I am new to aftermarket car audio and was wondering (after reading how to build an ideal audio system by Victor) what exactly to look for, feature wise, when buying a head unit. Thanx GRIN
AKjeepXJ
Replies (36)
kirchatndftbl on 07/25/2007 14:47:32
welcome to CK!
what kind of features are you looking for in a HU???
mp3 compatible, ipod rdy???? etc......
how much are you looking to spend??
say a little more and everyone here will be glad to help
AKjeepXJ on 07/25/2007 14:59:15
I want to be able to plug my ipod into it and i don't want to spend more than $200. Doesn't really have to have a CD player because i have all my music on my ipod. And it would be cool to have a detachable face but i guess that's not really necessary.
Ender2 on 07/25/2007 15:11:35
A few other things to consider when buying an after market Head Unit;
Equalizer; this is the quint-essential for all audio Buffs. Look for a 7 or 9 band Equalizer if you really want to have control over the entire frequency spectrum, BE CAREFUL when buying head units with small, or no EQ; my brother has one thats just "low, mid, and high"
Also make sure that it has the appropriate inputs and outputs you need. A single RCA output would probably not be beneficial if you're planning to run 2 amplifiers. If you do want to hook up your ipod, you'll either want an "Auxilliary input" in the back with an adapter to 3.5mm, or you'll just want a straight 3.5mm jack in the front.
Other than that, if you're just planning to use this to run your current factory speakers, make sure the Head Unit runs about 15-20w RMS per channel, don't take the rated 50x4 Watts label that's probably posted on the box. Ask your sales representative if he knows how much RMS Wattage the HU puts out per channel.
Other than that, make sure that you buy a Wiring Harness for your particular vehicle as you'll need to splice your wires into it and connect to your HU. Make sure to do a good quality wire tie job, or splice and tape well, also wouldn't be a bad idea to label each of your wires. Don't neglect the ground either. (this will look like a set of bare steal wires that run into the interior of the car.)
AKjeepXJ on 07/25/2007 17:57:06
what is a brand and model would you guys recommend?
Victor on 07/25/2007 18:05:34
There are HU's starting from a mere $50 to a $5000 mark.... put more honey and u can make it sweeter....
what are u aiming at...? what is your aimed purpose of use..? are u going to have an elaborate system to go with the HU, do u need upgrade options..?? are u looking to drive some external amplifiers now or later...?? are you too Sound Quality conscious that you wud pay more to get some detailed fine tuning options..??
all this along with the amount of honey u wanna put in to make it sweeter will help us help you decide what would best meet your needs...
Just for reference.. look at reputed manufacturers like
( alphabetically)
Alpine, Blaupunkt, Clarion, Eclipse, Kenwood, Nakamichi, Mchintosh, Panasonic, Pioneer Premier.
Welcome to CK...COFFEE...
CK is a bunch of highly qualified guys in terms of experience and knowledge you could find for free on the internet...
you can extract amazing quantity of tech know how from this group of golds and a few very active members who are learning pretty fast... a lot of visitors who keep us updated with a lot of new info too...
have fun, make the best u can out of CK .. though u can never make enuf out of it....
Victor...
Ps: Ck is a PG site ... GRIN just incase.....
AKjeepXJ on 07/25/2007 18:49:20
well my jeeps sound system is almost non-existent. It only has one working speaker that is very crackly, so i decided to upgrade. so far i have 2 15" Kicker Comp VR's and just bought a 2400 watt 4channel amp to power them. i want to be able to adjust the treble, bass, and sub woofer levels with the HU. i would like to have clear sound without bustin' the bank. i will be buying another amp soon to power the door speakers and tweeters which i also still have to buy. Like i said, i'm new to this and would like to get your guys opinions on which direction i should head nextGRIN
swez on 07/25/2007 22:47:29
OK, you've already been conned once... "just bought a 2400 watt 4channel amp".
If this were a true 2400 watt RMS amp, your jeep would not be able to power it properly w/o major electrical upgrades as the current draw would be huge. This sounds like a Legacy amp brand or similar low quality brand. (But it may be usable for your mids and highs though)
What is the make and model # of your 4 channel amp?
Also, if this is a jeep that has soft side and top like a CJ-7, it will act like an audio sieve. No containment of sound and lots of outside noise to deal with too. If you have a small SUV type jeep, it's easier to keep good sound inside the vehicle and have a very nice setup when done.
May I suggest you try to outline what your ultimate sound system goals are for this project and then set aside some cash to buy things as you can afford them. This is thinking long term so that you will not waste money on junk that will have to be replaced later. That means decent quality speakers, a usable HU, decent amps to power your speakers and subs too.
Welcome to CK... we seem to have caught you before any major buying mistakes have come into the game. We'll give you some great ideas and tips on installing gear you buy later too. But avoid rushing the process and setting a very low budget as well. This will only lead to spending more later when the cheap gear fails to satisfy or craps out on you.
Comments?
Swez
PS What model/year Jeep is this? Jeeps are tough for secuity issues too. If they are soft sides, it is so easy to steal what you have. Keep that in mind as you go.
AKjeepXJ on 07/25/2007 23:43:07
Quantum Audio Cozmik series QCA4300 2,400 watt 4 channel car amplifier. I got it off of ebay.
So what kind of amp will i need to power my subs?
The jeep i have is '94 Cherokee
Ender2 on 07/26/2007 00:15:15
Will need specific model numbers on your Kicker Comp VR's to determine which amp you'll need. They could be the CompVR CVR154, which are 4 ohm DVCs, or they could be the 2 ohm DVC's. This certainly matters when determining which amp you should buy.
As far as your Cozmik amp;
http://www.quantumaudio.net/cozmik-amp.html
It says it will do 4x300 watts @ 4 ohm, at 14.4v. Or 4x600w at 2 ohm (14.4v).
I'd be these are peak power ratings, and are in actuality not even close to what the amp will do realistically. But I'm sure you could get somewhere around 50wRMS x4 @4 ohm which would be plenty of power for a good couple pairs of component speakers.
In regard to your initial post;
It seems quite obvious that you will be using 1 or 2 amplifiers (one for your 4 channel component speakers, or possible 3-ways, and one for your bass engine, Kickers 15's.)
which means you'll either need 2 pair of Preamp outputs on your head unit, or you'll need to make sure your 4 channel has an auxiliary Sub Output to run a set of RCA's. Looking at an up close picture of your 4-channel amp, I do see a set of output jacks that can be ran to your sub amp; so no worries here, my suggestion for a head unit is as follows;
~ 7 or 9 Band Equalizer
~ 1or 2 Preamp output
~ MP3 Playback
~ Ipod Compatibility (if you have an ipod, and nowadays, who doesn't?)
~ Detatchable faceplate (if this is a soft top roof this will be essential to remove to deter theft.)
Go ahead and plan on running a 2 gauge wire from the Hood to a distribution block in the back, and 4 gauge from there to your amps. A fuse big enough to just barely exceed what's inside both of your amps less than a foot from your battery under the hood, and two more fuses after the Dblock just before your amps to provide maximum safety, always better to blow a fuse than an amplifier.
You will probably also want to consider an after market Alternator and battery to deal with the kind of power you'll need to satisfy 500wRMS per kicker sub if you plan to achieve their maximum potential. I see a possible 1,200wRMS setup here.
Hope that wasn't too much to take in.
Questions/Concerns/Comments?
I have AIM if you'd like to chat, sometimes you just want answers now. ;) Screen name is DruidEnder
AKjeepXJ on 07/26/2007 01:02:46
I can't thank all you guys enough for the information you guys have given me so far. The subs have got to be the CVR15-4's because on the back they say Dual 4 Ohm Voice Coils and i did a google image search on the model number
AKjeepXJ on 07/26/2007 01:03:08
kirchatndftbl on 07/26/2007 09:52:43
http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_9551_Hifonics+TXi1008D.html
that amp would be a good match for your subs
wire subs all in parrellel for a net 1 ohm load
1000rms @ 1 ohm
(HU)
http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_8566_JVC+KD-PDR30.html
swez on 07/26/2007 11:25:50
What are the fuse values in that Quantum QCA4300 4 channel amp? This amp should be very good for your full range speakers when you get to that point. It can power the subs mentioned, but a Class D sub amp would be more efficient.
The Kicker subs will do well with the HiFonics amp noted earlier. Hifonics TXi1008D
Cherokee is a good vehicle to work with audio wise. Whew... am glad it was not a soft shell Jeep.
Looks like the guys are pretty well on this one and you have plenty of good help coming in. That's cool and the suggestions are very good as well.
As for wiring needs, it looks like your best bet is #2 gage power line and a Distribution block that splits a #4 to your sub amp and a #4 or #8 line for your Quantum 4 channel. It's difficult to find #2 gage wire though. You may wish to use 1/0 gage and that will be large enough to handle most things you want to do now and in the future. Have used this vendor several times for hardware and found them very well priced, high quality and ships quickly too:
http://www.knukonceptz.com/
Swez
AKjeepXJ on 07/26/2007 13:57:36
It has a 60A fuse and this is the ebay sellers description of the amp:
The Quantum Audio Cozmik series QCA4300 2,400 watt 4 channel car amplifier has the nicest design we have seen. This is a class A/B amp so you can be sure the power is extremely efficient. This amp has a built in crossover network so you can use this amp for subs, or full range speakers.
This amp is way more powerful than the cheaper brands who rate there amps at 4,000 watts. These amps are rated and tested during production. Quantum is known to make great sounding amps. We guarantee you will not be let down by the performance of this amp. Just to prove to you that this amp is extremely powerful, take a look at the photos, and you can see this amp is equipped with a 60A fuse. The fuse rating is one of the best ways to see how powerful an amp is. 60A of fuse power is a lot!
We have tested these Quantum amps against some of the headliners in the industry such as Sony, Kenwood and Pioneer and these amps time over time outperform the competition. If you are looking for top of the line quality without overpaying this is definitely the amp for you and we guarantee you will be impressed with the performance. (We were blown away with how good these were when we tested them)
Other name brands spend a ton of money marketing there products, so you are not really getting what you are paying for. With Quantum you get way more than what you would pay for an amp at a similar price, labeled under a different brand name.
Features:
* 2,400 watts dynamic power
* Top of the line Components
* Heat Management System
* High Efficiency Mosfet Power Outputs
* Fully adjustable Built in Low Pass and high pass and full pass CrossOvers
* Bridgeable
* protect light
* Bass Remote Control
* Illuminated Logo
* Class A/B
* frequency response: 20-28KHz
* 2 x 1200 Watts @ 4 ohms
* 4 x 300 Watts @ 4 ohms
* 4 x 600 Watts @ 2ohms
* 60A Fuse
* S/N Ratio: Greater than 95 dB
* Input voltage: 11 - 14.4 volts
* Adjustable Input sensitivity: .2 MV - 5V
* bass boost control @ 45 hz - 12 dB
* dimensions: 15.75" x 2" x 11.5" inches
swez on 07/26/2007 15:02:09
Not too bad... this amp is able to deliver about 80 watts RMS x 4 at 4 ohm speaker loads. (Even more power... ~120 watts RMS, if you are using 2 ohm speakers)
Tech Tip: We look for "RMS or Continous Power" ratings on amps. Peak watts or Peak to Peak wattage ratings are meaningless. This amp is rated at Peak to Peak power rating @ 2 & 4 ohms. These numbers are totally bogus! The specs from seller are fabricated hype, not real world numbers.
This is not a bad amp and should serve you well to drive mids and highs very well. At full power, anticipate a current draw of about 35-45 amperes of current. (Pretty strong current draw for sure)
If you opt for the HiFonics amp mentioned earlier, electrical upgrades will be needed for your jeep. We can walk you through some option when you are ready for that step.
Do you know the ALT specs on this Cherokee? If it is close to 140 amperes peak output, it may work fine with a few add ons.
Swez
AKjeepXJ on 07/26/2007 22:30:22
i've been looking for the alternator specs for my jeep and i haven't had any luck, but i will post when i do find them. If my alternator does put out close to 140 amps, what add-ons would i need?
swez on 07/26/2007 22:51:17
In this case, a High Output ALT would be most beneficial. If you have close to 140A's available in this jeep, (not likely) one option is to use a 2nd Battery and Battery Isolator kit to power the sub amp only. The full range amp can be handled off your stock electrical system.
The other upgrade would be larger gage power wires under the hood. It's often called the "Big 3 Upgrade" and you can get those details off our FAQ section on this board:
http://www.clubknowledge.com/cgi-bin/car_audio_faq/faq.cgi
Read the details, look at the install pictures and understand what is being done here. (Larger wires carry more power)
Call AutoZone or similar and ask the OEM specs for the ALT that comes with this Cherokee. They can also tell you if other H.O. version are offered in Aftermarket versions.
Hope that clarifies,
Swez
AKjeepXJ on 07/26/2007 23:35:34
On my back hatch it says "HIGH OUTPUT" if that means anything? I doubt that means the alternator
swez on 07/27/2007 00:49:36
Can't say for sure Jeep... if your jeep has a trailer towing package, that might work in your favor as most Class III/IV hitch packages have larger ALT's to accomodate electric braking systems on trailers.
Other than that, call a dealership, NAPA or other good autoparts stores and they can tell you what is typical stock based on:
Engine size
Vin # codes
Towing package upgrades
Worst case, go to a parts store and have them measure the output at idle and 2,500 RPM. Most larger chain store autoparts places can do this in the parking lot or repair bay for free. This will tell you exactly what you have to work with or around.
Swez
AKjeepXJ on 07/27/2007 01:52:05
Awesome i'll try and go to the auto store tomorrow and report back. ; )
jamesp on 07/27/2007 07:46:45
I believe the motor options in 94 were either a 2.5l or 4.0 l.
Both choices almost always came with a little 75/90 alternator.
There used to be a Bosche premium replacement alt at around 105A that was an inexpensive replacement. Other than that the usual high output aftermarket alts are available.
AKjeepXJ on 07/27/2007 12:59:35
well then i guess i will be getting a new alternator. i have the 4.0L. is the 105 amps at idle?
swez on 07/27/2007 16:07:43
No, at idle it's more like 60% of rated power. Full power is often above 2,000 RPM.
One option is to use a 2nd Battery and a Battery Isolator kit to power the sub amp only. The full range amp can be handled off your stock electrical system. That might be cheaper in the long run. The 2nd battery acts like a current storage buffer and is much more effective than any Surge Cap could ever be. Read this:
http://www.bcae1.com/battiso.htm
The solinoid version shown can be simplified to 1 solinoid device and 1 switch is used if we want the 2nd battery in the loop only when using the sub amp.
The Diode version is easy to use as well. The only drawback to the diode version, they have a slight voltage drop compared to the solinoid version and are generally more expensive too.
Swez
AKjeepXJ on 07/28/2007 12:12:56
I was looking at the HU posted by kirchatndftbl and was wondering if i should find one that has a better equalizer? it has a 3-band equalizer. should i try to find one that has a 7 or 9-band equalizer?
swez on 07/28/2007 13:42:49
There are 2 main options you can look at for more EQ functions and other HU features or, perhaps a cheaper, less complex HU:
1. Buy a more expensive HU with all the features you deem to be adequate. (This is often more expensive and the more features in the HU, the more opportunity for things to go wrong later)
2. Use a low budget HU with basic features and use an Add on EQ/Line Driver/w/Aux inputs
Take a good look at this option:
http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_6655_Clarion+EQS746.html#
Here, we can use a simple and basic HU and only need 1 pair of RCA outs. This EQ does the rest and provides 7 bands of EQ, 6 channels of outputs, (F/R/Sub outs) and an Aux input for your I-pod.
Note this EQ has a Line Driver and adjustable AUX gain control feature. This is very nice and low cost option w/o compromizing the functions needed. It has Master volume and a separate Sub volume feature and fade that are all independent and adjustable on the fly. (No menu surfing needed)
If your dash has a 1.5 - 2.0 Din opening, a 1 Din HU (Common) and this 1/2 Din EQ can be mounted in the dash pocket, be very compact and looks great too. The best part, all your mixing and EQ features are right there in the dash.
You'll use an RCA to 3.5mm patch cable for the I-Pod/Aux player. It's easy to run an external Aux jack off pigtailed wires or mount a 3.5 mm stereo phone jack in the dash, glove box or anywhere you wish.
Think it over. Have done this setup for a previous client and he loved the results. Looked great, everything was on the fly adjusting and no need to menu hop to adjust EQ settings or Sub volume.
This HU will do what you need and has the front panel AUX input too. It only has 1 RCA out and that is all you will need. Yes, this HU has 3 band EQ, but this can be ignored.
http://www.crutchfield.com/S-Y370CPACsbt/cgi-bin/ProdView.asp?g=300&I=105KDG230
Swez
Victor on 07/28/2007 16:54:51
http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_8934_Alpine+CDA-9883.html
http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_7974_Blaupunkt+Long+Beach+DVD35.html
http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_8787_Clarion+DXZ675USB.html
http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_8780_Kenwood+KDC-MP735U.html
http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_6618_Panasonic+MXE+CQ-C8403U.html
http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_9008_Pioneer+Premier+DEH-P690UB.html
These are about it... for a budget of around $200..... the links are alphabetically placed.... pick any and i am sure you would be more than happy with the performance and upgrade capabilities....
Victor..
AKjeepXJ on 07/29/2007 20:34:19
I think I'm gonna go with this HU and the clarion equalizer :
http://www.crutchfield.com/S-UXNFvF8vGNp/cgi-bin/prodview.asp?I=105KDG430&g=300&s=0&cc=01
swez on 07/30/2007 09:42:51
Think you'll be very pleased with the results on this option. This phase of the planning process can be set aside for now and move to the next stage.
Are you ready to discuss speakers for your Jeep now? From what I can tell, this Jeep has 5.25" rounds on the front doors, and 5.25" in back pillars and perhaps a set if 5.25" rounds in the tailgate too? (Please confirm) In this case, the speakers in the pillars would be a good option and delete the tailgate speakers as you will have subs. The tailgate speakers may prove useless with subs.
Also, that Quantum amp mentioned earlier, what are the fuse ratings used in it? Knowing that will help us determine the appropriate power ratings for your new speakers.
Once we get this phase locked down, then we'll address your sub amp needs.
Swez
PS This is the planning and research stage of the game. It's very important to do this phase well now as this will determine the outcome of the project later.
AKjeepXJ on 07/30/2007 12:29:08
yeah i have speakers in the front doors and back hatch, but i don't have any in my rear pillars or doors, but i was thinking about putting some in the rear doors as well as the front. the quantum amp has 60A fuses and according to DHL i should get it today.
swez on 07/30/2007 14:08:41
Back hatch location is out as you are using subs. The bass energy will bury a speaker located in the hatch door. A better option would be the pillars or rear doors.
This amp should deliver a solid 75 x 4 watts RMS w/ 4 ohm speakers and over 110 watts RMS x 4 @ 2 ohms. Pretty strong amp here after all. You'll be looking for some pretty stout door speakers to handle this amp. (75 watts RMS or higher per speaker)
Swez
PS Hope you amp comes in soon... getting a bit antsy?
AKjeepXJ on 07/31/2007 03:52:25
my amp came in today! and i just ordered my head unit and equalizer. got any speakers in mind?
Victor on 07/31/2007 08:45:12
Just a suggestion.. Sometimes its good to go through a couple of other parallel posts on CK.. it gives u a lot of information you could relate to your system too...
a lot of archived posts are very very informative as well...
Victor...
swez on 07/31/2007 10:35:42
Have been using JBL and Infinity speakers of late for installs. CDT is also a nice package as are Polks. (Fusion Audio seems to have some interesting offerings too, but harder to find)
Best I can tell, your jeep uses 5.25" rounds in front and back. It would be good to use 2-way Component speakers up front and coaxials in back. Try to use the same series for front and back if possible.
Front:
Infinity Reference 5020cs
Polk Audio MMC5250
JBL Grand Touring Series GTO507C
CDT AUDIO HD52
Back:
Infinity Kappa 50.7cs (F/B or both)
Polk/MOMO MMC525
CDT AUDIO CL50cv
There's a few very good selections to look at. Just do a Google search and see what pops up. Your best prices are likely to come from e-bay sellers.
Swez
JBL Grand Touring Series GTO527
AKjeepXJ on 08/16/2007 18:34:05
i chose some speakers that were cheaper for now. i now need help with wiring my system up. I've ran the power wire but have questions about how the HU connects to the clarion EQ and the amp.
To Recap
My head unit is
http://www.crutchfield.com/S-UXNFvF8vGNp/cgi-bin/prodview.asp?I=105KDG430&g=300&s=0&cc=01
it has two sets of RCA outs
LR front and
LR rear
it has speaker connections in the wireing harness
RR -+
LR -+
RF-+
LF-+
my EQ is
http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_6655_Clarion+EQS746.html#
it has 5 sets of RCA connections
Main In
Aux in RL
Front Out RL
Rear Out RL
Sub Out RL
the last component in my system is the QCA4200 Quantum Amp
http://quantumaudio.net/cozmik-amp.html
it has the following input outputs
Optional Line out to additional amp LR
front IN LR
Rear IN LR
4 speaker outputs -+ 4 ohm / 2 ohm minimum
or bridged
2 speaker outs -+ 8 ohm / 4 ohm min
Speakers
Two Kicker Dual Voice coil 15" 4 ohm
Two 6x9 "Dual" (brand name) 4 ohm 4 ways 50wrms from Schucks Auto
Two 6.5 rounds same brand 4 ohm also 4 ways 50wrms
which RCA goes to which
which speaker connections go to what speakers?
last question how does it all go to gether?
thanks in advance
swez on 08/16/2007 20:20:11
Last question... "I done thing so''...Somethings missing... the sub amp?
As it stands, you can use the 4 channel amp to power the front speakers and subs with this 4 channel amp and use the HU amps to
power the rear speakers for now. It's not optimal, but it will work OK for now.
Here's the wiring scheme to use for now:
HU..... LR/Front RCA's to Clarion Main Input RCA's
HU rear speaker outputs to rear speakers
Clarion..... LR/Front RCA outs to amp input channels 1 & 2. This channels will power your front speakers. The amp HPF's are set to ~80 Hz.
Clarion.....Sub outs to amp input channels 3 & 4. To power the subs noted, you have 2 options:
Option 1: The "Easy" button method
1. Wire Sub A coils in parallel for a net 2 ohms (parallel coils)
2. Wire Sub A to channel 3 on your amp
3. Wire sub B coils the same as before
4. Wire Sub B to channel 4 on your amp
5. Set the LPF on rear channels to ~80 Hz.
http://www.crutchfield.com/learningcenter/car/subwoofers_wiring.html?imageID=2DVC%5F4%2Dohm%5F2ch
Option 2: A bit more difficult
1. Bridge channels 3 & 4
2. Wire Sub A coils in series to get an 8 ohm load
3. Do the same with Sub B
4. Now, take wired the subs as shown and connect to amp rear channels as noted in link below
http://www.crutchfield.com/learningcenter/car/subwoofers_wiring.html?imageID=2DVC%5F4%2Dohm%5Fmono
NOTE: This picture shows a MONO sub amp. In your case, we are creating a MONO channel by combining channels 3 & 4. In most cases, channel 3 Pos terminal and Channel 4 Neg terminal are used only. Check your manual for exact instructions.
Tech Tip: Be sure to observe coil polarity carefully when wiring your subs.
Comments/
Swez
trunkisloud on 08/20/2007 00:17:39
you know ive seen a few quantum audio products on craigslist and i was wondering about the quality....i guess its like any other...depends on what level of the product you decide to go with.
AKjeepXJ
Replies (36)
kirchatndftbl on 07/25/2007 14:47:32
welcome to CK!
what kind of features are you looking for in a HU???
mp3 compatible, ipod rdy???? etc......
how much are you looking to spend??
say a little more and everyone here will be glad to help
AKjeepXJ on 07/25/2007 14:59:15
I want to be able to plug my ipod into it and i don't want to spend more than $200. Doesn't really have to have a CD player because i have all my music on my ipod. And it would be cool to have a detachable face but i guess that's not really necessary.
Ender2 on 07/25/2007 15:11:35
A few other things to consider when buying an after market Head Unit;
Equalizer; this is the quint-essential for all audio Buffs. Look for a 7 or 9 band Equalizer if you really want to have control over the entire frequency spectrum, BE CAREFUL when buying head units with small, or no EQ; my brother has one thats just "low, mid, and high"
Also make sure that it has the appropriate inputs and outputs you need. A single RCA output would probably not be beneficial if you're planning to run 2 amplifiers. If you do want to hook up your ipod, you'll either want an "Auxilliary input" in the back with an adapter to 3.5mm, or you'll just want a straight 3.5mm jack in the front.
Other than that, if you're just planning to use this to run your current factory speakers, make sure the Head Unit runs about 15-20w RMS per channel, don't take the rated 50x4 Watts label that's probably posted on the box. Ask your sales representative if he knows how much RMS Wattage the HU puts out per channel.
Other than that, make sure that you buy a Wiring Harness for your particular vehicle as you'll need to splice your wires into it and connect to your HU. Make sure to do a good quality wire tie job, or splice and tape well, also wouldn't be a bad idea to label each of your wires. Don't neglect the ground either. (this will look like a set of bare steal wires that run into the interior of the car.)
AKjeepXJ on 07/25/2007 17:57:06
what is a brand and model would you guys recommend?
Victor on 07/25/2007 18:05:34
There are HU's starting from a mere $50 to a $5000 mark.... put more honey and u can make it sweeter....
what are u aiming at...? what is your aimed purpose of use..? are u going to have an elaborate system to go with the HU, do u need upgrade options..?? are u looking to drive some external amplifiers now or later...?? are you too Sound Quality conscious that you wud pay more to get some detailed fine tuning options..??
all this along with the amount of honey u wanna put in to make it sweeter will help us help you decide what would best meet your needs...
Just for reference.. look at reputed manufacturers like
( alphabetically)
Alpine, Blaupunkt, Clarion, Eclipse, Kenwood, Nakamichi, Mchintosh, Panasonic, Pioneer Premier.
Welcome to CK...COFFEE...
CK is a bunch of highly qualified guys in terms of experience and knowledge you could find for free on the internet...
you can extract amazing quantity of tech know how from this group of golds and a few very active members who are learning pretty fast... a lot of visitors who keep us updated with a lot of new info too...
have fun, make the best u can out of CK .. though u can never make enuf out of it....
Victor...
Ps: Ck is a PG site ... GRIN just incase.....
AKjeepXJ on 07/25/2007 18:49:20
well my jeeps sound system is almost non-existent. It only has one working speaker that is very crackly, so i decided to upgrade. so far i have 2 15" Kicker Comp VR's and just bought a 2400 watt 4channel amp to power them. i want to be able to adjust the treble, bass, and sub woofer levels with the HU. i would like to have clear sound without bustin' the bank. i will be buying another amp soon to power the door speakers and tweeters which i also still have to buy. Like i said, i'm new to this and would like to get your guys opinions on which direction i should head nextGRIN
swez on 07/25/2007 22:47:29
OK, you've already been conned once... "just bought a 2400 watt 4channel amp".
If this were a true 2400 watt RMS amp, your jeep would not be able to power it properly w/o major electrical upgrades as the current draw would be huge. This sounds like a Legacy amp brand or similar low quality brand. (But it may be usable for your mids and highs though)
What is the make and model # of your 4 channel amp?
Also, if this is a jeep that has soft side and top like a CJ-7, it will act like an audio sieve. No containment of sound and lots of outside noise to deal with too. If you have a small SUV type jeep, it's easier to keep good sound inside the vehicle and have a very nice setup when done.
May I suggest you try to outline what your ultimate sound system goals are for this project and then set aside some cash to buy things as you can afford them. This is thinking long term so that you will not waste money on junk that will have to be replaced later. That means decent quality speakers, a usable HU, decent amps to power your speakers and subs too.
Welcome to CK... we seem to have caught you before any major buying mistakes have come into the game. We'll give you some great ideas and tips on installing gear you buy later too. But avoid rushing the process and setting a very low budget as well. This will only lead to spending more later when the cheap gear fails to satisfy or craps out on you.
Comments?
Swez
PS What model/year Jeep is this? Jeeps are tough for secuity issues too. If they are soft sides, it is so easy to steal what you have. Keep that in mind as you go.
AKjeepXJ on 07/25/2007 23:43:07
Quantum Audio Cozmik series QCA4300 2,400 watt 4 channel car amplifier. I got it off of ebay.
So what kind of amp will i need to power my subs?
The jeep i have is '94 Cherokee
Ender2 on 07/26/2007 00:15:15
Will need specific model numbers on your Kicker Comp VR's to determine which amp you'll need. They could be the CompVR CVR154, which are 4 ohm DVCs, or they could be the 2 ohm DVC's. This certainly matters when determining which amp you should buy.
As far as your Cozmik amp;
http://www.quantumaudio.net/cozmik-amp.html
It says it will do 4x300 watts @ 4 ohm, at 14.4v. Or 4x600w at 2 ohm (14.4v).
I'd be these are peak power ratings, and are in actuality not even close to what the amp will do realistically. But I'm sure you could get somewhere around 50wRMS x4 @4 ohm which would be plenty of power for a good couple pairs of component speakers.
In regard to your initial post;
It seems quite obvious that you will be using 1 or 2 amplifiers (one for your 4 channel component speakers, or possible 3-ways, and one for your bass engine, Kickers 15's.)
which means you'll either need 2 pair of Preamp outputs on your head unit, or you'll need to make sure your 4 channel has an auxiliary Sub Output to run a set of RCA's. Looking at an up close picture of your 4-channel amp, I do see a set of output jacks that can be ran to your sub amp; so no worries here, my suggestion for a head unit is as follows;
~ 7 or 9 Band Equalizer
~ 1or 2 Preamp output
~ MP3 Playback
~ Ipod Compatibility (if you have an ipod, and nowadays, who doesn't?)
~ Detatchable faceplate (if this is a soft top roof this will be essential to remove to deter theft.)
Go ahead and plan on running a 2 gauge wire from the Hood to a distribution block in the back, and 4 gauge from there to your amps. A fuse big enough to just barely exceed what's inside both of your amps less than a foot from your battery under the hood, and two more fuses after the Dblock just before your amps to provide maximum safety, always better to blow a fuse than an amplifier.
You will probably also want to consider an after market Alternator and battery to deal with the kind of power you'll need to satisfy 500wRMS per kicker sub if you plan to achieve their maximum potential. I see a possible 1,200wRMS setup here.
Hope that wasn't too much to take in.
Questions/Concerns/Comments?
I have AIM if you'd like to chat, sometimes you just want answers now. ;) Screen name is DruidEnder
AKjeepXJ on 07/26/2007 01:02:46
I can't thank all you guys enough for the information you guys have given me so far. The subs have got to be the CVR15-4's because on the back they say Dual 4 Ohm Voice Coils and i did a google image search on the model number
AKjeepXJ on 07/26/2007 01:03:08
kirchatndftbl on 07/26/2007 09:52:43
http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_9551_Hifonics+TXi1008D.html
that amp would be a good match for your subs
wire subs all in parrellel for a net 1 ohm load
1000rms @ 1 ohm
(HU)
http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_8566_JVC+KD-PDR30.html
swez on 07/26/2007 11:25:50
What are the fuse values in that Quantum QCA4300 4 channel amp? This amp should be very good for your full range speakers when you get to that point. It can power the subs mentioned, but a Class D sub amp would be more efficient.
The Kicker subs will do well with the HiFonics amp noted earlier. Hifonics TXi1008D
Cherokee is a good vehicle to work with audio wise. Whew... am glad it was not a soft shell Jeep.
Looks like the guys are pretty well on this one and you have plenty of good help coming in. That's cool and the suggestions are very good as well.
As for wiring needs, it looks like your best bet is #2 gage power line and a Distribution block that splits a #4 to your sub amp and a #4 or #8 line for your Quantum 4 channel. It's difficult to find #2 gage wire though. You may wish to use 1/0 gage and that will be large enough to handle most things you want to do now and in the future. Have used this vendor several times for hardware and found them very well priced, high quality and ships quickly too:
http://www.knukonceptz.com/
Swez
AKjeepXJ on 07/26/2007 13:57:36
It has a 60A fuse and this is the ebay sellers description of the amp:
The Quantum Audio Cozmik series QCA4300 2,400 watt 4 channel car amplifier has the nicest design we have seen. This is a class A/B amp so you can be sure the power is extremely efficient. This amp has a built in crossover network so you can use this amp for subs, or full range speakers.
This amp is way more powerful than the cheaper brands who rate there amps at 4,000 watts. These amps are rated and tested during production. Quantum is known to make great sounding amps. We guarantee you will not be let down by the performance of this amp. Just to prove to you that this amp is extremely powerful, take a look at the photos, and you can see this amp is equipped with a 60A fuse. The fuse rating is one of the best ways to see how powerful an amp is. 60A of fuse power is a lot!
We have tested these Quantum amps against some of the headliners in the industry such as Sony, Kenwood and Pioneer and these amps time over time outperform the competition. If you are looking for top of the line quality without overpaying this is definitely the amp for you and we guarantee you will be impressed with the performance. (We were blown away with how good these were when we tested them)
Other name brands spend a ton of money marketing there products, so you are not really getting what you are paying for. With Quantum you get way more than what you would pay for an amp at a similar price, labeled under a different brand name.
Features:
* 2,400 watts dynamic power
* Top of the line Components
* Heat Management System
* High Efficiency Mosfet Power Outputs
* Fully adjustable Built in Low Pass and high pass and full pass CrossOvers
* Bridgeable
* protect light
* Bass Remote Control
* Illuminated Logo
* Class A/B
* frequency response: 20-28KHz
* 2 x 1200 Watts @ 4 ohms
* 4 x 300 Watts @ 4 ohms
* 4 x 600 Watts @ 2ohms
* 60A Fuse
* S/N Ratio: Greater than 95 dB
* Input voltage: 11 - 14.4 volts
* Adjustable Input sensitivity: .2 MV - 5V
* bass boost control @ 45 hz - 12 dB
* dimensions: 15.75" x 2" x 11.5" inches
swez on 07/26/2007 15:02:09
Not too bad... this amp is able to deliver about 80 watts RMS x 4 at 4 ohm speaker loads. (Even more power... ~120 watts RMS, if you are using 2 ohm speakers)
Tech Tip: We look for "RMS or Continous Power" ratings on amps. Peak watts or Peak to Peak wattage ratings are meaningless. This amp is rated at Peak to Peak power rating @ 2 & 4 ohms. These numbers are totally bogus! The specs from seller are fabricated hype, not real world numbers.
This is not a bad amp and should serve you well to drive mids and highs very well. At full power, anticipate a current draw of about 35-45 amperes of current. (Pretty strong current draw for sure)
If you opt for the HiFonics amp mentioned earlier, electrical upgrades will be needed for your jeep. We can walk you through some option when you are ready for that step.
Do you know the ALT specs on this Cherokee? If it is close to 140 amperes peak output, it may work fine with a few add ons.
Swez
AKjeepXJ on 07/26/2007 22:30:22
i've been looking for the alternator specs for my jeep and i haven't had any luck, but i will post when i do find them. If my alternator does put out close to 140 amps, what add-ons would i need?
swez on 07/26/2007 22:51:17
In this case, a High Output ALT would be most beneficial. If you have close to 140A's available in this jeep, (not likely) one option is to use a 2nd Battery and Battery Isolator kit to power the sub amp only. The full range amp can be handled off your stock electrical system.
The other upgrade would be larger gage power wires under the hood. It's often called the "Big 3 Upgrade" and you can get those details off our FAQ section on this board:
http://www.clubknowledge.com/cgi-bin/car_audio_faq/faq.cgi
Read the details, look at the install pictures and understand what is being done here. (Larger wires carry more power)
Call AutoZone or similar and ask the OEM specs for the ALT that comes with this Cherokee. They can also tell you if other H.O. version are offered in Aftermarket versions.
Hope that clarifies,
Swez
AKjeepXJ on 07/26/2007 23:35:34
On my back hatch it says "HIGH OUTPUT" if that means anything? I doubt that means the alternator
swez on 07/27/2007 00:49:36
Can't say for sure Jeep... if your jeep has a trailer towing package, that might work in your favor as most Class III/IV hitch packages have larger ALT's to accomodate electric braking systems on trailers.
Other than that, call a dealership, NAPA or other good autoparts stores and they can tell you what is typical stock based on:
Engine size
Vin # codes
Towing package upgrades
Worst case, go to a parts store and have them measure the output at idle and 2,500 RPM. Most larger chain store autoparts places can do this in the parking lot or repair bay for free. This will tell you exactly what you have to work with or around.
Swez
AKjeepXJ on 07/27/2007 01:52:05
Awesome i'll try and go to the auto store tomorrow and report back. ; )
jamesp on 07/27/2007 07:46:45
I believe the motor options in 94 were either a 2.5l or 4.0 l.
Both choices almost always came with a little 75/90 alternator.
There used to be a Bosche premium replacement alt at around 105A that was an inexpensive replacement. Other than that the usual high output aftermarket alts are available.
AKjeepXJ on 07/27/2007 12:59:35
well then i guess i will be getting a new alternator. i have the 4.0L. is the 105 amps at idle?
swez on 07/27/2007 16:07:43
No, at idle it's more like 60% of rated power. Full power is often above 2,000 RPM.
One option is to use a 2nd Battery and a Battery Isolator kit to power the sub amp only. The full range amp can be handled off your stock electrical system. That might be cheaper in the long run. The 2nd battery acts like a current storage buffer and is much more effective than any Surge Cap could ever be. Read this:
http://www.bcae1.com/battiso.htm
The solinoid version shown can be simplified to 1 solinoid device and 1 switch is used if we want the 2nd battery in the loop only when using the sub amp.
The Diode version is easy to use as well. The only drawback to the diode version, they have a slight voltage drop compared to the solinoid version and are generally more expensive too.
Swez
AKjeepXJ on 07/28/2007 12:12:56
I was looking at the HU posted by kirchatndftbl and was wondering if i should find one that has a better equalizer? it has a 3-band equalizer. should i try to find one that has a 7 or 9-band equalizer?
swez on 07/28/2007 13:42:49
There are 2 main options you can look at for more EQ functions and other HU features or, perhaps a cheaper, less complex HU:
1. Buy a more expensive HU with all the features you deem to be adequate. (This is often more expensive and the more features in the HU, the more opportunity for things to go wrong later)
2. Use a low budget HU with basic features and use an Add on EQ/Line Driver/w/Aux inputs
Take a good look at this option:
http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_6655_Clarion+EQS746.html#
Here, we can use a simple and basic HU and only need 1 pair of RCA outs. This EQ does the rest and provides 7 bands of EQ, 6 channels of outputs, (F/R/Sub outs) and an Aux input for your I-pod.
Note this EQ has a Line Driver and adjustable AUX gain control feature. This is very nice and low cost option w/o compromizing the functions needed. It has Master volume and a separate Sub volume feature and fade that are all independent and adjustable on the fly. (No menu surfing needed)
If your dash has a 1.5 - 2.0 Din opening, a 1 Din HU (Common) and this 1/2 Din EQ can be mounted in the dash pocket, be very compact and looks great too. The best part, all your mixing and EQ features are right there in the dash.
You'll use an RCA to 3.5mm patch cable for the I-Pod/Aux player. It's easy to run an external Aux jack off pigtailed wires or mount a 3.5 mm stereo phone jack in the dash, glove box or anywhere you wish.
Think it over. Have done this setup for a previous client and he loved the results. Looked great, everything was on the fly adjusting and no need to menu hop to adjust EQ settings or Sub volume.
This HU will do what you need and has the front panel AUX input too. It only has 1 RCA out and that is all you will need. Yes, this HU has 3 band EQ, but this can be ignored.
http://www.crutchfield.com/S-Y370CPACsbt/cgi-bin/ProdView.asp?g=300&I=105KDG230
Swez
Victor on 07/28/2007 16:54:51
http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_8934_Alpine+CDA-9883.html
http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_7974_Blaupunkt+Long+Beach+DVD35.html
http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_8787_Clarion+DXZ675USB.html
http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_8780_Kenwood+KDC-MP735U.html
http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_6618_Panasonic+MXE+CQ-C8403U.html
http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_9008_Pioneer+Premier+DEH-P690UB.html
These are about it... for a budget of around $200..... the links are alphabetically placed.... pick any and i am sure you would be more than happy with the performance and upgrade capabilities....
Victor..
AKjeepXJ on 07/29/2007 20:34:19
I think I'm gonna go with this HU and the clarion equalizer :
http://www.crutchfield.com/S-UXNFvF8vGNp/cgi-bin/prodview.asp?I=105KDG430&g=300&s=0&cc=01
swez on 07/30/2007 09:42:51
Think you'll be very pleased with the results on this option. This phase of the planning process can be set aside for now and move to the next stage.
Are you ready to discuss speakers for your Jeep now? From what I can tell, this Jeep has 5.25" rounds on the front doors, and 5.25" in back pillars and perhaps a set if 5.25" rounds in the tailgate too? (Please confirm) In this case, the speakers in the pillars would be a good option and delete the tailgate speakers as you will have subs. The tailgate speakers may prove useless with subs.
Also, that Quantum amp mentioned earlier, what are the fuse ratings used in it? Knowing that will help us determine the appropriate power ratings for your new speakers.
Once we get this phase locked down, then we'll address your sub amp needs.
Swez
PS This is the planning and research stage of the game. It's very important to do this phase well now as this will determine the outcome of the project later.
AKjeepXJ on 07/30/2007 12:29:08
yeah i have speakers in the front doors and back hatch, but i don't have any in my rear pillars or doors, but i was thinking about putting some in the rear doors as well as the front. the quantum amp has 60A fuses and according to DHL i should get it today.
swez on 07/30/2007 14:08:41
Back hatch location is out as you are using subs. The bass energy will bury a speaker located in the hatch door. A better option would be the pillars or rear doors.
This amp should deliver a solid 75 x 4 watts RMS w/ 4 ohm speakers and over 110 watts RMS x 4 @ 2 ohms. Pretty strong amp here after all. You'll be looking for some pretty stout door speakers to handle this amp. (75 watts RMS or higher per speaker)
Swez
PS Hope you amp comes in soon... getting a bit antsy?
AKjeepXJ on 07/31/2007 03:52:25
my amp came in today! and i just ordered my head unit and equalizer. got any speakers in mind?
Victor on 07/31/2007 08:45:12
Just a suggestion.. Sometimes its good to go through a couple of other parallel posts on CK.. it gives u a lot of information you could relate to your system too...
a lot of archived posts are very very informative as well...
Victor...
swez on 07/31/2007 10:35:42
Have been using JBL and Infinity speakers of late for installs. CDT is also a nice package as are Polks. (Fusion Audio seems to have some interesting offerings too, but harder to find)
Best I can tell, your jeep uses 5.25" rounds in front and back. It would be good to use 2-way Component speakers up front and coaxials in back. Try to use the same series for front and back if possible.
Front:
Infinity Reference 5020cs
Polk Audio MMC5250
JBL Grand Touring Series GTO507C
CDT AUDIO HD52
Back:
Infinity Kappa 50.7cs (F/B or both)
Polk/MOMO MMC525
CDT AUDIO CL50cv
There's a few very good selections to look at. Just do a Google search and see what pops up. Your best prices are likely to come from e-bay sellers.
Swez
JBL Grand Touring Series GTO527
AKjeepXJ on 08/16/2007 18:34:05
i chose some speakers that were cheaper for now. i now need help with wiring my system up. I've ran the power wire but have questions about how the HU connects to the clarion EQ and the amp.
To Recap
My head unit is
http://www.crutchfield.com/S-UXNFvF8vGNp/cgi-bin/prodview.asp?I=105KDG430&g=300&s=0&cc=01
it has two sets of RCA outs
LR front and
LR rear
it has speaker connections in the wireing harness
RR -+
LR -+
RF-+
LF-+
my EQ is
http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_6655_Clarion+EQS746.html#
it has 5 sets of RCA connections
Main In
Aux in RL
Front Out RL
Rear Out RL
Sub Out RL
the last component in my system is the QCA4200 Quantum Amp
http://quantumaudio.net/cozmik-amp.html
it has the following input outputs
Optional Line out to additional amp LR
front IN LR
Rear IN LR
4 speaker outputs -+ 4 ohm / 2 ohm minimum
or bridged
2 speaker outs -+ 8 ohm / 4 ohm min
Speakers
Two Kicker Dual Voice coil 15" 4 ohm
Two 6x9 "Dual" (brand name) 4 ohm 4 ways 50wrms from Schucks Auto
Two 6.5 rounds same brand 4 ohm also 4 ways 50wrms
which RCA goes to which
which speaker connections go to what speakers?
last question how does it all go to gether?
thanks in advance
swez on 08/16/2007 20:20:11
Last question... "I done thing so''...Somethings missing... the sub amp?
As it stands, you can use the 4 channel amp to power the front speakers and subs with this 4 channel amp and use the HU amps to
power the rear speakers for now. It's not optimal, but it will work OK for now.
Here's the wiring scheme to use for now:
HU..... LR/Front RCA's to Clarion Main Input RCA's
HU rear speaker outputs to rear speakers
Clarion..... LR/Front RCA outs to amp input channels 1 & 2. This channels will power your front speakers. The amp HPF's are set to ~80 Hz.
Clarion.....Sub outs to amp input channels 3 & 4. To power the subs noted, you have 2 options:
Option 1: The "Easy" button method
1. Wire Sub A coils in parallel for a net 2 ohms (parallel coils)
2. Wire Sub A to channel 3 on your amp
3. Wire sub B coils the same as before
4. Wire Sub B to channel 4 on your amp
5. Set the LPF on rear channels to ~80 Hz.
http://www.crutchfield.com/learningcenter/car/subwoofers_wiring.html?imageID=2DVC%5F4%2Dohm%5F2ch
Option 2: A bit more difficult
1. Bridge channels 3 & 4
2. Wire Sub A coils in series to get an 8 ohm load
3. Do the same with Sub B
4. Now, take wired the subs as shown and connect to amp rear channels as noted in link below
http://www.crutchfield.com/learningcenter/car/subwoofers_wiring.html?imageID=2DVC%5F4%2Dohm%5Fmono
NOTE: This picture shows a MONO sub amp. In your case, we are creating a MONO channel by combining channels 3 & 4. In most cases, channel 3 Pos terminal and Channel 4 Neg terminal are used only. Check your manual for exact instructions.
Tech Tip: Be sure to observe coil polarity carefully when wiring your subs.
Comments/
Swez
trunkisloud on 08/20/2007 00:17:39
you know ive seen a few quantum audio products on craigslist and i was wondering about the quality....i guess its like any other...depends on what level of the product you decide to go with.
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