Am doing up a Honda CRV 2007 for a client.
need to upgrade electricals with an additional battery and big 3 upgrade.
the only problem or doubt in my mind is..
this car has a ECU inbetween the alt and the battery, to control the functioning of the alt. to start and stop it when required.
the honda tech says that the warranty on ECU will void if the wire is changed.
My question here is , with a 0/1 gauge wire , would there actually be a problem to the ECU...?? i dont think there should be one... but when the honda tech talks about void warranty i dont wanna hurt my clients pocket ever in future too...
Help required urgently....
Thanks in advance..
regards..
Victor...
Replies (8)
swez on 10/4/2007 06:16:25
Tough call here Victor. Many new car warranty plans are in jeopardy when major electrical changes are made by non-dealer techs.
ECU??? Is this some kind of Engine Control computer device? It makes sense to see a computer chip that monitors ALT performance and regulate current flow demands, but the last word is the dealerships judgement.
If this were a work truck and needed mods to haul a large work trailer, that might fly, but in a personal car like the one mentioned, that's a whole different story. Try contacting another dealership to at least verify this story. If you hear the same thing from another tech, your client is taking a risk that may void his warranty and needs to know that in advance.
Good luck bro,
Swez
cplkittle on 10/4/2007 12:04:08
I have seen current sensors on a few cars that encase a portion of the alt to battery wire. I just ran new wire through them. You have to be careful though when it comes to factory warranties.
I would let the owner decide
Victor on 10/4/2007 16:09:29
i agree... let the owner decide...
but technically... do u see a reason to void the warranty... just for changing a 12 gauge wire to a 0/1 gauge wire...???
swez on 10/4/2007 18:24:50
Yes and No on this one Vic...
On the technical side, larger wires promote better current flow and less resistance are always a good thing.
On the other side of this coin, many of us don't trust dealerships and mechanics in general for a good reason... "They rip peeps off" if they can get away with it. (All too common in the USA, maybe not so much in India?)
That door swings the other way too. Mechanics don't look well on the typical DIY'er because they often have to fix what the DIY'er screwed up. Yes, they get paid well to do this, but still.... there is a lot of idiots that try to fix complex cars and don't know a hammer from a screw driver.
I trust you know the score and how to do this. However, let the client make that call.
Swez
cplkittle on 10/4/2007 23:07:41
The only thing I was concerned with was the loss of signal of current flow because of the different thickness of the wire's insulation. This could throw off the current reading and cause some damage. Especially with the sensitive and low quality electronics car manufacturers use today.
Victor on 10/5/2007 02:44:56
The better side to this is, that I am not going to do this upgrade...
We are getting this done at the Honda dealership , from where my client is buying the car..
everything from the big 3, to adding another batt, to opening up the dash and adding the loc interface etc.....
i am just sending them the instructions and diagrams along with the product to use.
so they will be building the initial foundation. this will insure that its the Honda tech who has done this and it would not void any warranty..no opening of HU console or the dash...this anyways has an in dash 6 cd mp3 changer, which shall stay there as the HU,
shall be adding EQ, amps, subs and speakers only..
once the car comes in on the 12th of this month, then my work shall start of designing, fabricating and installing.
all wires and the 2nd battery, also the loc rca outs are done. but the Honda tech called me up saying that the only wire left to upgrade is the alt to battery , cause it has a ECU in between, and according to the Honda guide book it voids the warranty of the ECU if it is messed up with.
now i just need to advocate a case where will have to convince them that its merely a wire upgrade and nothing can harm the ECU, and if by any chance something happens to the ECU in future it will not be cause of the wire upgrade so the warranty would still stand..
i am not touching a single wire here, before delivering the car the Honda tech themselves will be doing this for us.
Victor..
Sorry for not elaborating this situation in the first post itself.
jamesp on 10/5/2007 10:31:40
Here in the states, we have the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act to help us as consumers to not be denied warranty service for things like using the oil brand of our choice or aftermarket products on or in our vehicles. Harley Davidson dealers have been known to tell customers that using other than thier branded products will void warranties....not now, since 1975 we have been protected from these practices.
We do the big 3 wiring upgrade on our Harleys all the time. When we increase performance, often a more powerful starter must be used to turn the motor over and this requires a wiring upgrade.
The burden of proof is on the dealer to PROVE that an aftermarket item caused the failure of any component that they try to deny warranty coverage for.They cant void your warranty for a cam upgrade when the 6 speed transmission fails. Any lubricants the meet the specified engineering requirements can be used while maintaining the full warranty.
This act has saved consumers billions of dollars since it was put into place and I have had to point it out to a few dealers over the years that tried to take advantage of a consumer.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnuson-Moss_Warranty_Act
cplkittle on 10/5/2007 10:38:52
very interesting article, James. I knew there was a law, but did not know its name or what all it covered.
kudos for sharing that.
need to upgrade electricals with an additional battery and big 3 upgrade.
the only problem or doubt in my mind is..
this car has a ECU inbetween the alt and the battery, to control the functioning of the alt. to start and stop it when required.
the honda tech says that the warranty on ECU will void if the wire is changed.
My question here is , with a 0/1 gauge wire , would there actually be a problem to the ECU...?? i dont think there should be one... but when the honda tech talks about void warranty i dont wanna hurt my clients pocket ever in future too...
Help required urgently....
Thanks in advance..
regards..
Victor...
Replies (8)
swez on 10/4/2007 06:16:25
Tough call here Victor. Many new car warranty plans are in jeopardy when major electrical changes are made by non-dealer techs.
ECU??? Is this some kind of Engine Control computer device? It makes sense to see a computer chip that monitors ALT performance and regulate current flow demands, but the last word is the dealerships judgement.
If this were a work truck and needed mods to haul a large work trailer, that might fly, but in a personal car like the one mentioned, that's a whole different story. Try contacting another dealership to at least verify this story. If you hear the same thing from another tech, your client is taking a risk that may void his warranty and needs to know that in advance.
Good luck bro,
Swez
cplkittle on 10/4/2007 12:04:08
I have seen current sensors on a few cars that encase a portion of the alt to battery wire. I just ran new wire through them. You have to be careful though when it comes to factory warranties.
I would let the owner decide
Victor on 10/4/2007 16:09:29
i agree... let the owner decide...
but technically... do u see a reason to void the warranty... just for changing a 12 gauge wire to a 0/1 gauge wire...???
swez on 10/4/2007 18:24:50
Yes and No on this one Vic...
On the technical side, larger wires promote better current flow and less resistance are always a good thing.
On the other side of this coin, many of us don't trust dealerships and mechanics in general for a good reason... "They rip peeps off" if they can get away with it. (All too common in the USA, maybe not so much in India?)
That door swings the other way too. Mechanics don't look well on the typical DIY'er because they often have to fix what the DIY'er screwed up. Yes, they get paid well to do this, but still.... there is a lot of idiots that try to fix complex cars and don't know a hammer from a screw driver.
I trust you know the score and how to do this. However, let the client make that call.
Swez
cplkittle on 10/4/2007 23:07:41
The only thing I was concerned with was the loss of signal of current flow because of the different thickness of the wire's insulation. This could throw off the current reading and cause some damage. Especially with the sensitive and low quality electronics car manufacturers use today.
Victor on 10/5/2007 02:44:56
The better side to this is, that I am not going to do this upgrade...
We are getting this done at the Honda dealership , from where my client is buying the car..
everything from the big 3, to adding another batt, to opening up the dash and adding the loc interface etc.....
i am just sending them the instructions and diagrams along with the product to use.
so they will be building the initial foundation. this will insure that its the Honda tech who has done this and it would not void any warranty..no opening of HU console or the dash...this anyways has an in dash 6 cd mp3 changer, which shall stay there as the HU,
shall be adding EQ, amps, subs and speakers only..
once the car comes in on the 12th of this month, then my work shall start of designing, fabricating and installing.
all wires and the 2nd battery, also the loc rca outs are done. but the Honda tech called me up saying that the only wire left to upgrade is the alt to battery , cause it has a ECU in between, and according to the Honda guide book it voids the warranty of the ECU if it is messed up with.
now i just need to advocate a case where will have to convince them that its merely a wire upgrade and nothing can harm the ECU, and if by any chance something happens to the ECU in future it will not be cause of the wire upgrade so the warranty would still stand..
i am not touching a single wire here, before delivering the car the Honda tech themselves will be doing this for us.
Victor..
Sorry for not elaborating this situation in the first post itself.
jamesp on 10/5/2007 10:31:40
Here in the states, we have the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act to help us as consumers to not be denied warranty service for things like using the oil brand of our choice or aftermarket products on or in our vehicles. Harley Davidson dealers have been known to tell customers that using other than thier branded products will void warranties....not now, since 1975 we have been protected from these practices.
We do the big 3 wiring upgrade on our Harleys all the time. When we increase performance, often a more powerful starter must be used to turn the motor over and this requires a wiring upgrade.
The burden of proof is on the dealer to PROVE that an aftermarket item caused the failure of any component that they try to deny warranty coverage for.They cant void your warranty for a cam upgrade when the 6 speed transmission fails. Any lubricants the meet the specified engineering requirements can be used while maintaining the full warranty.
This act has saved consumers billions of dollars since it was put into place and I have had to point it out to a few dealers over the years that tried to take advantage of a consumer.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnuson-Moss_Warranty_Act
cplkittle on 10/5/2007 10:38:52
very interesting article, James. I knew there was a law, but did not know its name or what all it covered.
kudos for sharing that.
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