I am looking to do my first install and looking for any suggestions that will allow me to do this install the easiest and best way possible.
One more thing, My freind is a dealer for Pioneer and MTX, What is your recomendation on either of those for door speakers, amps and subs.
Thanks again for you assistance
Jesse
Replies (19)
Jess_ on 03/9/2007 11:24:06
In reading the forum I realised I could be more specific on what kind of help I am looking for.
Well I have never done this before since my brother in California did all my installs and I now live in Utah.
I like bass in my music LL Cool J, Miami Bass, old school etc.
what should i be looking for when buying my system.
where should i place my amps.
Since I like alot of different type of music I would like to have an EQ to control my sound. What is a good eq I could buy.
at this point i do not have a budget.
Thanks again
Jesse
swez on 03/9/2007 12:38:16
Good summary and starting point. There are so many options avilable these days and the prices range based on brand name, features and the quality of materials used.
The most evident upgrade will be a good set of Aftermarket speakers. With this in mind, consider a good set of Component speakers up front and perhaps Components or Coaxials in back. The better Coaxials come with good passive crossover networks. (Not just a low cost capacitor on the tweeter and perhaps a coil for the woofer)
The next aspect to consider, would be amping the speakers to get the most from them. A typical factory HU will deliver about 10-15 watts (RMS) power per speaker. If the vehicle has say a Bose Factory amp system, that might be closer to 25-40 watts RMS power per channel. (Not bad, but if you look at most factory speakers, they are pathetic compared to Aftermarket versions out there)
Does your truck have a Bose Premium sound system in it?
Swez
Jess_ on 03/9/2007 12:43:10
My truck does not have the Bose System. Because I use my Ipod alot, I am considering changing my deck to an Alpine that will control it right from the deck.
Do you think I can acomplish this with MTX and Pioneer Components?
Thanks for your quick assistance swez.
swez on 03/9/2007 13:58:06
Pioneer is best known for their radios and not a great option for anything but low power, average performance apps. There may be a few new products that would please most average listeners. But if you are a demanding audiophile in the making, don't look hard at Pioneer speakers.
MTX is a better option for power and better performance, depending on the price you can get from your source. This would be a nice option for your front doors:
http://www.cardomain.com/item/MTXTX6001
Rear doors, consider these as an option or use 2 pairs of Comps:
http://www.cardomain.com/item/MTXTDX6502
These options will require amping to get the most from them. (60 - 90 watts RMS/ch. is recommended here for max performance.
Comments?
Swez
LAMIRANDcca on 03/10/2007 03:25:04
Jesse, swez is right on the money. if u dont rilly care about the overall quality of ur music, chances are u dont posess the ear of an audiophile,
if u do on the other hand, go with jlaudio zr components all around, thier flagship 10 w7 and thier 1000/1 monoblock amp.
however, thats a down payment on a house, if moneys an issue go with swez's sugestions
Victor on 03/10/2007 06:39:27
Well, I would agree a bit and make a different suggestion here..
There are many brand there which are comparable, and many even better performing and some better priced too..
A lot of brand selection depends on what you are looking for in your system.
lets say you ask yourself a few questions before you start buying for your new system after reading this article
http://www.clubknowledge.com/Car_Audio_FAQ/?t31
1 - What am I aiming at? SPL - SQL - SQ ?
most of the people are pretty much SQL guys a bit of both the worlds, one cant think of a 50-50 SQL system but definitely try and balance it the best way one can.
Loudness is what most of the car audio geeks look for, Where as the choice of clean & crisp sound at moderate listening levels is what a serious audiophile would look for.. What world do u belong to?????
2 - This world belongs to the rich and famous.. how true this saying is..?? Budget constrains
This pre-dominantly guides the direction in which your system would go. If you can afford then there are some top notch manufacturers which make some serious sound equipments.why not get the best of the best available.
and If you are on a tight budget, then managing funds and looking for the Price / Performance ratio of a brand would really help u select a proper product.
3 - Affinity towards a few brands...??
If there are any, then our job becomes easier to suggest you teh best equipment available in that brand as per your budget.
If MTX and Pioneer are the only products u look at then Swez has guided you n the best possible manner.
If you are open to other brands then we can suggest u some few good products whose Price / Performance ration would be better than the ones u mentioned..
4 - How mouch do you actually require in your car..??
5 - How much time do you spend listening to music in your car..??
6 - What kind of music do you listen to???
7 - Are you into showing off your system in competitions or people around you..??
8 - Do you need a showy / jazzy install...??
9 - How good are you at installing the system yourself..?? fabrications?? availibility of tools and space..??
10 - Is some installer doing the job for you..?? Are you paying him?? is it worth it???
11 - Are you open to shopping on the internet ..??
12 - We can certainly guide you in the install, Are you willing to DIY..??
Jess_ .. Brands... ?? some make good HU's , some make good sub's , some make good speakers, and some good amps.. and a very few manufacturers make over all good above average range of products...
We would need more precise feedback to help us help u better
Welcome to CK.. COFFEE
Victor...
swez on 03/10/2007 07:59:27
Well said and AMEN Victor...
Jess, As was mentioned before, there's a wide range of gear out there to choose from and unless you can get MTX gear at almost dealer cost, there's a good chance we can design a top notch system for you within the budget range you have in mind.
Think this over carefully as you'll have to live with the situation in the end.
Swez
Jess_ on 03/11/2007 03:44:42
Thanks Victor,
I will anwser the questions in the order you wrote them.
1. I listen to a wide variety of music like, old school, Santana, Raggae. I guess I like to here base in my music. Not to loud but clear.
2. Budget- I have not set a budget. Since this will my first install I want to install mid-priced components. not to pricey but definettly not the cheapest.
3.I do not have to stay with pioneer nor MTX. Since I was going to get a small discount on those brands I thought about them. Please feel free to suggest the brands that would work for me.
4.I have a 2000 Yukon XL without the Bose system. I will need a Deck 2 Component 6.5' speakers and 2 individual 6.5" Speakers. 2-Subs and 1-Amp for door speakers and Mono amp for Subs.
5. I commute 45 minutes each way to work and use my Yukon when traveling so I listen to my Car audio a lot.
6. I listen to a wide range in music, Old school (gap band), Santana, Radio R&B, Even southern rock.
7. this system is for my self. Definetly not to show it off because I have learned thats when people go off to get your stuff. But I love Bass in my music.
8. Looking for the best install for my vehicle. Keep in mind this is my first install and i need guidance on what parts i will need to purchase to make this happen.
9. I understand signal flow and the concept behind stereo to amps to speakers. Since this will be my test I want to do it right the first time.
10. I will do the install
11. If you advice me shopping online I will consider.
12. I am looking forward to being inside my car until I am done with this install. I really apreciate all of your assistance in making this fun and doable.
Keep in mind I am open to the brands you all recomend for this install..
Thanks again
Jesse
Victor on 03/11/2007 06:05:48
Thanks for your detailed reply Jesse.. Now that we know what you exactly want...
Lets look at HU's first..
Alpine, Blaupunkt, Clarion, Eclipse, Kenwood, Panasonic, Pioneer Premier, Pioneer.
These are reputed head unit manufacturers and make some of the finest units in the market.
What brand to select out of this is another question, but what u actually need in a HU is somethign very different.
Cassette players, CD players, MP3, DVD etc...?
for installation flexibility u shud by a HU with 3 sets of RCA pre-outs , ( front , rear, Sub-out )
look for the pre-out voltage, usually low to mid segment units have the pre-out voltage around 2 volts.These fall in the range of $100 to $300
the above average HU's which fall in a higher category and can be bought $ 300 - $500 for retail, these units have the pre-out voltage between 4v to 5v.
and some really high end units carry pre-out voltage upto 8volts..
higher pre-out voltage means cleaner sound.
Next thing one wud look in HU's is D/A convertors, These Digital to analogue convertors are the heart of the processing unit of the HU.
most of the HU's in the market use a 1bit D/A convertor, where as some of the better products use 24 bit burrbrown D/A convertors.
If you are not into competition or serious audiophile listening then an HU with a 1 bit DAC is more than enuf.
Other thigns like fine tuning the sound, equalizing capabilities, automatic sound adjusting, bass treble control, adjustable crossovers etc are always a bonus that come at a certain price.
If I were to do a moderate system, I would select HU brands in the following order.
Alpine, Pioneer Premier, Blaupunkt, Clarion, Kenwood, Eclipse, Panasonic, Pioneer.
And these would be my personal choice if the given budget was around $300-$350 ( in the given order )
1 - http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/pna/v3/pg/product/details/0,,2076_310069882_338834008_tab=B,00.html?compName=PNA_V3_ProductDetailsComponent
2 - http://www.alpine-usa.com/US-en/products/product.php?model=CDA-9885&lang=en&tab=F
http://vault.alpine-usa.com/products/documents/OM_CDA-9885.pdf
Victor...
cplkittle on 03/11/2007 16:58:41
Has Blaupunkt increased their quality that much? I never saw a blau HU that I liked or was impressed with. I know Panasonic made some pretty drastic changes for the better.
I personally have a thing against pioneer now. After finding out the problems with their RCA outputs that was the icing on the cake. The biggest problem I have with pioneer is that almost their entire premier line is nothing more than their regular line with the premier name on it. Their premier components, subs and amplifiers are all EXACTLY the same as the regular line spec for spec. Except, of course, the price tag.
jamesp on 03/11/2007 17:29:11
I was asking about Pioneer Premier eariler. Many on line sellers have them listed numerically. For instance they have a 4800 and then a 480 Premier. a 5800 then a 580 Premier, 6800, 680Premier OK you get the point.At Sonicelectronics and other dealers the models are exactly the same price.. the 4 digit number and the 3 digit number units are the same price across the line.The customer service rep told me the Premier units are identical except they have blacked out face plates...
cplkittle on 03/11/2007 21:22:56
with that being said, I guess it is safe to assume that the premier line is strictly a cosmetic upgrade.
The only difference I have been able to find are the ts2000 and the ts5000spl subs. I don't know if they even make them anymore, but I only saw those in the premier line.
Victor on 03/12/2007 11:00:51
Regarding Blau, yessssss.. they have come a long way and have some really top notch head units....
and about pioneer and premier... you are right, they are identical units, except that the pioneer comes without any extra accessories ( its optional ) , and the premier comes with accessories like ipod cable , auto eq mic etc... the pioneer has 1 year warranty, where as all premier line products have 2 years on em...
they charge an extra 7.5% of more amount on the same model for the accessories and the extended warranty, this is what i have seen of them..
Am convinced that there is no difference , neither do they claim there to be a specification difference... its the consumer who gets it wrong,, "Premier" stands for "Premier warranty and service"...
copy/paste pioneer website..
"""""""""""""""""""""""""""
If you've searched around on our site and wondered why some of our car products read “Premier” versus our customary “Pioneer,” then read on. Pioneer's Premier® brand is more than just a label—it's Pioneer's cutting edge line of products.
When a product earns that Premier distinction, expect excellence
Besides being truly high quality products, Premier products are where new technologies are debuted . When you consider all the mobile electronics firsts that Pioneer has been responsible for, it's easy to see the need for the Premier line. If you're an early adopter and are eager to have the newest features and most exclusive technologies, Premier will have what you desire.
Beating the competition
Premier products are behind the 157,000 watts of power that emanate from the loudest car in the world. So those of you who are interested in performance should know that our Premier subs and amps can take the pressure of competition, and come out on top. And if you're looking for great audio quality – we offer that too – from engineers who have spent nearly 70 years developing speakers, Premier Reference Series (PRS) speakers and amplifiers set the standard.
Peace of mind
All of our Premier products are only available through hand-selected Premier retailers. These retailers are known for having highly informed salespeople and top-of-the-line customer service. If you're looking for specialty service, it's worth checking out our dealer locator to find one near you. Their expert installers will be able to answer your specific questions. So whether your '57 hot rod is due for a new system or you're swapping out the stock system in your brand new car, a Premier certified installer will guide you through the process.
Icing on the cake
All Premier-branded electronics products come with a 2-year warranty. And with Premier speakers and subwoofers, when installed by a Premier dealer, you'll get the added assurance of a 3-year extended warranty. So if you were to have your Premier system installed today, you can bet that it will sound just as good in 2008 as it does when you leave the shop today. See your Premier dealer for full details.
So how good does it sound?
Visit any of our Premier dealers and they will let your hear the difference for yourself.
"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""
Read how smartly this is written...
..dunno till what extent should this be considered a gimmick..
though they have smartly included their flagship products of Hu's Sub's , Amps, and Speakers under the "Premier" like, to create an illussion of a different line of product itself.. and also writen in a deceptive manner on the intro page to the premier line..
i would consider this a smart market move...
is it kinda worth paying for that extended warranty and ready supplied accessories...?? is a question the consumer needs to ask himself...
Victor...
If you see at it from a business perspective its a smart move and what ever they have done seems just right...
but if looking at it as a consumer,,, probably even I would say that they are not perfectly "RIGHT"....
swez on 03/12/2007 15:15:36
OK, he has defined his parameters and frankly, we all know that Alpine HU, Infinity, JBL amps and speakers can pretty much fill the whole bill here.
The dominant question is how much bass power you wish to have at your disposal? A single 10" or 12" sub or dual 10's can do very well in this vehicle w/o taking up too much space, demanding too much electrical power and fill in nicely with the Components/Coaxials of your choice. Here, a 300 - 500 watt amp is plenty.
After working with many here at CK and privately, have found the Infinity or JBL speaker and amp offerings are well above average. They both have 2 ohm Component systems for the front stage and you can use 4 ohm Coaxials for the back. This allows the most power to your front stage and good rear fill too. Here, a 4 channel amp that can deliver 75-90 watts RMS @ 2 ohms and 50-60 watts @ ohms, should be a nice match.
More later... gotta run for now.
Swez
Jess_ on 03/12/2007 23:26:03
Hey Guys,
I personally have always liked Alpine and I think I will get an Alpine HU.
I have heard that infinity is a good brand for door speakers.
I am all ears on suggestions for brands on Subs amps etc. As well as where you recommend I purchase these items at reasonable prices.
I am looking forward to listening to the final result.
Thanks
Jesse
swez on 03/13/2007 09:50:53
OK, let's look at speakers, amps and subs in that order:
Front stage Speakers:
http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_4295.html
Rear speakers:
http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_6176.html (6-1/2" 2-ways)
http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_6176.html (6-3/4" 2-ways)
Both use Component style, outboard crossovers and all are 2 ohm units so a smaller 4 channel power amp will drive them well.
====================================================
4 Channel Amp:
Infinity Reference 7541a (4 channel amp, 2 ohm stable, 139 Wrms x 4 channels) A strong amp with plenty of clean power available.
http://www.cardomain.com/item/INFREF7541A
====================================================
Sub amp: Can use Infinity Class D Mono amp here. These are stable at 2 ohms and can power many woofer arrangements.
Modest power: Infinity Reference 311a (300 Wrms + @ 2 ohms)
http://www.cardomain.com/item/INFREF311A
Strong Power: Infinity Reference 611a (600 Wrms + @ 2 ohms)
http://www.cardomain.com/item/INFREF611A
====================================================
Sub(s): You can get very good bass from a single 12 or Dual 10's. Sealed box designs are smaller and give tight bass response. Ported enclosures are larger and can be tuned for plenty of deep bass bump if so desired.
The question here, how much bass engine performance do you want? This 4 channel amp will draw about 35-40A's of current at normal listening levels and close to 55A's at full power.
Depending on the bass engine package you choose, 40-60 more amps of current are the norm. This means you'll need a strong electrical system to feed both amps and still meet the truck needs as well. Do you know the stock ALTERNATOR rating in this truck?
Swez
jamesp on 03/13/2007 10:37:38
Tip: Sonicelectronic also has and Ebay store...look for the items you are interested in there. They dont list all items, but the ones you find are at least 10 % cheaper some identical items are 25% cheaper than their regular on-line catalog.
Jess_ on 03/16/2007 08:46:21
Swez,
My Stock alternator is 130 AMP. Will I have enaough power to run my 2-amps without conflicting with the existing needs for the vehicle?
Jesse
cplkittle on 03/16/2007 14:39:46
130 is above average for most cars, however most of the alternators are rated at somewhere in the neighborhood of 10% above the vehicle needs.
My personal experinece with GM vehicles is that the factory battery sucks. In the 45-60 minutes it takes me to install a flip down screen, the battery dies just from having the doors open. and that is on ones straight from the dealership.
IMO doing the math on alt output, battery cca, amplifier current draw is usually a waste of time unless the current consumption is 3x the alternator output. The way I suggest charging system upgrades is to install the stereo equiptment, then note the problems. If the lights barely dim with bass, a yellow top battery will help ($200). If the lights go off, or the engine dies when the bass hits, you will probably need an alternator.
In your case, you are looking for solid bass, not to compete or show off. I would think a good battery will be all you need, but I wouldn't suggest buying it until you have everything up and running for about a month. You might not have any problems at all.
One more thing, My freind is a dealer for Pioneer and MTX, What is your recomendation on either of those for door speakers, amps and subs.
Thanks again for you assistance
Jesse
Replies (19)
Jess_ on 03/9/2007 11:24:06
In reading the forum I realised I could be more specific on what kind of help I am looking for.
Well I have never done this before since my brother in California did all my installs and I now live in Utah.
I like bass in my music LL Cool J, Miami Bass, old school etc.
what should i be looking for when buying my system.
where should i place my amps.
Since I like alot of different type of music I would like to have an EQ to control my sound. What is a good eq I could buy.
at this point i do not have a budget.
Thanks again
Jesse
swez on 03/9/2007 12:38:16
Good summary and starting point. There are so many options avilable these days and the prices range based on brand name, features and the quality of materials used.
The most evident upgrade will be a good set of Aftermarket speakers. With this in mind, consider a good set of Component speakers up front and perhaps Components or Coaxials in back. The better Coaxials come with good passive crossover networks. (Not just a low cost capacitor on the tweeter and perhaps a coil for the woofer)
The next aspect to consider, would be amping the speakers to get the most from them. A typical factory HU will deliver about 10-15 watts (RMS) power per speaker. If the vehicle has say a Bose Factory amp system, that might be closer to 25-40 watts RMS power per channel. (Not bad, but if you look at most factory speakers, they are pathetic compared to Aftermarket versions out there)
Does your truck have a Bose Premium sound system in it?
Swez
Jess_ on 03/9/2007 12:43:10
My truck does not have the Bose System. Because I use my Ipod alot, I am considering changing my deck to an Alpine that will control it right from the deck.
Do you think I can acomplish this with MTX and Pioneer Components?
Thanks for your quick assistance swez.
swez on 03/9/2007 13:58:06
Pioneer is best known for their radios and not a great option for anything but low power, average performance apps. There may be a few new products that would please most average listeners. But if you are a demanding audiophile in the making, don't look hard at Pioneer speakers.
MTX is a better option for power and better performance, depending on the price you can get from your source. This would be a nice option for your front doors:
http://www.cardomain.com/item/MTXTX6001
Rear doors, consider these as an option or use 2 pairs of Comps:
http://www.cardomain.com/item/MTXTDX6502
These options will require amping to get the most from them. (60 - 90 watts RMS/ch. is recommended here for max performance.
Comments?
Swez
LAMIRANDcca on 03/10/2007 03:25:04
Jesse, swez is right on the money. if u dont rilly care about the overall quality of ur music, chances are u dont posess the ear of an audiophile,
if u do on the other hand, go with jlaudio zr components all around, thier flagship 10 w7 and thier 1000/1 monoblock amp.
however, thats a down payment on a house, if moneys an issue go with swez's sugestions
Victor on 03/10/2007 06:39:27
Well, I would agree a bit and make a different suggestion here..
There are many brand there which are comparable, and many even better performing and some better priced too..
A lot of brand selection depends on what you are looking for in your system.
lets say you ask yourself a few questions before you start buying for your new system after reading this article
http://www.clubknowledge.com/Car_Audio_FAQ/?t31
1 - What am I aiming at? SPL - SQL - SQ ?
most of the people are pretty much SQL guys a bit of both the worlds, one cant think of a 50-50 SQL system but definitely try and balance it the best way one can.
Loudness is what most of the car audio geeks look for, Where as the choice of clean & crisp sound at moderate listening levels is what a serious audiophile would look for.. What world do u belong to?????
2 - This world belongs to the rich and famous.. how true this saying is..?? Budget constrains
This pre-dominantly guides the direction in which your system would go. If you can afford then there are some top notch manufacturers which make some serious sound equipments.why not get the best of the best available.
and If you are on a tight budget, then managing funds and looking for the Price / Performance ratio of a brand would really help u select a proper product.
3 - Affinity towards a few brands...??
If there are any, then our job becomes easier to suggest you teh best equipment available in that brand as per your budget.
If MTX and Pioneer are the only products u look at then Swez has guided you n the best possible manner.
If you are open to other brands then we can suggest u some few good products whose Price / Performance ration would be better than the ones u mentioned..
4 - How mouch do you actually require in your car..??
5 - How much time do you spend listening to music in your car..??
6 - What kind of music do you listen to???
7 - Are you into showing off your system in competitions or people around you..??
8 - Do you need a showy / jazzy install...??
9 - How good are you at installing the system yourself..?? fabrications?? availibility of tools and space..??
10 - Is some installer doing the job for you..?? Are you paying him?? is it worth it???
11 - Are you open to shopping on the internet ..??
12 - We can certainly guide you in the install, Are you willing to DIY..??
Jess_ .. Brands... ?? some make good HU's , some make good sub's , some make good speakers, and some good amps.. and a very few manufacturers make over all good above average range of products...
We would need more precise feedback to help us help u better
Welcome to CK.. COFFEE
Victor...
swez on 03/10/2007 07:59:27
Well said and AMEN Victor...
Jess, As was mentioned before, there's a wide range of gear out there to choose from and unless you can get MTX gear at almost dealer cost, there's a good chance we can design a top notch system for you within the budget range you have in mind.
Think this over carefully as you'll have to live with the situation in the end.
Swez
Jess_ on 03/11/2007 03:44:42
Thanks Victor,
I will anwser the questions in the order you wrote them.
1. I listen to a wide variety of music like, old school, Santana, Raggae. I guess I like to here base in my music. Not to loud but clear.
2. Budget- I have not set a budget. Since this will my first install I want to install mid-priced components. not to pricey but definettly not the cheapest.
3.I do not have to stay with pioneer nor MTX. Since I was going to get a small discount on those brands I thought about them. Please feel free to suggest the brands that would work for me.
4.I have a 2000 Yukon XL without the Bose system. I will need a Deck 2 Component 6.5' speakers and 2 individual 6.5" Speakers. 2-Subs and 1-Amp for door speakers and Mono amp for Subs.
5. I commute 45 minutes each way to work and use my Yukon when traveling so I listen to my Car audio a lot.
6. I listen to a wide range in music, Old school (gap band), Santana, Radio R&B, Even southern rock.
7. this system is for my self. Definetly not to show it off because I have learned thats when people go off to get your stuff. But I love Bass in my music.
8. Looking for the best install for my vehicle. Keep in mind this is my first install and i need guidance on what parts i will need to purchase to make this happen.
9. I understand signal flow and the concept behind stereo to amps to speakers. Since this will be my test I want to do it right the first time.
10. I will do the install
11. If you advice me shopping online I will consider.
12. I am looking forward to being inside my car until I am done with this install. I really apreciate all of your assistance in making this fun and doable.
Keep in mind I am open to the brands you all recomend for this install..
Thanks again
Jesse
Victor on 03/11/2007 06:05:48
Thanks for your detailed reply Jesse.. Now that we know what you exactly want...
Lets look at HU's first..
Alpine, Blaupunkt, Clarion, Eclipse, Kenwood, Panasonic, Pioneer Premier, Pioneer.
These are reputed head unit manufacturers and make some of the finest units in the market.
What brand to select out of this is another question, but what u actually need in a HU is somethign very different.
Cassette players, CD players, MP3, DVD etc...?
for installation flexibility u shud by a HU with 3 sets of RCA pre-outs , ( front , rear, Sub-out )
look for the pre-out voltage, usually low to mid segment units have the pre-out voltage around 2 volts.These fall in the range of $100 to $300
the above average HU's which fall in a higher category and can be bought $ 300 - $500 for retail, these units have the pre-out voltage between 4v to 5v.
and some really high end units carry pre-out voltage upto 8volts..
higher pre-out voltage means cleaner sound.
Next thing one wud look in HU's is D/A convertors, These Digital to analogue convertors are the heart of the processing unit of the HU.
most of the HU's in the market use a 1bit D/A convertor, where as some of the better products use 24 bit burrbrown D/A convertors.
If you are not into competition or serious audiophile listening then an HU with a 1 bit DAC is more than enuf.
Other thigns like fine tuning the sound, equalizing capabilities, automatic sound adjusting, bass treble control, adjustable crossovers etc are always a bonus that come at a certain price.
If I were to do a moderate system, I would select HU brands in the following order.
Alpine, Pioneer Premier, Blaupunkt, Clarion, Kenwood, Eclipse, Panasonic, Pioneer.
And these would be my personal choice if the given budget was around $300-$350 ( in the given order )
1 - http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/pna/v3/pg/product/details/0,,2076_310069882_338834008_tab=B,00.html?compName=PNA_V3_ProductDetailsComponent
2 - http://www.alpine-usa.com/US-en/products/product.php?model=CDA-9885&lang=en&tab=F
http://vault.alpine-usa.com/products/documents/OM_CDA-9885.pdf
Victor...
cplkittle on 03/11/2007 16:58:41
Has Blaupunkt increased their quality that much? I never saw a blau HU that I liked or was impressed with. I know Panasonic made some pretty drastic changes for the better.
I personally have a thing against pioneer now. After finding out the problems with their RCA outputs that was the icing on the cake. The biggest problem I have with pioneer is that almost their entire premier line is nothing more than their regular line with the premier name on it. Their premier components, subs and amplifiers are all EXACTLY the same as the regular line spec for spec. Except, of course, the price tag.
jamesp on 03/11/2007 17:29:11
I was asking about Pioneer Premier eariler. Many on line sellers have them listed numerically. For instance they have a 4800 and then a 480 Premier. a 5800 then a 580 Premier, 6800, 680Premier OK you get the point.At Sonicelectronics and other dealers the models are exactly the same price.. the 4 digit number and the 3 digit number units are the same price across the line.The customer service rep told me the Premier units are identical except they have blacked out face plates...
cplkittle on 03/11/2007 21:22:56
with that being said, I guess it is safe to assume that the premier line is strictly a cosmetic upgrade.
The only difference I have been able to find are the ts2000 and the ts5000spl subs. I don't know if they even make them anymore, but I only saw those in the premier line.
Victor on 03/12/2007 11:00:51
Regarding Blau, yessssss.. they have come a long way and have some really top notch head units....
and about pioneer and premier... you are right, they are identical units, except that the pioneer comes without any extra accessories ( its optional ) , and the premier comes with accessories like ipod cable , auto eq mic etc... the pioneer has 1 year warranty, where as all premier line products have 2 years on em...
they charge an extra 7.5% of more amount on the same model for the accessories and the extended warranty, this is what i have seen of them..
Am convinced that there is no difference , neither do they claim there to be a specification difference... its the consumer who gets it wrong,, "Premier" stands for "Premier warranty and service"...
copy/paste pioneer website..
"""""""""""""""""""""""""""
If you've searched around on our site and wondered why some of our car products read “Premier” versus our customary “Pioneer,” then read on. Pioneer's Premier® brand is more than just a label—it's Pioneer's cutting edge line of products.
When a product earns that Premier distinction, expect excellence
Besides being truly high quality products, Premier products are where new technologies are debuted . When you consider all the mobile electronics firsts that Pioneer has been responsible for, it's easy to see the need for the Premier line. If you're an early adopter and are eager to have the newest features and most exclusive technologies, Premier will have what you desire.
Beating the competition
Premier products are behind the 157,000 watts of power that emanate from the loudest car in the world. So those of you who are interested in performance should know that our Premier subs and amps can take the pressure of competition, and come out on top. And if you're looking for great audio quality – we offer that too – from engineers who have spent nearly 70 years developing speakers, Premier Reference Series (PRS) speakers and amplifiers set the standard.
Peace of mind
All of our Premier products are only available through hand-selected Premier retailers. These retailers are known for having highly informed salespeople and top-of-the-line customer service. If you're looking for specialty service, it's worth checking out our dealer locator to find one near you. Their expert installers will be able to answer your specific questions. So whether your '57 hot rod is due for a new system or you're swapping out the stock system in your brand new car, a Premier certified installer will guide you through the process.
Icing on the cake
All Premier-branded electronics products come with a 2-year warranty. And with Premier speakers and subwoofers, when installed by a Premier dealer, you'll get the added assurance of a 3-year extended warranty. So if you were to have your Premier system installed today, you can bet that it will sound just as good in 2008 as it does when you leave the shop today. See your Premier dealer for full details.
So how good does it sound?
Visit any of our Premier dealers and they will let your hear the difference for yourself.
"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""
Read how smartly this is written...
..dunno till what extent should this be considered a gimmick..
though they have smartly included their flagship products of Hu's Sub's , Amps, and Speakers under the "Premier" like, to create an illussion of a different line of product itself.. and also writen in a deceptive manner on the intro page to the premier line..
i would consider this a smart market move...
is it kinda worth paying for that extended warranty and ready supplied accessories...?? is a question the consumer needs to ask himself...
Victor...
If you see at it from a business perspective its a smart move and what ever they have done seems just right...
but if looking at it as a consumer,,, probably even I would say that they are not perfectly "RIGHT"....
swez on 03/12/2007 15:15:36
OK, he has defined his parameters and frankly, we all know that Alpine HU, Infinity, JBL amps and speakers can pretty much fill the whole bill here.
The dominant question is how much bass power you wish to have at your disposal? A single 10" or 12" sub or dual 10's can do very well in this vehicle w/o taking up too much space, demanding too much electrical power and fill in nicely with the Components/Coaxials of your choice. Here, a 300 - 500 watt amp is plenty.
After working with many here at CK and privately, have found the Infinity or JBL speaker and amp offerings are well above average. They both have 2 ohm Component systems for the front stage and you can use 4 ohm Coaxials for the back. This allows the most power to your front stage and good rear fill too. Here, a 4 channel amp that can deliver 75-90 watts RMS @ 2 ohms and 50-60 watts @ ohms, should be a nice match.
More later... gotta run for now.
Swez
Jess_ on 03/12/2007 23:26:03
Hey Guys,
I personally have always liked Alpine and I think I will get an Alpine HU.
I have heard that infinity is a good brand for door speakers.
I am all ears on suggestions for brands on Subs amps etc. As well as where you recommend I purchase these items at reasonable prices.
I am looking forward to listening to the final result.
Thanks
Jesse
swez on 03/13/2007 09:50:53
OK, let's look at speakers, amps and subs in that order:
Front stage Speakers:
http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_4295.html
Rear speakers:
http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_6176.html (6-1/2" 2-ways)
http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_6176.html (6-3/4" 2-ways)
Both use Component style, outboard crossovers and all are 2 ohm units so a smaller 4 channel power amp will drive them well.
====================================================
4 Channel Amp:
Infinity Reference 7541a (4 channel amp, 2 ohm stable, 139 Wrms x 4 channels) A strong amp with plenty of clean power available.
http://www.cardomain.com/item/INFREF7541A
====================================================
Sub amp: Can use Infinity Class D Mono amp here. These are stable at 2 ohms and can power many woofer arrangements.
Modest power: Infinity Reference 311a (300 Wrms + @ 2 ohms)
http://www.cardomain.com/item/INFREF311A
Strong Power: Infinity Reference 611a (600 Wrms + @ 2 ohms)
http://www.cardomain.com/item/INFREF611A
====================================================
Sub(s): You can get very good bass from a single 12 or Dual 10's. Sealed box designs are smaller and give tight bass response. Ported enclosures are larger and can be tuned for plenty of deep bass bump if so desired.
The question here, how much bass engine performance do you want? This 4 channel amp will draw about 35-40A's of current at normal listening levels and close to 55A's at full power.
Depending on the bass engine package you choose, 40-60 more amps of current are the norm. This means you'll need a strong electrical system to feed both amps and still meet the truck needs as well. Do you know the stock ALTERNATOR rating in this truck?
Swez
jamesp on 03/13/2007 10:37:38
Tip: Sonicelectronic also has and Ebay store...look for the items you are interested in there. They dont list all items, but the ones you find are at least 10 % cheaper some identical items are 25% cheaper than their regular on-line catalog.
Jess_ on 03/16/2007 08:46:21
Swez,
My Stock alternator is 130 AMP. Will I have enaough power to run my 2-amps without conflicting with the existing needs for the vehicle?
Jesse
cplkittle on 03/16/2007 14:39:46
130 is above average for most cars, however most of the alternators are rated at somewhere in the neighborhood of 10% above the vehicle needs.
My personal experinece with GM vehicles is that the factory battery sucks. In the 45-60 minutes it takes me to install a flip down screen, the battery dies just from having the doors open. and that is on ones straight from the dealership.
IMO doing the math on alt output, battery cca, amplifier current draw is usually a waste of time unless the current consumption is 3x the alternator output. The way I suggest charging system upgrades is to install the stereo equiptment, then note the problems. If the lights barely dim with bass, a yellow top battery will help ($200). If the lights go off, or the engine dies when the bass hits, you will probably need an alternator.
In your case, you are looking for solid bass, not to compete or show off. I would think a good battery will be all you need, but I wouldn't suggest buying it until you have everything up and running for about a month. You might not have any problems at all.
Copyright ClubKnowledge 2009 * All Rights Reserved
