 300w RMS, 600 watts peak, 91dB1w/1m
http://www.powerbassusa.com/products/subwoofers/xl_subwoofers.html
gsandha99 on 10/10/2007 20:08:00
nice...so how do i know if i am pumping 14.4...im pretty sure my battery is 12v...correct? also...if we dont want to hear anything above 80hz, does that mean that the rated power is below what is actually being pumped? also...i guess the type S isnt the greatest of all subs...am i right....i am heading to a dealer who carries Hertz and JL subs....i think im gonna choose one of them...any suggestions?
cplkittle on 10/10/2007 20:25:55
type S subs are not bad. One of the cleanest sounding systems I have ever put together had 2 type S 10's.
The battery usually rests at 12-12.4 volts. The alternator puts out anywhere from 13-14.4 volts when the engine is running.
Even though the kenwood amp is overrated, I do give them props for listing the frequency in which they attained the output peak.
Your situation is a common one. You want more bass. The upgrades and more efficient sub will only give you a little more of what you are wanting. One month from now, you will get used to it again and that craving for more will come back. You are doing the right thing though by asking questions and trying to understand how to meet your needs.
If I had to guess, I would say that you are not going to be happy unless you add a second sub and upgrade to an amplifier that can handle both.
Ash on 10/10/2007 20:27:06
In order to get more volume from that amp you will need to upgrade to a pair of efficient 4 ohm subs that will match that amp in power (200rms each). Which Type S do you have? Single voice coil, dual, 2 or 4 ohm load per coil? Give the model # and we can give you a more definitive answer.
Cplkittle is right on with the ported. That would be the quickest and cheapest way and will net another 3db especially in the lower range. That amp is equipped with a subsonic filter and is capable of running that configuration. Not a bad option at all!
However, since you prefer sealed, only runnning a pair with the same efficiency of the Alpine or better will net you at least another 3 DB which is equivalent to a doubling in power. The con in more efficient speakers is the larger amount of airspace they require.
Box volume also will play a role in this as well. As we go larger in volume trying to play deeper notes, you will lose overall Spl. Smaller less bottom end, but more impact and more robust bass. Staying with a mid Q around .8 - .9 is ideal for auto sound. Depending on an individual tastes Qtc's around 1 works okay too with more output.
400 watts rms isn't bad if you can use efficient subs to convert it to sound properly, Going higher in power will not necessarily give more output unless it is a considerable increase (700- 800 rms). Still cheaper to do a pair of subs than have to reconfigure amp and subs altogether.
gsandha99 on 10/10/2007 20:33:10
hmm...this is more complicated that i thought...its a single voice coil, 4ohm.....so...i guess the next best option is upgrade sub..or add another...which includes changing the box..which i dont want to do because of space constraints...ill go to the my dealer on friday...do some tests...and let you guys know what i come up with...thanks for all the advice...oh...and im gettin the big 3 done baby! 8awg ok for that?
Ash on 10/10/2007 20:34:43
Use 4 awg to be sure.
Exactly how much space do you have available?
gsandha99 on 10/10/2007 20:35:56
ok...sounds good.....do you know where i can set the gain on a MC245 soundstream 4 channel amp by any chance?
Ash on 10/10/2007 20:41:25
It needs to be matched to the output voltage of whatever source is feeding it. That can also depend on the power handling capabilities of the speakers it's running.
swez on 10/11/2007 00:45:14
All good inputs here. Looked back at your Type S, it is a 4 ohm SVC sub and very low efficiency in a sealed box. A more efficient sub in a well matched enclosure would allow this amp to give more bass.
The Alpine SWR -1022D is a good step up in power handling, great SQ in a small sealed box, (0.7 cf) and can be wired for 1 ohm loads. The only drawback here, this sub is low efficiency too. A ported box would add +3dB more SPL near the tuning frequency and would not be a bad consideration. (Figure about 425-450 watts RMS from this amp at 1 ohm) That's not bad, but a more efficient sub choice would give more SPL from this modestly rated amp. (Say, 88dB SPL @ 2.83 volts or a tad more)
http://www.crutchfield.com/S-kcNtnM2yPzZ/App/Product/Item/Main.aspx?g=520&i=500SWR1022&tp=111
JL subs are also a great SQL sub. However, they are low efficiency and very expensive at retail prices.
Your 4 channel amp is a great little amp and if using aftermarket speakers with good efficiency would make a huge improvement over cheap stock speakers. To get even more power from this amp, consider 2 ohm speakers/channel in front, 4 ohm Coaxials in back.
Swez
gsandha99 on 10/11/2007 11:13:34
WIll my Kenwood amp be able to handle a 1 ohm load? and also...how would you wire the SWR - 1022D to handle a one ohm load? Any other suggestions for subs which are high efficiency in sealed enclosures? i really hate ported...:) and ive got JBL's running off my 4 channel...they sound great :). thanks for any input guys...this site is awesome.
gsandha99 on 10/11/2007 11:16:43
Also, would my kenwood be able to pump the Type R? it seems really power hungry
Ash on 10/11/2007 15:22:37
According to the specs within the manual, (unless I looked at the wrong one) that amp is only 2ohm stable. Still not bad....
One problem I forsee here is that you want to save space, but still get more output through an efficient sub. Unfortunately, that's just not how it works as the more efficient the sub, the bigger the box it will require (usually). It's either that or be prepared to give up some low end output or. You can't have all 3 (Hoffman's iron law).
gsandha99 on 10/11/2007 16:20:02
that makes sense...i think i will go ahaead and purchase a dual voice coil sub as it will be handle more wattage which the amp will produce.
ace23 on 10/11/2007 16:58:56
have you thought about getting shallow mounting subs i now pioneer and kicker offer them. it sounds like you really want to save space so you might want to look in that direction just an idea.
gsandha99 on 10/11/2007 17:30:38
I am going to purchase a SWR1021D...its a 2ohm + 2ohm......so does that mean that i can only wire it to 1ohm or 4ohms? or can i still wire it to get a 2ohm. Because my amp is the KAC 8101D as mentioned above..the best performance would be at a 2ohm load since my amp will not be stable at 1ohm.....and how would i wire it to get a 2ohm load? please advise!
ace23 on 10/11/2007 18:07:30
you can only get a 1 ohm or 4 ohm load out of this sub which isnt the best for your amp. you would have to wire it to 4 ohms becouse of your 2 ohm amp if you wire down to 1 this could end up frying your amp which isnt good. and no you cant get a 2 ohm load out of this sub
ace23 on 10/11/2007 18:11:03
if your going to get the type r i suggest you getting the SWR-1242D this is the sub you want to get. its a duel 4 ohm sub which means you can wire down to 2 ohms which will benefit your amp becouse it puts out the most at 2 ohms
cplkittle on 10/11/2007 22:52:15
The amplifier is 1 ohm stable according to the manual from kenwood:
http://manuals.kenwood.novenaweb.info/languages/EN/support/manuals/KAC-8151D.pdf
The 8151 and the 8101 apparently have the same manual
this is directly from the manual:
Audio Section
Max Power Output ..........................................................................................................1000 W กม 1
Rated Power Output
4 ohms 200w x 1
2 ohms 400w x 1
1 ohm 500w x 1
gsandha99 on 10/12/2007 01:56:12
but i wonder if that is just the listing...as in..just telling that at 1ohm the sub would be putting out this much....how do we know if it is 1ohm stable for sure? should it not list it at all? dont all amps list 1ohm readings regardless of whether they can support it or not?
cplkittle on 10/12/2007 10:16:18
no, if they are not stable at 1 ohm, they will not list an output for that resistance.
If they give an output for 1 ohm, it will work at 1 ohm.
gsandha99 on 10/12/2007 11:54:22
omg...man..thanks...i was hoping it would...im drooling...and i think i might wet myself....i am going to purchase the Type R dvc 2ohm on saturday...its gonna sound loud...anyone have a diagram for how to wire a 2ohm+2ohm sub to produce 1ohm for me?
cplkittle on 10/12/2007 13:36:29
all positive terminals to the positive on the amp
all negative terminals to the negative on the amp
this is called parallel wiring, and will give you a 1 ohm load.
gsandha99 on 10/12/2007 13:54:43
awesome...saturday cant come any slower...
gsandha99 on 10/12/2007 13:55:11
what are your guys thoughts on a yellow top?
cplkittle on 10/12/2007 14:19:31
yellow tops are great.
I have one, and it helps alot! Also, if you leave the lights on all night or run the battery down to nothing with the stereo, just turn everything off for 2 or 3 hours and the battery magically rejuvenates itself to a point, and you can crank your car again. It's like the batteries in an old flashlight that you run down. Pick it up a day later and it has power again. Plus you can almost completely discharge a dry cell or gel cell 50+ times before significant damage is done. Discharge a wetcell car battery twice and it is gone.
yeah I like them.
gsandha99 on 10/12/2007 15:05:59
wow...nice....are they pricey? i think in canada they are about 275...i might have to make a trip down to the states if they are much cheaper
gsandha99 on 10/13/2007 00:37:46
alright guys....some news......my sub current type S has passed away...welll...kinda...it comes back from time to time....it has been dieing lately...and if i push on the cone...it will start working....so im guessing it has something to do with a lose connecting in the woofer terminals...because when i push it in...it will flutter and sort of work...and if i take it out of the box...and play with the wires..it will start working again...this is ok..because im gettin the type R tommorrow...and wiring it at 1ohm anyways...so it should be fine...i thought it could be the amp....but ive ruled that out....anyways..hopefully running my amp at 1ohm will be ok....it says it can handle it soo....can we trust kenwood? i guess we gotta find out.....wierd how the sub died on me though..i was gonna sell it...oh well
SQLThump on 10/13/2007 02:29:12
Your sub has more than likely lost a connection under the dustcap. When you can push the cone in and get some response, this is usually caused by something hanging on by a thread.
I guess you probably don't care to fix it since you are getting a new sub, but keep in mind that there is always a reason why things like this happen. This was probably caused by overexcursion, and causes off that include poorly macthed enclosures and subs, overpowering, or poorly matched bass boost and gain.
Be extra careful when you install your fresh new Type-R, becaues it really sucks when history repeats itself.
swez on 10/13/2007 07:27:04
Wow, a lot of fresh threads this week... all good inputs too.
Yes, an Alpine 2+2 DVC 10" will work on this Kenwood amp. This amp is rated at about 500 watts RMS @ 1 ohm loads. As for wiring the coils for a net 1 ohm, here's our wiring wizard for your needs:
http://img8.imageshack.us/my.php?image=1dvcparallel1yl.jpg
Seems like the right time to buy and SWR as your present sub is crapping out and fixing it to last is not an easy task. A few things that causes this type of failure are:
1. Too large a box
2. Amp gain settings are incorrect
3. Too much bass boost used
4. Amp distortion is high and damaged the sub (1-3 will cause this)
The SWR 1022D is a good choice for this amp as it is 1 ohm stable and nets ~500 watts RMS at 1 ohm. (Good match here) However, your sealed enclosure needs to be measured so you have the proper internal airspace to make this sub sound its best.
In this case, recommended sealed range is 0.5 - 0.8 ft^3. (cubic feet air space) For best SQL performance, the optimal range is 0.65 ft^3, (+/- 0.05 ft^3) Do you know the internal air space of this box now? If not, need to measure it internally so we can determine what to do next.
We need to know the following external measurements for Rectangle or Cube box dimensions:
Height:
Width:
Depth:
Board thickness:
If this is a wedge design, we need these details:
Height 1
Height 2
Width:
Depth:
Board thickness:
Once we know these parameters, then we can calculate the inner dimensions for you and recommend and adjustments as needed.
FYI: The sub displacement is 0.05 ft^3 for this sub.
About battery upgrades, the Optima Yellow Top, (Deep Cycle) is a very good choice to both start your car and power the amps. Here, you'll want a model that can deliver ~700 CCA's. (Cold Cranking Amperes) As Kit mentioned, this Gel Cell is superior to OEM, (Factory) batteries. These do not need fluids, can be run down to dead >300 cycles and last much longer than typical lead-acid batteries. (Run an OEM battery to dead about 3-5 cycles and it's trashed)
Finally, do you have access to a Multimeter? (AC/DC voltage, amperes, Ohms tester) This is an inexpensive diagnostics tool and can be used for many things. Any serious DIY'er will have one on hand for the many things it can do. When setting amp gains, the sub amp should measure 22 volts AC into a 1 ohm sub load. (500 watts continous) Will give more details later OK?
Comments?
Swez
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