Alright, Since I decided to go more of a "mainstream" product, I want to go with a pair of 15" Solo-Baric L7's..
These drivers come are available in 2 or 4 ohm DVC's..Which leaves me with a few options here..
With the 2 ohm DVC version wired in a series/parallel, I would have a net impedance of 2 ohm's..*A class D mono amp stable @ 1 or 2 ohm's would be a good choice.
With the 2 ohm DVC version wired in series, I would have a net impedance of 8 ohm's..A class D amp stable @ 4 ohm's would be a good choice..
Using the 4 ohm DVC version wired in parallel/parallel, I would have a net impedance of 1 ohm..a Class D mono stable @ 1 ohm would be the way to go..
Using the 4 ohm DVC version wired in series/parallel would give a net impedance of 4 ohms..an amp stable @ 4 or 2 ohm would do, or a Class D mono stable @ 1 ohm..
All that sound about right??
Now, what im wondering is which one should I go with?? You know what Im looking for, (SPL) lol..
Amp recomendations???
Replies (23)
swez on 07/8/2007 22:55:00
You have 2 real choices here for subs and amps:
1. One amp per sub (1000 Wrms @ 1 or 2 ohms, depending on coil set used)
2. One large amp for both subs 2000 Wrms @ 1 or 2 ohms, depending on coil set used)
If you can manage the price, consider Kicker Amps. The ZX series. The zx 2500.1 would be a solid SPL choice. (2 ohm stable)
http://www.kicker.com/06/kicker_home.html
Note the power draw of this amp is huge at high SPL levels. This amp is rated for close to 300A's of current draw at full power and 1/0 gage wire is needed along with a H.O. ALT and BAT. Here's the manual for the ZX series amps:
http://www.kicker.com/06/tech-support/manuals/manuals/2006/2006%20ZX1000%201500%202500-1%20b01%20WEB.pdf
Warning!!! This proposed system has the SPL capability to easily damage ones hearing permanently. Prolonged exposure to SPL levels above 120 dB are harmful at just a few minutes of exposure at close range. Hearing protection is a must when exposed to such high SPL levels. (Aircraft grade ear muffs are a wise choice) Only a complete fool would take chances on their hearing. (Yes, this is a stearn warning and for good reason too)
The L715's require a large vented enclosure to get the most SPL from them. Each sub chamber will be huge if you go for the deep bass SPL box design. (6.0 ft^3/sub is the internal specs for this series 15.)
Yes, you can scale them down to fit if desired too. They offer a range between 3.0-6.0 ft^3/sub. The external dimensions are even more space grabbing and the weight will be a considerable factor as well. If you think you have a gas hog now, try adding 500 lbs of gear and watch this truck suck gas like a thirsty worker on a hot day.
FYI: Guys who compete in SPL Comps will opt for this type of system. They often add a dedicated H.O. ALT and several batteries to power the amp(s). That means considerable under the hood mods which are not cheap either.
Knowing all this up front, do you still wish to do such a project? We are talking about $3,000.00 worth of gear and upgrades.
Think it through...
Swez
big_bass_chase on 07/8/2007 23:26:43
Well, I think I may just go with one, I didnt take into consideration the cost of power upgrades.. I already ordered the 1/0 ga wire, so thats out of the picture, but thats the least of the expenses lol..
I think for now, one will suffice..I can add on later, thats always an option..This way I can give it an optimal enclosure and enough power without spending my life savings on it...Hehe
swez on 07/9/2007 10:45:15
Good plan grasshoppa...
Consider the 4+4 DVC, paired with a Kicker zx-1000.1 amp. This will give you solid bass that is very strong w/o draining your net worth to broke.
This amp will draw about 75A's at full power and you may get by with a 140A ALT and perhaps the Big 3 wiring upgrade and maybe a stronger battery.
The rest is in the box design and that will be considerable too. Are you able to build your own box? That can shave costs over a custom or quality prefab box.
FYI: To give you an idea of space needed for 1 enclosure, 36" x 18" x 20" (External) will net an internal air space of 6.1 ft^3 when using 3/4" thick MDF. A single sheet of MDF yields 4,608 in^2 of materials. That's about $40.00 CAN for a single sheet, depending on market costs in your area. Then figure about $20.00 more for hardware, sealant and glue.
Hope that helps,
Swez
big_bass_chase on 07/10/2007 00:17:25
It would be nice if I knew how much space I had between the wheel "humps" in the back of my truck, that way we could go ahead and make some exact calculations for the enclosure with port space as well..
Im not very familiar with the process of making a box, as far as calculating the B W H and port sizes...Actually building the box is not going to be a problem, its figuring out exactly how big to make everything is what im concerned about...
swez on 07/10/2007 01:01:35
There are a few programs out on the net that can help with much of the basic cals of the box. The port is the key dimension though.
I just threw out some basic cals for you to see just how large the box will be. Yes, one can adjust any 2 parameters and make up the difference with the remaining one. Some basic measurements on your part will help determine the max parameter of any one dimension.
"H" & B" have mins so that the sub will fit when the cutout is completed. In this case, the woofer is square and the cutout is 14-1/16" or 35.7 cm's sq. (The box will need a base of ~18.0" + 2 -3/4" for the port.) I would suggest a base of no less that 24.0". (66.66 cm) The H & D are then adjusted according to fitment in your vehicle.
Take some measurments of the max numbers you have to play with and we'll crunch some numbers. (1.0" = 25.4 mm or 0.254 cm)
Swez
big_bass_chase on 07/12/2007 20:02:21
The Kicker ZX 1000.1, is it 1000 wrms or peak??
kirchatndftbl on 07/12/2007 20:44:33
1000rms @ 2 ohms for the kicker 1000.1
http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_6590_Kicker+ZX1000.1.html
big_bass_chase on 07/12/2007 21:36:09
Thanks, the Kicker website did'nt specify...
swez on 07/13/2007 13:40:35
The Kicker XZ-1000.1 is a perfectly matched amp for the Solo-baric 15 L7, 4+4 DVC sub. Both are rated at 1000 watts RMS. (2 ohms)
Swez
big_bass_chase on 07/17/2007 22:26:13
Alright, I ordered the 4+4 version, along with the zx 1000.1 to push it..
Now all Im waiting for is the measurements of the back of my truck, we can get started on the enclosure
swez on 07/17/2007 23:49:20
That's a step in the right direction.
Consider ideal mounting location will be behind the rear seats and the sub firing to the rear. You have good width in this truck and adequate height too. The depth will be the main concern... (To your wheel wells) But in this truck, the spare tire stowage is below in the frame and not inside the cabin.
Get you numbers and we'll work out some enclosure specs based on that.
Swez
big_bass_chase on 07/23/2007 08:21:22
Ok, It seems as if measuring the back of my truck is a little too much to ask ~ So I just went ahead and bought this box, to use until I can build my own..
http://cgi.ebay.com/15-CUSTOM-KICKER-L7-ENCLOSURE-S12L5-S12L7-4-0FT-3-32Hz_W0QQitemZ150135870204QQihZ005QQcategoryZ50568QQrdZ1QQssPageNameZWD1VQQcmdZViewItem
One more thing, What size wire should I use inside the box? (To wire the voice coils)??
kirchatndftbl on 07/23/2007 10:56:21
12 guage would work but i would go with 10 guage
swez on 07/23/2007 15:23:47
That box should do pretty well for your sub and fit in that SUV too.
Wire gage: #10-12 should be good here. The wires are short and anything under 6 feet will suffer no losses or voltage drops.
Swez
SQLThump on 07/23/2007 15:25:07
I would use a few lengths of 8 GA amp cable for the speaker wire. 1000WRMS is a lot of voltage, and I personally believe nothing succeeds like excess. Sometimes 8GA can be cheaper than good speaker wire as well.
swez on 07/23/2007 15:41:51
#8 speaker line??? Total over-kill as the wires are very short. Keep it Simple!
1000 watts RMS @ 2 ohms = 44 volts AC.
The current here is only 22.2 amperes.
#12 wire is adequate and rated at 20 amps current and up to 125 Volts AC. That's 2,500 watts continous power handling. If you wish, drop to #10 wire if this will fit in your sub wire lugs. Since the coils are wired in parallel, you may have a very difficult time jamming a pair of #10 wires into the lugs.
Swez
big_bass_chase on 07/23/2007 16:54:28
Im sure I can get the #10 to fit, I have a nice set of DMC terminal crimpers (aircraft grade), with a few different size heads that I can put on..So if I could just twist them together, and get it in there, They would surely get it small enough to fit..
SQLThump on 07/23/2007 17:44:40
I personally am a big fan of overkill, and for me, amp cable is usually easier and cheaper for me to get a hold of than decent speaker wire. Stores I go to sell it dirt cheap, and all of my buddies and myself always got plenty of scrap #8.
Maybe I do go over the top, but if over the top is easier on the wallet as it usually is, I'll stick with that.
Note, Walmart here sells a 20 foor roll of 8AWG amp cable for the same price as a 10 foot roll of Monster or Schosche 12GA. $19.95 for either. Prices on this are different in different areas, sometimes varying from stores across the city.
big_bass_chase on 08/5/2007 16:10:52
Finally all my new toys came in, I cant wait to get back home and see what kind of sound I can get with the box I have now ~ I leave here next week :)
Im pretty sure I'll build a bigger one later, I was thinking somewhere around 5.5 cubic ft. (Not including port and driver displacement) Which could easily be done considering how much space I have to work with..
big_bass_chase on 08/27/2007 11:58:06
Alright guys, I've made it home finally and I installed the L7..All I can say is WOW.. It was a great choice, and was exaclty what I was looking for.
I played a 32 hz test tone, and I'll admit it was'nt as chest pounding as I'd hoped it would be with tones that low. Im thinking its because of the box as its only 3.0 ft (not including port and sub displacement) If I built a bigger one, (6.0) It should help to bring out the lower octaves at a higher db level..Now dont get me wrong, when using tones from about 38-50 its almost unbearable!
swez on 08/27/2007 16:00:30
The chest kicks come from the kick drum and not so much the bass. At 32 Hz., we feel the bass much more then hear it. (Air Pressure, not so much audible)
You are on the right track and and a larger box will give even better deep lows, like you feel/hear @ 50 Hz.
Swez
big_bass_chase on 08/27/2007 21:45:06
There are a few audio shops here, In the morning I'll stop by a few to see if they have a db meter, just to see what Im pushing with this box..I definitly have some high hopes, and i'll let you guys know what I find out..
Once again, thank everyone for all the help..I finally have what I was looking for!!
swez on 08/28/2007 10:24:16
BTW, if this is a new and out of the box sub, it will get better after it breaks in for a few days.
Swez
These drivers come are available in 2 or 4 ohm DVC's..Which leaves me with a few options here..
With the 2 ohm DVC version wired in a series/parallel, I would have a net impedance of 2 ohm's..*A class D mono amp stable @ 1 or 2 ohm's would be a good choice.
With the 2 ohm DVC version wired in series, I would have a net impedance of 8 ohm's..A class D amp stable @ 4 ohm's would be a good choice..
Using the 4 ohm DVC version wired in parallel/parallel, I would have a net impedance of 1 ohm..a Class D mono stable @ 1 ohm would be the way to go..
Using the 4 ohm DVC version wired in series/parallel would give a net impedance of 4 ohms..an amp stable @ 4 or 2 ohm would do, or a Class D mono stable @ 1 ohm..
All that sound about right??
Now, what im wondering is which one should I go with?? You know what Im looking for, (SPL) lol..
Amp recomendations???
Replies (23)
swez on 07/8/2007 22:55:00
You have 2 real choices here for subs and amps:
1. One amp per sub (1000 Wrms @ 1 or 2 ohms, depending on coil set used)
2. One large amp for both subs 2000 Wrms @ 1 or 2 ohms, depending on coil set used)
If you can manage the price, consider Kicker Amps. The ZX series. The zx 2500.1 would be a solid SPL choice. (2 ohm stable)
http://www.kicker.com/06/kicker_home.html
Note the power draw of this amp is huge at high SPL levels. This amp is rated for close to 300A's of current draw at full power and 1/0 gage wire is needed along with a H.O. ALT and BAT. Here's the manual for the ZX series amps:
http://www.kicker.com/06/tech-support/manuals/manuals/2006/2006%20ZX1000%201500%202500-1%20b01%20WEB.pdf
Warning!!! This proposed system has the SPL capability to easily damage ones hearing permanently. Prolonged exposure to SPL levels above 120 dB are harmful at just a few minutes of exposure at close range. Hearing protection is a must when exposed to such high SPL levels. (Aircraft grade ear muffs are a wise choice) Only a complete fool would take chances on their hearing. (Yes, this is a stearn warning and for good reason too)
The L715's require a large vented enclosure to get the most SPL from them. Each sub chamber will be huge if you go for the deep bass SPL box design. (6.0 ft^3/sub is the internal specs for this series 15.)
Yes, you can scale them down to fit if desired too. They offer a range between 3.0-6.0 ft^3/sub. The external dimensions are even more space grabbing and the weight will be a considerable factor as well. If you think you have a gas hog now, try adding 500 lbs of gear and watch this truck suck gas like a thirsty worker on a hot day.
FYI: Guys who compete in SPL Comps will opt for this type of system. They often add a dedicated H.O. ALT and several batteries to power the amp(s). That means considerable under the hood mods which are not cheap either.
Knowing all this up front, do you still wish to do such a project? We are talking about $3,000.00 worth of gear and upgrades.
Think it through...
Swez
big_bass_chase on 07/8/2007 23:26:43
Well, I think I may just go with one, I didnt take into consideration the cost of power upgrades.. I already ordered the 1/0 ga wire, so thats out of the picture, but thats the least of the expenses lol..
I think for now, one will suffice..I can add on later, thats always an option..This way I can give it an optimal enclosure and enough power without spending my life savings on it...Hehe
swez on 07/9/2007 10:45:15
Good plan grasshoppa...
Consider the 4+4 DVC, paired with a Kicker zx-1000.1 amp. This will give you solid bass that is very strong w/o draining your net worth to broke.
This amp will draw about 75A's at full power and you may get by with a 140A ALT and perhaps the Big 3 wiring upgrade and maybe a stronger battery.
The rest is in the box design and that will be considerable too. Are you able to build your own box? That can shave costs over a custom or quality prefab box.
FYI: To give you an idea of space needed for 1 enclosure, 36" x 18" x 20" (External) will net an internal air space of 6.1 ft^3 when using 3/4" thick MDF. A single sheet of MDF yields 4,608 in^2 of materials. That's about $40.00 CAN for a single sheet, depending on market costs in your area. Then figure about $20.00 more for hardware, sealant and glue.
Hope that helps,
Swez
big_bass_chase on 07/10/2007 00:17:25
It would be nice if I knew how much space I had between the wheel "humps" in the back of my truck, that way we could go ahead and make some exact calculations for the enclosure with port space as well..
Im not very familiar with the process of making a box, as far as calculating the B W H and port sizes...Actually building the box is not going to be a problem, its figuring out exactly how big to make everything is what im concerned about...
swez on 07/10/2007 01:01:35
There are a few programs out on the net that can help with much of the basic cals of the box. The port is the key dimension though.
I just threw out some basic cals for you to see just how large the box will be. Yes, one can adjust any 2 parameters and make up the difference with the remaining one. Some basic measurements on your part will help determine the max parameter of any one dimension.
"H" & B" have mins so that the sub will fit when the cutout is completed. In this case, the woofer is square and the cutout is 14-1/16" or 35.7 cm's sq. (The box will need a base of ~18.0" + 2 -3/4" for the port.) I would suggest a base of no less that 24.0". (66.66 cm) The H & D are then adjusted according to fitment in your vehicle.
Take some measurments of the max numbers you have to play with and we'll crunch some numbers. (1.0" = 25.4 mm or 0.254 cm)
Swez
big_bass_chase on 07/12/2007 20:02:21
The Kicker ZX 1000.1, is it 1000 wrms or peak??
kirchatndftbl on 07/12/2007 20:44:33
1000rms @ 2 ohms for the kicker 1000.1
http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_6590_Kicker+ZX1000.1.html
big_bass_chase on 07/12/2007 21:36:09
Thanks, the Kicker website did'nt specify...
swez on 07/13/2007 13:40:35
The Kicker XZ-1000.1 is a perfectly matched amp for the Solo-baric 15 L7, 4+4 DVC sub. Both are rated at 1000 watts RMS. (2 ohms)
Swez
big_bass_chase on 07/17/2007 22:26:13
Alright, I ordered the 4+4 version, along with the zx 1000.1 to push it..
Now all Im waiting for is the measurements of the back of my truck, we can get started on the enclosure
swez on 07/17/2007 23:49:20
That's a step in the right direction.
Consider ideal mounting location will be behind the rear seats and the sub firing to the rear. You have good width in this truck and adequate height too. The depth will be the main concern... (To your wheel wells) But in this truck, the spare tire stowage is below in the frame and not inside the cabin.
Get you numbers and we'll work out some enclosure specs based on that.
Swez
big_bass_chase on 07/23/2007 08:21:22
Ok, It seems as if measuring the back of my truck is a little too much to ask ~ So I just went ahead and bought this box, to use until I can build my own..
http://cgi.ebay.com/15-CUSTOM-KICKER-L7-ENCLOSURE-S12L5-S12L7-4-0FT-3-32Hz_W0QQitemZ150135870204QQihZ005QQcategoryZ50568QQrdZ1QQssPageNameZWD1VQQcmdZViewItem
One more thing, What size wire should I use inside the box? (To wire the voice coils)??
kirchatndftbl on 07/23/2007 10:56:21
12 guage would work but i would go with 10 guage
swez on 07/23/2007 15:23:47
That box should do pretty well for your sub and fit in that SUV too.
Wire gage: #10-12 should be good here. The wires are short and anything under 6 feet will suffer no losses or voltage drops.
Swez
SQLThump on 07/23/2007 15:25:07
I would use a few lengths of 8 GA amp cable for the speaker wire. 1000WRMS is a lot of voltage, and I personally believe nothing succeeds like excess. Sometimes 8GA can be cheaper than good speaker wire as well.
swez on 07/23/2007 15:41:51
#8 speaker line??? Total over-kill as the wires are very short. Keep it Simple!
1000 watts RMS @ 2 ohms = 44 volts AC.
The current here is only 22.2 amperes.
#12 wire is adequate and rated at 20 amps current and up to 125 Volts AC. That's 2,500 watts continous power handling. If you wish, drop to #10 wire if this will fit in your sub wire lugs. Since the coils are wired in parallel, you may have a very difficult time jamming a pair of #10 wires into the lugs.
Swez
big_bass_chase on 07/23/2007 16:54:28
Im sure I can get the #10 to fit, I have a nice set of DMC terminal crimpers (aircraft grade), with a few different size heads that I can put on..So if I could just twist them together, and get it in there, They would surely get it small enough to fit..
SQLThump on 07/23/2007 17:44:40
I personally am a big fan of overkill, and for me, amp cable is usually easier and cheaper for me to get a hold of than decent speaker wire. Stores I go to sell it dirt cheap, and all of my buddies and myself always got plenty of scrap #8.
Maybe I do go over the top, but if over the top is easier on the wallet as it usually is, I'll stick with that.
Note, Walmart here sells a 20 foor roll of 8AWG amp cable for the same price as a 10 foot roll of Monster or Schosche 12GA. $19.95 for either. Prices on this are different in different areas, sometimes varying from stores across the city.
big_bass_chase on 08/5/2007 16:10:52
Finally all my new toys came in, I cant wait to get back home and see what kind of sound I can get with the box I have now ~ I leave here next week :)
Im pretty sure I'll build a bigger one later, I was thinking somewhere around 5.5 cubic ft. (Not including port and driver displacement) Which could easily be done considering how much space I have to work with..
big_bass_chase on 08/27/2007 11:58:06
Alright guys, I've made it home finally and I installed the L7..All I can say is WOW.. It was a great choice, and was exaclty what I was looking for.
I played a 32 hz test tone, and I'll admit it was'nt as chest pounding as I'd hoped it would be with tones that low. Im thinking its because of the box as its only 3.0 ft (not including port and sub displacement) If I built a bigger one, (6.0) It should help to bring out the lower octaves at a higher db level..Now dont get me wrong, when using tones from about 38-50 its almost unbearable!
swez on 08/27/2007 16:00:30
The chest kicks come from the kick drum and not so much the bass. At 32 Hz., we feel the bass much more then hear it. (Air Pressure, not so much audible)
You are on the right track and and a larger box will give even better deep lows, like you feel/hear @ 50 Hz.
Swez
big_bass_chase on 08/27/2007 21:45:06
There are a few audio shops here, In the morning I'll stop by a few to see if they have a db meter, just to see what Im pushing with this box..I definitly have some high hopes, and i'll let you guys know what I find out..
Once again, thank everyone for all the help..I finally have what I was looking for!!
swez on 08/28/2007 10:24:16
BTW, if this is a new and out of the box sub, it will get better after it breaks in for a few days.
Swez
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