Any opinions on these Alpine type R components? Im very happy with the 12"type R sub I have .Im happy with the P series Rockford components I have up front but my rear fill speakers are junk. I am only giving them a fracion of the gain compared to my fronts, they are 4 way Sonys and are almost as muddy as the factory speakers were. here is a link to the Alpine components...and would a pair of 6.5" be better for any reason than the 6x8's? My Rockford components really hit the mids hard but the metal tweeters are a bit harsh sometimes. If the Alpines are good, they have a better tweeter attenuation setup and soft dome tweets. I could move the Rockfords to the back and put these up front.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=260083703205&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:IT&ih=016
Another question that I have concerns the inevitable, the head unit replacement. Will a decent quality aftermarket unit with 4-6v outputs automatically improve the sound of my system? I think the equalization ability will enable sound improvement but I am wondering if since I rewired my speakers directly to the 4 channel amp, if I remove the LOC and put in a decent head unit if it will make a noticable improvement. I love the fact that I have no engine noise or static at all but I would really like to be able to play mp3 discs and plug in my mp3 player. FM stations with poor reception dont sound better when amplified. What would you guys suggest? Thanks. JamesP
Replies (60)
cplkittle on 02/10/2007 18:29:11
I have always liked the sound of the type R components. The only negative thing I have to say about them is the textured cone on the mid drivers dampens the music a little compared to a solid plastic or metal cone drivers. The soft dome tweets are really sweet sounding though. As far as a difference in sound over a 6x8.. the round speaker will sound better. You get a little more midbass out of the 6x8 because of the larger surface area of the cone, but it dosen't stay clean at high volume like a round speaker.
You will notice a huge difference with an aftermarket HU as long as you buy a quality name brand unit. There are also FM boosters on the market, the only problem with them is sometimes stations further away can bleed into local stations a bit. If you install one, put a switch on it so it can be turned off. Also, some of them will not pick up AM at all.
swez on 02/10/2007 22:01:00
Dunno... installed a pair of 6x8 Infinity Coaxials w/outboard x-overs in an F-150 last summer. They were powered by a JL 300/4 and frankly, they sounded awesome and very punchy above 80 Hz.
This vehicle was well matted too. The front and rear doors and back wall only. We did not need to do the floor/roof as they were well padded well.
We also used 5.25" CDT Classic Comps up front. The silk dome tweets were very smooth, but the woofer just did not do as well with lows in the stock door locations. Very good mids, but below 120 Hz., they lacked some of the kick we were hearing in the rear speakers. A tad more power and some additional EQ would have helped, but to my ears, the CDT's probably needed a more controlled enclosure than a matted door panel.
Yes, an Aftermarket HU would definitely be a step up in overall performance here too. Adding some decent EQ will tone down the RF tweets up front. (5-15KHz range) If you wired things up well to begin with, noise problems should be nill. Proper grounds between the new HU and amp(s) is/are key to noise free setups.
We used a Nakamichi CD 400, (Very nice... simple, sleek and elegant HU) and coupled this with an outboard Bahn AEQ6 EQ/Line Driver. The LD gave up to 8 volts of signal to his 300/4 and 500/1 JL amps.
We both liked the no-menu messing around for EQ and channel allocation features. (Balance, fade, Master volume and Sub volume controls & EQ bands) Everything was in the dash and looked great and easy to adjust on the fly. This EQ also has an AUX input feature so one can easliy add MP3 or I-pod players if desired.
Comments?
Swez
jamesp on 02/10/2007 22:50:59
Thanks for the replies. Its kind of funny that when I first replaced the factory speakers a couple of months I actually that the speakers I bought sounded pretty good, I put Blauplunkt 3 ways in the front and those 4 ways in the back. I wondered why there were not any of the more expensive speakers in the Crutchfield catalog that were 3 way. I really like my RF fronts I just thought that since the back ones are so bad that ihat it mught be worthwhile to do some changung. What I probably should do is get a good set of coaxials for the back and start checking out head units. I enjoy learning my equipment but dont like scrolling through a biunch of menus each time a minor tweak is needed.
Swez, I ripped a disc of bass songs from the list in the FAQ's and I do believe my sub is broken in. I went to pick up pizza eariler tonight and had it bumpin pretty hard, I reached back with my right hand(in the dark) to feel the amount of movement and I stuck my finger in the wrong place and it jammed up my finger....I didnt know those things were dangerous. I like that sub/amp combo a lotGRIN
Blue_Oval on 02/11/2007 02:28:08
Dunno... installed a pair of 6x8 Infinity Coaxials w/outboard x-overs in an F-150 last summer. They were powered by a JL 300/4 and frankly, they sounded awesome and very punchy above 80 Hz.
Man this sounds vaguely familiar. Ha ha.
swez on 02/11/2007 11:56:35
Well, speak of the devil and he appears...hehe Good to see ya back on the board there Blue Oval.
Hoping you are as satisfied now as when the system was first installed? That was a very good project and we all learned in the process. Your rig has more or less become a personal reference point for what a good SQL system is all about!
Swez
jamesp on 02/11/2007 18:20:23
I will be giving up my CD changer with a new head unit so I really want Mp3 capability. Also, If I get a head unit with pre outs for a sub, would it be better to run a new patch cable from the head unit to the sub amp or just leave the 1 meter RCA from my 4 channel amp to my sub amp? Oh well, a new set of speakers and a head unit will give me something to keep my interest level up and something to look forward to.
Blue_Oval on 02/11/2007 18:31:36
Ha ha......Thanks Swez. Indeed, sure was an excellent learning experience. Obviously, I couldn't have done any of it without you and the all the great help here. Nothing like hands on work. While that project had somewhat of a "Ginny pig" aspect to it, I really don't see how it could have turned out any better. 6 months conceived, then born to rip your head off, which it does.
Only caveat, maybe a tad bit more front SQ. Rubbing hands together--We fix O master of SQ. hahahaha!!!
jamesp on 02/11/2007 18:31:49
What about these???
http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_6940.html
Blue_Oval on 02/11/2007 18:55:01
What about these???
I think the Kappas 680.7cs have a better quality crossover. Not only for the Xer's themselves. But I noticed the added feature of "flick a switch for an instant 3dB to the highs. That's a very nice feature. I also think the Kappa Xer's will hold up much better do to the harsh weather environment. This, obviously, is very dependent on where you choose to mount them.
jamesp on 02/11/2007 20:52:42
OK, took the cover off my RF-450.4 amp and found that I had the crossover frequency too high on my front channels...I set it down to about 75-80Hz and it improved the sound a bit. I realize that this had no effect on the tweeters but it improved the sound to me for now anyway.lol The Alpine type R's that I first liked also come in the 6-3/4 and the 5-1/4 but I see there is a line of SPR 17S(6.75') and 13S (5.25") and then there is the SPR 17LS and SPR 13LS. The LS line does have the adjustable crossover settings but are much cheaper than the "S" only line. Crutchfield has only the more expensive ones. The crossovers on the "S "line of R typeI look to be pretty substantial. have not heard any of them of course. If I get a set that sound better than the Rockfords and put them in back, I will have a killer sounding system. I know Im not a qualified judge of sound quality, but Ill be happy.
A good ,fairly simple, quality head unit that is satellite radio compatible and Mp3 player adaptable and will play wma and Mp3 files will make me happy....what do think?...Thanks
PS I used velcro to attach the RF crossovers to the factory plastic door lining material against a solid backing and there is good clearance between them and the door panels. I think I can do the same thing in the back and be completly dry and protected.
swez on 02/11/2007 23:20:55
Depending on the HU you choose, running an extra pair of sub outs might well be in order. Some HU's have bass enhancement circuits that are only available off the sub channels. Those who don't have this feature, you can do as mentioned and save some efforts. Many of the better sub amps have bass EQ circuits and a remote bass control at the dash. You can do either with very good results.
Many of the better HU's have IP-Bus or AUX inputs for MP3, DVD or I-pods now. Yes, it's nice to have a CD changer, but now that MP3's are getting better and the advent of I-Pods, leaves most CD changers in the dust.
The Infinity Kappa series Comps are the next level up on the Ref Series. The ones noted are fine and would do a very nice job though. However, the Kappa 2 ohm series definitely a step up for higher SPL. The 2 ohm load allows the amp deliver more power VS a 4 ohm speaker for most 2/4 channel amps.
The Alpine Comps are fine for some folks and they are a nice speaker set. However, after a few years with them, know more than a few who swapped them out for Kappas, Polk Momo's, Diamonds or CDT's HD Series. They (Kappa 2/4 ohms) take more power, better x-overs and you can get them in 2 ohm models when amping. (But not off the HU only.... need 4 ohm models there)
There are a few exceptions... JL's Slash series and Phoenix Gold's Xenon series. These have special power supplies that can deliver the same clarity and power to 1.5 to 4 ohm speakers w/o power losses.
Velcro is fine for attaching crossovers inside the door panels. The key is to keep window seepage moisture away from your crossovers. As long as the windows seal and drain well, most installs will be good for many years.
Swez
jamesp on 02/12/2007 07:18:59
Hi Swez, is it possible to have a 2 Ohm load on the front channels and a 4 Ohm load on the rear channels of my RF 450.4? Thanks for the advice.? What Hu's look good to you these days?
swez on 02/12/2007 11:54:42
Yes, this amp will handle 2 ohms up front, (More power where it's needed most) and 4 ohms in rear are fine. That way, one can adjust amp gains for good fade control between F/R speakers.
Tech Tip: Rear speakers often come on stronger than front stage speakers due to factory locations. GM often compensates for this by using stock 4 ohm speaker in front and 10 ohm speakers in back. Am not sure how Ford does this.
As for good HU's I like the Pioneer Premier line, Kenwood is good as are Eclipse and Alpine. Hop over to Crutchfield and read up on the features. Once you find a few that please, we can look at the install/operations manuals and then decide what makes the most sense to you.
Swez
PS Ford has a better idea when it comes to removing factory HU's. Very simple tools are needed and a conversion harness.
jamesp on 02/12/2007 12:57:02
You know, I never found a reference to a pic or diagram that shows the same 2 style plugs that my factory head unit has. Does the CD changer make it different. I can pop it out in a few seconds.I should be able to access everything I need right fro the 4 way LOC to drop a new unit in....
I cant tell the difference in Pioneer models. Many have model numbers like a DEH P6800MP...then there is a DEH P680MP that says "premier" but has the same description. like 4800 and a premier 480.
Is the "ezy eq" sufficient or does that mean non adjustable? Is 4v outs enough? 5v's? one Eclipse has 8v pre amp outs. I sure do ask a lot of questions, dont I...Thanks
swez on 02/12/2007 15:23:51
The P6800MP has good features and same with the P680MP. It mostly boils down to cost and preferences.
EZ EQ is 5 preset EQ curves. It also has 2 customized settings the user can manipulat and save as desired. These are all menu driven too. A bit cumbersome initially, but after a few days of fiddling, you'll know what sounds best for most music you like. The "Powerful" preset seems to be a good general set and forget.
Here's the manual for this model. Have a look and just take your time. You probably won't use the HU crossovers and Loudness controls though. Can play with these features, but they do some things that you may/may not not really like.
http://akamaipix.crutchfield.com/Manuals/130/130DEHP680.PDF
As for the preamp voltages stated, these tend to be a bit misleading. Some makers state 4.0 volt preamps @ 100 ohm amp impedance. Most amps are more like 10 KOhms. The main thing, your amps have enough sensitivity range to deliver full power with the signals off the HU. Most amps can handle as low as 1/4 volt, (250 mV's) and be just swell.
Wait for Kittle or ttocs to weigh in on your specific install needs. I have a hunch they will tell you to wire with RCA's only and delete the speaker outputs that have been factory amped.
Swez
jamesp on 02/13/2007 11:46:39
So, it may be possible to tape off the speaker level inputs to the LOC , unplug the RCA's from the LOC and plug those RCA's right into the new Head Unit. The speakers are already wired directly from the RF amps outputs...and Ill be good to go. If that is the case it will be an easy install. I could run 1 new pair of RCA to the sub amp from the HU if I get one w/ 3 outs if that would improve that area. I have the bass boost from the 600.1bd on the dash now. Could it be that easy???
swez on 02/13/2007 11:53:17
Yes, it is just that simple. You'll use only the RCA out on an Aftermarket HU.
Since we believe this stock system is factory amped, all that is needed, is to remove your LOC, cap off the wires or reslice them as they once were and then be sure to disconnect the REMote trigger wire for the factory amp(s). This will shut off the amp(s) and they are ready to use if you ever sell the vehicle and want to keep your aftermarket gear.
Swez
jamesp on 02/14/2007 19:05:03
This HU looks pretty good to me. Of course the 8000 series looks better. What do y'all think. Crutchfield doesnt have this model so I cant find a manual to download. I think Ill do just a new head unit first and worry about new rear speakers later. Thanks
http://cgi.ebay.com/NEW-ECLIPSE-CD4000-CD-MP3-WMA-PLAYER-iPod-SIRIUS-READY_W0QQitemZ300079224923QQihZ020QQcategoryZ18798QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
cplkittle on 02/14/2007 20:39:33
This one looks pretty nice. It should do the job.
That is a pretty nice price also.
jamesp on 02/14/2007 21:51:36
This looks like a good deal on these 2 Ohm Kappas..wonder if the seller is legit...I would need to put these up front @2Ohms and put my Rockford Fosgate comps in the back..I can send 100 watts to them
http://cgi.ebay.com/INFINITY-KAPPA-680-7CS-5x7-6x8-270-W-COMPONENT-SPEAKER_W0QQitemZ280068473982QQcmdZViewItem#OUR%20TRIPLE%20TREAT%20HOLIDAY%20SEASON%20BONANZA
swez on 02/15/2007 00:32:40
Now you have a real plan going here James. This is a solid set of Comps, your RF amp will deliver the power at 2 ohms for the front stage and just move the RF speakers to the rear.
Can you review all the gear you now have and are planning to add in this post. This will help us keep everything straight and make sure we are recommending the best possible options for your install?
Thanks,
Swez
jamesp on 02/15/2007 11:53:16
What I have so far is a factory head unit w/ 6 disc changer. Crutchfield says this system has a single factory amp based on the fact that the HU has a button labeled "Auto Set" on it. I cant verify that as I have yet to see a diagram that has the same connector plug configuration that my HU has. I black square plug w/ approx 15 wires and a thin long rectangular plug with 6 wires.I used a Scosch SLC4 LOC to utilize a 4 way RCA cord to the :
RF 450.4 amp
RF 6x8 Punch components up front..(loud and clear)
Sony 6x8 4 way in back..(junk)
Bass is provided by:
RF 600.1bd daisy chained to the 4 channel amp
Alpine 12" type R sub in a sealed box(totally happy with this)
So far, these amps have not even been warm to the touch so the must be adequately wired and not be under amped..They always seem to be at ambient temp.
Planning to add 6x8 Infinity Kappa Comps @ 2 Ohms up front and put the Rf's in back and possibly an Eclipse 4000 or maybe 5000 HU.
Im really happy with the whole setup except the rear channels speakers but I want Mp3 ability, some Eq and the ability to use my Sandisc flash Mp3 players with my system. I am hoping, of course for even better SQ with an aftermarket HU. I just cant say "there, Im done", yet. I probably will not say that for a while because I do like to tinker and am going to build a ported box for the sub to see what difference that makes.Thanks for all the help and advice.
swez on 02/15/2007 12:56:16
Beautiful! That RF450.4 is spec'd at 110 watts into a 2 ohm load and 60 watts @ 4 ohms. Knowing RF, these numbers are probably a bit conservative to what you are actually getting on their birth sheets. This should give a nice balance/fade performance factor to your new Infinity Comps and the RF's in the rear.
Looks like the next thing on the list will be your new HU. That should be relatively easy too. Ford makes it real easy to swap HU's. Plan on spending many hours tinkering and adjusting things once you get it all installed. This should keep you busy and out of wifey's hair for a while too.... Hehe
It's always a pleasure to have a good student at the table. It makes our tasks a whole bunch easier and much more enjoyable too. ;-)
Swez
jamesp on 02/15/2007 19:10:06
I just ordered the Eclipse 5000 from Sonicelectronic for a few more bucks than the 4000 model. I didnt order the speakers yet. They would not match that best price on the Kappas I found because"they are sold on an internet auction site" and the ad also says they are new 2005 stock. I dont really blame them. The head unit is several bucks cheaper on Sonics ebay site than thier regular web site too. This thing has feature descriptions that I cant even begin to know what they do...Here is a link if anybody is interested...I dont know what the box shaped device coming out of the back of the unit(shown in the detail pics) does. The 4000 model doesnt have one. What do you guys think..?
http://cgi.ebay.com/NEW-ECLIPSE-CD5000-CD-MP3-WMA-PLAYER-iPod-SIRIUS-READY_W0QQitemZ300079619260QQihZ020QQcategoryZ18798QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
JamesP #:)*
jamesp on 02/15/2007 20:29:19
I see that Crutchfield has recently reduced the price of this unit by $200.00, so it must be a discontinued model. It uses a rather obscure style of memory stick also but I think I will like a lot or some of the features it has...I hope so anyway......
swez on 02/16/2007 00:30:12
Crutch does list that model and if you want to look at the manual and read up on things, here it is:
http://akamaipix.crutchfield.com/Manuals/099/099CD5000.PDF
This is 111 pages long dude. Happy reading huh?
Man, this is a sweet HU. It has a load of nice features and should keep you busy trying them out as you go. Time alignment, DSP, 7 band Parametric EQ, HP/LP filters, 3 pair RCA's, Memory stick for Nav features and security... basically a 7 course meal here Jimmy. WOW!!!
Swez
jamesp on 02/16/2007 09:08:53
Swez, I downloaded the manual the other day. I think there are 4 saveable seating positions to choose from on the time alignment feature. This should work better than my balance button, right to left, I would think. You can save your security code/unlock info on CD-R or memory stick..not too worried about that...dont know what what DSP does yet.Got a bit to learn here I just hope the wiring harness is correct. They are sending Scosche FDK-10 and FDK-10B. The sales person said that almost all Lariats had "premium" sound...Been looking at harnesses' on line and none of the F-150 1997 stuff looks just right. The closest thing I have seen, though with small pics it is hard to tell, is a harness for the Explorer line. You would think the Expeditions would be the same as my truck..Oh well, I will see soon...Thanks.....JamesP
swez on 02/16/2007 16:48:54
DSP is Digital Sound Processing. This is a very nice feature and you'll love the things it can do. It allows one to change dull, dry and flat sounding vehicles to a large venue feel like a staduim, live concerts/ night club and Cathedral ambianeces.
I cannot say on the harnesses what will be needed here. Perhaps Kittle, UK Installer or ttocs can help fill in that gap for you.
Swez
jamesp on 02/16/2007 20:39:50
I should have this next Wednesday. I ordered it about 7pm EST last night and it was picked up and had departed LA by 1 AM. The other stuff I ordered from them went out quickly too.
I think Ill wait on the speakers, if I can make myself. That way, Ill have another project to look forward to.GRIN
swez on 02/16/2007 23:26:15
Sure, no need to break the bank or do everything in one fell swoop. (Or is that One swell Poop?) LOL I get those two sayings mixed up... Anyway... long day and I am pretty washed out. Think better tomorrow after a good snooze.
As you wish sir...
Swez
jamesp on 02/21/2007 08:12:48
My Eclipse CD 5000 is being delivered today.
I found out that the reason this model was so deeply discounted is because there is a CD 5001model out although there doesnt seem to be any of the newer model in stock anywhere. The main difference in the 2 units is that the Memory Stick format used w/ the CD 5000 model has been replaced buy a USB port. Since the memory stick format on the unit I am getting is not real popular or available with a lot of capacity the USB feature would be better for sure. That said, Im comfortable with the fact that once I have this thing set up the way I want it, I can save everything on the removable memory and burn it to a CD-R for backup. Ill probably not utilize all the features available as is but will enjoy dinking around with them.
Im sure Ill have some questions for setup and install..anyone here familar with these systems. Supposedly the pre amp outs are super low resistance, < 50 Ohms, and are 8 volts. I assume that Ill need to turn my amp gains down all the way on initial start up and go from there. Im sure I dont have much voltage between the factory head unit speaker level inputs to the 4 way LOC that sends the signal to my amps now...I wonder if the adjustable 6 to18dB/octave crossovers work well on the unit. If so do I set my amp crossovers to All Pass or use them in conjunction w/ one another.....Any advice??? Thanks...JamesP
jamesp on 02/21/2007 15:27:24
I broke down and ordered the pair of Infinity Kappa 680.7 cs 2 Ohm components a few minutes ago. Ill put my RF comps in the back and put these up front. I should have a decent system when Im done......I hope....GRIN
swez on 02/21/2007 21:39:58
Oh yes, you will definitely like the Infinity's up front as noted. The tweeters are not silk, so you may find yourself reaching for the Custom EQ functions in the Eclipse 5000 HU to tone them down a tad.
These Infinity's have good dispersion characteristics with the M.M.D. (Metal Matrix Dome) type tweeter. It may be a bit bright up front initially, but you can tone it down via the supplied crossover or attenuate as needed with EQ.
In all, I think you will be very happy with this change, after some time and tweaking the system Jimmy.
Swez
jamesp on 02/22/2007 21:22:09
It looks to me like like I only will use 1 of the connection harness adapters to get power, ground, illumination etc and just tape off the factory harness speaker wires and add 1more pair of USB patch cords for my sub and Ill be bumpin in style...does that sound about right?
Of course I now wish I had ordered the speakers together with the head unit..then I could install all of it this weekend. I tried to use a bit of self restraint.. and failed as usual...GRIN....oh well.
swez on 02/22/2007 23:10:28
Starting on page 104 of the manual shows the wiring diagram to be used.
http://akamaipix.crutchfield.com/Manuals/099/099CD5000.PDF
Here, you'll only need the following wires:
RED: ACC/IGN trigger
YELLOW: Constant +12 volt supply line
BLACK: Ground to metal in dash
BLUE/wt. stripe: REMote trigger feed line to amps
ORANGE: Not Connected (Optional but may cause noise)
Antenna: D'oh... need that too
You will also be using all 3 pairs of RCA outputs to your 4 channel amp and sub amp. No speaker lines in the HU harness are used. (Tape these off and get them out of your way.
Self-restraint? What's that? That is only possible when we are cash poor or have vast amounts of "Won't Power". Otherwise, this does not apply. GRIN and press on if neither apply.
You mentioned USB cables? I take it you meant to say RCA cables or no?
Swez
PS This HU can do just about anything but cook your dinner. Study the Install & User's manuals as needed. This will give you enough time to ponder while wating for your Infinity Comps to arrive. LOL
PSS Have you done much bowling in years gone by? This manual is 111 pages long. What does 111 mean in bowling parlance? LOL
jamesp on 02/23/2007 08:26:27
USB,RCA, hmm, I cant even blame that one on my dyslexia..Maybe wishful thinking since the new Eclipse models use USB instead of the goofy Sony Memory Stick. I do have a couple of Sony MS's. 16 whole mb each. Ill just use the stick for the security feature probably
I have a question..,I know, rare for me but...my antenna connector at the head unit pulled out of the clip/cage. The "clip" stayed in the radio. I pulled the clip out and it appears that there is a plastic insulator/isolator piece that keeps the solid cener stinger wire in position. Can I buy a replacement end piece for this or do I replace the whole antenna? It looks like it will be tough to fish a new stiff antenna wire into position even if I pull a string through from the inside when removing the stock antenna...I can probably rig up a rubber bushing to replace the broken plastic isolator piece if I have to....Thanks
Swez, dont know much about the bowling thing...111 is that all spares?? Never have bowled much..
swez on 02/23/2007 13:37:57
Oppps, have a boo-boo here Jim. You should be able to find a replacement antenna "jack" for this one at Radio Shack or an electronic supply dealer that caters to CB and various antenna connector needs
http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&Partnumber=090-455
These are coaxial cable connectors. This means we have a single center wire, (Stinger wire as you say) which is insulated in heavy plastic and wrapped over with a braided wire jacket and a cover insulator. Some are solderable while others are just crimp and go.
In bowling, 111 means their game is in the crapper if it pops up in the 9th or 10th frames. But if we see this one in the 4th or 5th frame, the bowler is on their way to a very good game. (200 +)
Swez
PS My best game ever, rolled a 300 and one
jamesp on 02/24/2007 18:22:54
There are probably many, many head units that I would be happy with, but my first day impression of the new Eclipse unit is that I made a great choice. I love this thing. I am able to turn the gains on my amps down 30% and have all the vo;umne Ill ever need x 2. I showed it to a couple of guys at the shop where I bought my RF components and they acted impressed. I realise that I have not had the opportunity to listen to a lot of quality 12V audio, but this system sounds very good. If the Infinity comps I have ordered sound better than the RF's that I am moving to the back Ill have an impressive SQL system. Thanks for all the suggestions and for steering me in the right direction. I like being a happy camperGRIN GRIN GRIN = big grin
swez on 02/24/2007 18:34:19
I take it you got that antenna jack fixed? If you like it now, wait til you install the Infinity Comps and move the RF's to the back.
Will feel about the same when I get a new 9', 2-3 pc., #5 graphite flyrod and maybe an Okuma SLV or Helios 5-6 reel to match.
Hey James, do you prefer the higher Modulus Graphites, 44-57 Million Modulus (IM7-8) with fast action or the medium action, 33 Million Modulus (IM6) rods for bass, trout and stuff under 8 lbs? (Remember, we rarely see bass above 5 lbs this far north)
They are here in some of the smaller ponds, but not the rivers and smaller lakes we tend to fish.
What lines (brands) do you prefer best and why?
Swez
jamesp on 02/24/2007 20:50:47
Swez, my big rods are all med-fast action. Big flies with a lot of line out require it. My freshwater stuff is fast action. Almost all of my fly rods were the latest generation graphite at the time of purchase. From IM-6 equivalent to IM-10 eq. in the Sage and G. Loomis. Sage has a positioning technique with the carbon fiber that seems to put what you need where you need it better than most mfg;s do In my not often sought opinion.
I have quite a few line types by 3m, Scientific Anglers is thier brand, the lines do what they are supposed to and are generally less than 100 dollors.lol. I have 2 Courtland speciality lines,I think, a Slime line and a super fast sink tip. I use Micron backing and have 1 reel with 400 yards of backing on it and have had most of it out.Some of those fly reels that I have are works of art. Made out of solid bar stock aluminum. Saltwater reels have to have incredible drag systems where most freshwater applications just require enough drag to keep the spool from overrunning.
BTW,another hobby I have had for years but have not been active in for almost 4 years is RC airplanes. I have a bunch of stuff. Bunch of cars too..I go nuts on my fun stuff. Got a 5 cylinder, 4 stroke radial and several 2, 3 and a 4 cylinder 4 stroke motors. Several 4 stroke single cyl motors and the 2 stroke singles. Im a 51 year old kid at heart...Look at all the money I saved not buying any RC stuff lately.lol
Not many here seem to like RF stuff,huh? Those comps sound great to me...cant wait for the Infinities..I ordered them from Indoaudio and it looks like they are a lot slower to ship than SonicE. Lets go fishing. JamesP
swez on 02/25/2007 00:35:18
Hehe, you do go over the top on some hobbies huh? Me too... when I get the notion.
Not that we dislike RF products, but they did take a dive in quality for a few years and that, coupled with the usual high prices, they fell out of favor for a time. They seem to have figured out some mistakes and now make some solid gear again, but still carry the premium prices.
Same here... have use SA, Cortland and am looking at Aquanova as my next series. Aqua has a specifc gravity of 0.75. (Water is 1.0) So they tend to float very well, have a very slick finish. Off e-bay, they are Buy now at $22.00 while SA's IV is about $60.00.
Same here, prefer the higher Modulus rods with faster action. Have read about the "progressive" that are out there and am sure they too are excellent. Am now using a IM7 (44 MM) #7, 3pc., from Quarrow. Fine rod for the price and compares very well to Redington's CPX series at 1/2 the price.
Just picked up a new 6/7/8 reel that has all the key features of Okuma's Helios reels. (The Cutthroat series from Gander Mt.) It's a wide arbor design and spools about 125 yds of #20 backing and WF7F (Bass Taper) It's Aircraft grade aluminum, NiCr finish, very well machined and sealed drag with plenty of range to stop a heavier fish. Probably good for larger trout, Pike, Bass and small Saltwater species.
Am focused on a #5 Rig for summer fishing and will be looking into a #10 rig for salmon and larger fresh water species in time.
Yeah, let's go ----<*}}}}}>< ing. Am sure I could learn a few tricks and tips as this is only my 2nd full season on a flyrod. Where ya from again? (South Carolina/Georgia area right?)
Swez
jamesp on 02/25/2007 15:29:16
Swez, that rig will cover a lot of bases for you. I of course love using floating lines whenever possible as sinking/sink tip lines can sometimes be more trouble than they are worth. Top water action is as good as it gets....if you are lucky enough to be in the right place at the right time with the right match of the hatch.
Im a Georgia boy and most people dont realize that we have 1100+ miles of trout streams in the state as well as good inshore and offshore salt water fishing. I lve on the west side of the state but my favorite Florida fishing is 5 hours away.
Im having fun with the Eclipse HU. Time alignment can be set simply by choosing seating position, vehicle type etc. or by plugging a microphone in the left Aux jack, positioning it where your head goes, push a button and leave the vehicle. The unit generates pink noise from the speakers and measures distances and displays the info on the display. The good thing is: there is a simpe way to adjust each function or if you choose, there is a more complex, more accurate technique that saves the info to the memory stick for each function. I can then save different set ups to memory buttons within the parameters of what the aquired data recomends
swez on 02/25/2007 15:49:07
Have tried the sinking line and sinking tips for nymphing in deep pools or heavy flows. Am learning that it's best to have a fast action, long rod and have to mend in line to about 25 feet or less, before lifting it out of the current.
Fewer false casts are needed this way and can still shoot a 40' cast if wind is down. Seems like the key here, is to bring the line up higher and keep it short. Weighted bugs can sink in the air very fast on sinking lines, so a stout, short leader/tippet combo works well to keep the bug from slapping the water behind the angler. Is that pretty much what you do too?
I had no idea GA had so much trout water in it. Where does the cool water come from that provides adequate Oxy? What species do you see down that far south?
Swez
PS Matching the hatches up here is easy and good fishing on light hatch nights. But when the hatches are very heavy and furious, we go sub-surface after dark and small popper bodies before dark. It all depends on the water conditions and how picky the fish are that night. Large and meduim streamers Like a Mickey Finn are good for early season trout. (Minnow like) But after dark, we seem to do best on the Whooly Buggers. (Weighted or not, depending on current flow and water depth)
jamesp on 02/26/2007 08:32:22
Swez, when you get a chance, could you please look at the pics of the back of the head unit and tell me what the wire w/ the rectangular metal box on the end does? It doesnt mention it in the manual. I am just curious. The 97 and 98 F-150's are unique as far as the "premium" system is concerned in that the install kit w/ pocket listed 99-04 F-150,s as the correct fit. I called the seller and was told it would work....Wrong, I had to cut a triangular chunk out of the fixed pocket to clear the assembly that the rear hanger clip slides on. I used a hot wire "knife" and all is fine. If you tried to put the pocket on the bottom this assy. prevents sliding the head unit in at all. I love this thing. Here is a link to the pics. Thanks
http://www.sonicelectronix.com/pictures.php?id=7462
PS, Wooly Boogers catch anything that swims. For Largemouths I like to fish a fur strip leech or worm w/ med. eyes. I fish them just like a plastic Zoom worm, on the bottom in farm ponds. In the spring, I use big deer hair poppers or chuggers...heart attack material when a big bass tries to murder the bug. I had a bass come out of the water at the pond edge to try and get a bug fouled in some cattails at the waters edge. It looked like it happened in slow motion. I reacted too quickly and took it away from him. Needed a couple of beers to slow reaction time a bit. It is fun stuff. Jimmy
jamesp on 02/26/2007 10:16:23
Swez, N. Georgia is the starting point of the Cumberland Plateau. The Blue Ridge and Appalacian foothills rise out of the ground about 60 miles North of here. The southernmost trout stream is only 12 miles from my house and we even found a couple of nice rainbows in our pond many years ago when it was drained for dock work.The Chattahoochie river flows near home, although it is not trout friendly this far down, from its origin in extreme NE Georgia to Atlantas lake Lanier it is trout water and for approx. 15-20 miles more downstream of the dam is sometimes incredible trout fishing. In our northern streams we have Brook, Rainbow and German Browns. The Brook Trout were native to the area.A lot of the streams are "put and take" streams but many have reproducing populations.
To change the subject...I received an e-mail from Crutchfield with the correct wiring harness pics for 97 and 98 premium sound.The colors are all correct. They said that thier research includes scavenging junk yards and service manuals. They thanked me for bringing it to thier attention as what they were providing listed "thru late 90's and then 99-03 equip. If I had this sheet from the beginning it would have save a lot of questions..oh well, I probably learned more going around the mountain and now my truck system rivals my home theatre system...That makes me GRIN.
swez on 02/27/2007 02:18:41
Hard to say exactly what that box is for Jim. I've never seen a HU that employs such a device.
That looks like it could be a power supply, noise filter or possibly an RF receiver for your remote control device?
About the bass bugs, have seen the fur strip leaches and have made up a few small plastic worm rigs for fly rods as well. Short pieces of the good ol Plow Jockey work pretty well too. They don't last long after tangling with decent sized bass though. If that's what they want on a given time, better have a few spares on hand as they get pretty mangled.
Also, that rig only has one hook and it's weight is such that casting them is a lot different that a light surface bug. It's more a "Chuck and Duck" type cast. (A variation on shooting line casting)
I still like the surface poppers for bass, just before dusk. It's really neat to watch a bass come up from the deeper pools and smash a popper at the surface and then head for the weed beds. Last season, was fishing a weed bed in a cove of a lake and had a nice LM bass pull that one on me. I had to wade around a deep sandy drop off and walk in within 10 feet of that buried fish to drag him out of the weeds. Yeah, had to really reef on him to break him free. Once free, he bolted for deeper water and the fight was back on again. (Several arials and tail walks before I finally got him thumbed in the lip) Good that he was hooked solid, but his weight and such, did manage to bend the hook on that popper. (~3.0-3.25 lbs is all, but a real scrapper) Revived him after the fight and he just swam off toward deeper waters to regroup. That was a great night in all.
Can't wait to start the season again soon!
Cheers,
Swez
cplkittle on 02/27/2007 03:11:49
I was once told that the box was the power supply for the HU. It is kept seperate to reduce heat and noise within the unit. Alpine does the same thing.
swez on 02/27/2007 10:28:45
That makes sense to me... until we hear otherwise, it's a power supply.
Swez
jamesp on 02/27/2007 10:59:59
Yea, thats it..a power supply.
So far, I like the CSII setting or Circle of Sound 2 setting better than anything I can come up with and it is a 1 button access feature. For systems with no sub, it is supposed to create a virtual sub.... I dont know about that but it does seem like it creates a center channel. It makes listeners look around on the dash to see where the speaker is...Having the sub amp signal fed from the non-fader sub outs..is very cool. I can control it much better than with the dash mounted Bass Boost knob only. Now Im sure the type R sub is broken in well.lol...
Swez, Im sure glad you steered me to a more SQ oriented sub as I was looking at other stuff installed in ported enclosures that are more for SPL that I probably would already be thinking of replacing. I had no Idea how good that Alpine 12" single sub was going to sound.Also, it was a good call on your part to nudge me toward sticking with the same brand sub amp as my I had on my highs, as I have no turn on pops or noises at all.
Since all I was originally going to do was replace front speakers... I didnt do too bad...I have only the cheap front pair, and soon the sony rear speakers will be out and my cute little powered sub to show as learning curve material so I consider myself lucky. Im giving the speakers to a needy guy at work .I was thinking about putting the powered sub in my daughters Escape..but I had to ride around with a screwdriver in my hand and change the gain when switching disks or sources...It didnt do very well as a set it and forget it unit.Ill probably leave that thing in the box on a shelf...I wish you could listen to this thing. I would like to know what you think about it.
swez on 02/27/2007 17:27:05
Well Jim, you're most welcome and it's a pleasure getting to know you better in the process. It's funny that we have so much in common too huh?
That little powered sub you had originally, does it have a remote bass control feature available? If yes, no need to tweak and drive. Just use the remote. Other wise, the HU bass tone control can be used to add or remove bass as needed. Just set the Bass control to "flat", (0 boost, 0 cut) and then dial in the amp gain to the best you can get. Then, just use the HU tone control to cut or boost bass performance as needed.
How far off I-75 are you? Mentioning this as we are planning a trip to Florida in mid-March and will be there for 2-3 weeks. Was thinking if we can swing it, may be an opportunity to detour a bit out to your place, check out your ride and perhaps grab a few hours of fishing time? Right now, it looks like the last week in March will be our return trip. (Stepdad & me)
We have family business to attend to initially, but once that is done and out of the way, will have some slack time on the way back to MI. Can adjust our plans as needed on the return dates and such. If you have the time and inclination, it would be most excellent to meet you and see your handy work. (I feel pretty well invested in your project too and would like to hear the results)
What say you?
Swez
PS If there are decent hotels/motels in the area, Pops and I can lodge there for a night or two. You're call bro!
jamesp on 02/27/2007 18:21:19
Swez, that would be cool. I live 50 miles west of Atlanta and I-75 I may be in Florida the same time as you are. What part of the sunshine state are you going to?My in-laws headed down to Longboat Key Florida today to stay on thier friends boat for a few days. The weather is beautiful here right now, 70 degrees. I was going to Daytona for 3 days for bike week but I backed out. It is unbelievably crowded during bike week these days. Im going to try to make it there for the October version called Biketoberfest. It is not so crowded then and the weather is great...usually. Maybe we can work something out .
Do you know anyone that has ordered from Indoaudio? The Fed Ex tracking number that I got on the the 21st has not even been updated to show pickup yet and the delivery date was shown as today. I have a bad feeling here. The feedback has several slow ship complaints. I had real good luck with Sonic. We will see about this company.
swez on 02/27/2007 23:30:00
Will be in Brooksville/Spring Hill area during that time mentioned. (3/16-23/07) That's about 45 mile due north of Tampa, on the west/central gulf coast. After that, it's up for grabs.
My brother is also going to be in the area for a NAM show with his wife. We are twins and both love fly/spin fishing. Not sure what his exact schedule will be, but where there's a will, there's a way huh? But if that makes a crowd, we can alwayd do the duet.
Have no clue about Indoaudio. Just keep tracking via Fed-X as they do update on a regular basis. If any concerns, just contact Fed-X and ask for tracking info on your gear.
Swez
PS Have outgrown the crowds at any major event these days. A quality day with a like-minded buddy is my preference anytime. I prefer quality over quantity anyday... Bikini's or not.
Swez
jamesp on 02/28/2007 20:29:49
Swez, maybe we can get hooked up on your return trip. Ill try to finalize my Florida trip as soon as I can get on track with my buddy. I really have lost most interest in the big events and have less tolerance for crowds as I have aged. I would have enjoyed going to bike week a bit if I had time to ride down and back at a pace that suited me. I dont care to be in a hurry on the bike and have to mind my busted back too. This getting old stuff would not be so bad if I would have been a little easier on the ol body when I was younger...cant take it back , huh?
I wish I would of paid more money and bought these comps from Sonic. I would have them by now. Indo hasnt returned my email and the FedEx tracking number still just shows the that a label ordering pickup has been scanned into the system. Oh well, Ill get em when I get em.I get impatient waiting on stuff I order but I cant put them in before the weekend anyway. GRIN and bear it.
swez on 03/1/2007 00:48:27
Indo is less wannaful than I would "risk" for any major purchases. After looking at that site and such, would rather pay a small premium to a good site then hope/wait on this guy. I hope it works out and you did use PayPal or a C/C as payment. Indo has a lower feedback rating than I am willing to tolerate. If an e-bayer is not 99.5% or higher, I tend to avoid them.
I hear ya on the crowds and all the crazies that attend large venue events. Maybe We are just getting older and wiser and such things lose their appeal over the years.
As for the trip down, we are somewhat fixed to a degree. The return time frame is a bit more open, so there's no big deal to adjust there. Just give me a heads up before we leave and perhaps we can swap phone numbers to work out the last minute details. If it works out, great! If not, that's not the end of the world. (Stuff happens)
You have my e-mail addy and I have yours. That will work for now... but I may/maynot take my computer on this trip. It's just one more thing to pack and I may elect to leave the laptop home. Here, the phone may be the best option to connect.
Swez
PS I hope your Infinity Comps come in soon. A 4-5 day turn-a-round is great from the west coast to the east coast. Much more than that would trouble me too. In the mean time, just grin & bear it. ;-)
jamesp on 03/1/2007 08:07:05
Well, this AM I have an email from Indoaudio and the tracking info from FedEx is updated. I feel good knowing FedEx has the stuff....just hope it is the right stuff. I read thier feedback before ordering and it appears that most complaints are for slow shipping.
I ordered w/ Paypal on the 21st and the money was sucked out of my account that day, which is normal. I had a tracking number the next day, but that just means that the info has been sent to the shipper. The projected delivery date was Feb 27...when that date had come and no tracking updates were posted, I emaied them. To be fair, thier FAQ section states that it may take 7 or more days before the mdse actually ships. I asked Sonic to match the price and they wouldnt do it, the net difference in price between the 2 sellers was 42 dollars. The new delivery date is March 6..the stuff just left the west coast last night. Had I ordered from Sonic, I would be installing this weekend.
I see the post above about the RF Amp, the RF6001bd, like I recently bought from sonic was advertised on Indo's site at slightly more than Sonics price which was 177.00 + 30.00 shipping but the peak RMS rating is something like 1797 watts....So if Indo says this is indeed an RF 6001bd then it is 100 bucks more than they sell that model for on thier site normally. If they are playing games like that, I have no use for them.
I feel pretty confident that Ill have my Infinity comps by March 6th but no more Indo for me. If they rip me off...I will go to California and seek gratification...lol...I know y'all believe that....In the words of Snoop Dogg, there will be no more" smokin on an indo, drinking gin and juice" for them. Note: a month ago, I had never heard that song. I have listened to a lot of stuff lately that is new to me, now that I B Bumpin.
swez on 03/1/2007 13:32:58
Ohhhh Noooo, he's listen to Rap music now... (Tearing out the hairs that remain)
After looking up the Indo site, this group has a lot of unhappy customers. Either they are very disorganized, some degree of dishonest or both. When I look at any vendor's ratings, it better be 99.5% positive or better or I'll pass. Some of the notations and complaints they have been getting, tell me it's best to avoid these guys like the plague.
Price matching with most larger sites can be done if the price is from a reputable supplier. Many will not match e-bay only sellers. An e-bayer can do a few deals at 10-20% above cost and still move products. A brick and mortor biz needs more than 20% markup to cover overhead. Ideally, they shoot for 30-50% margins. (You know all that from days in the Hardware store right?)
Swez
jamesp on 03/1/2007 21:09:41
Swez, one thing these buy it now e-bay guys have going for them is the fact that people like me are paying before we get anything...My hardware store business was about 75% credit...my best contractors and industrial accounts would put a check in the mail on the 10th, maybe. and it would be available to me as cash at the bank on the 20th, maybe. Lots of customers would send a check when they got the NEXT statement.lol...Cash customers were always great, but nobody prepaid for anything of course.If I could have used somebody elses money for even 1 week, I could have trimmed quite a few points off of my margins..Retail can be pretty brutal. Every time I collected a dollar, there was a vendor, supplier, insurer, tax man and all of the above peoples extended family members with thier hand out for it...I kind of like having someone else covering my paycheck for me every week now. It takes a little getting used to...Realistically, almost no business can truly make 99% of thier customers happy...these ebay sellers seem to work the negative gets a negative feedback angle to make those numbers look good. Probably 1% of the people that darken your business door... come in looking to cause trouble...it is a sad but true fact. There are a lot of nuts in this world but it only takes 1 or 2 good ones to make us able to see the good side of things...
swez on 03/2/2007 01:13:57
LOL... after being a self-employed contractors for about 7 years, I can honestly say I come to serve my clients to the best of my abilities. Unfortunately, not every customer seems to have the same game plan toward their service providers.
Some are just great people and are a pleasure to do business with. They stay out of the way. Are available at the appointed time, offer cold water on hot days and pay on time with cash or good checks. Have had many of these and love doing business with them.
Then there are a few horror stories in the mix. (Just as you mentioned, there's always a few train wreaks lurking in the wings) One woman in particular, stands out in my mind. She was a lonely woman, home bound to a major degree and a total basket case. (Now, I know why she was so lonely)
It started out OK with a phone call and we outlined the tasks she wanted to have done. Great, I know what tools are needed and how to do those tasks well. I gave her an hourly fee for labor and a good estimate on materials. We agreed, set an appointment date and I came out to do the work. That day went pretty well and the job got done and even came in a little under the estimate. I packed up my tools when finished and went in to collect my fees for that day. She was pleasant, wanted to chat and even gave me a snack. After that, we sat and chatted for about 30 minutes, collected my pay and left. She mentioned she had a number of other odd jobs in the hopper for another day and I said OK, when you are ready, call me and well set up another appointment.
Well, things went down hill from there my friend. On follow up trips, it was the same script. She was cranky, whiny and did not stick to the agreed upon list of tasks for that day. As a good contractor, we plan what we need and have a few extra tools on hand, just in case something else pops up. Well, they sure did.
Worked my way through her check list in a methodical and orderly manner. She must have been pretty lonely on those days as she tended to follow me around from task to task and talked about a lot of personal issues regarding her children and how they don't come for visits or do much to help her out on "little things" much any more. (There's a Red Flag moment)
Since I was done sooner than anticipated with the check list, she added a few more things to keep me around a bit long that day. OK, fine as I didn't have any more appointments for that day. She was my last stop. Well, she was in a grumpy mood that day and decided that she'd play the Drill Instructor and I could play the new recruit. I'd no sooner start one project and she'd try to direct me in 2-3 other projects, all at the same time. (Sorry, that dog won't hunt in this party)
During all this, she would complain about how other contractors, neighbors and such, rarely did what she had asked for. After 90 minutes more of this crazy dance, I knew why. Well, I finished my tasks for that day and packed up my tools and went in to settle up for the day. Again, she wanted to talk, complain and so on. Finally, I said to her, "it must be tough for you being sick, lonely and not able to get around. However, I am a contractor and am here to do the work, take care of the tasks at hand and that's all". I am not your therapist, looking for a new female friend or like being pulled in all parts of the compass as I do my work!!! If you need that, hire a private care-taker.
To make a long story short, I did a few more jobs for her in subsequent weeks, but kept my distance. When she called for additional work assignments, something in the pit of my stomach said..."Are you sure you want to go back there again?" She again tried to side-track me with other un-related things, I just stated the obvious... "Am here to do the job you asked for dear... that's all". I finished up the tasks for that day, charged her a bit more than usual, (Aggrevation premium) and left.
Well sir, that was the end of it. She never called me again and I was happy to get that monkey off my back. However, a close friend of mine who also did other errands and such for her, gave me the low-down later. My "direct and to the point speech" finally hit home. This woman was so used to manipulating and trying to control others, when she finally met me, it blew her fuses.
Hehe My name was "MUD" in her eyes and frankly, I was very happy to have it be just that way. No more phone calls, no more aggravations and I moved on. All this to say... "Some folks would not be happy, even if we offered to lend them a brand new rope to hang themselves."
Yes, it's only a 2-3% of experiences I have noted to date. But when we see these coming, better to get out of the way as soon as possible. Life is full of wonderful opportunities and dogs. The sooner we figure out which from whom, the better life is for all parties involved.
End Rant!
Swez
jamesp on 03/2/2007 08:44:57
Yes sir, there are customers out there that you just dont want.
Swez, are you selling credit/debit card capture electronic devices in your new job? I read something like that ....I think...Or maybe it is more banking type equipment??Have you hit the ground running yet. I am pretty good at getting up what someone needs to do a task, even when I have to de-code what that task is, when they come to me for it. On the other hand, I dont like going to a potential customer and trying to sell them a product. I can maybe do it, once I get there. I just dread the thought of getting there...if that makes sense.If I didnt have this little problem I could be making some real money at my brothers insurance company. There is some truth in the old saying; it takes money to make money. That guy can make more in a casual little property deal or such, than Ill make working the rest of my life. Oh well Ill get over it...
swez on 03/2/2007 13:55:20
Yes, I did hit the ground running as of the 3rd day of employment. It was a very good learning opportunity on how not to run a business. This was selling equipment and discount rate contracts to small business for electronic funds capture, gift cards and the like.
Had high hopes for this opportunity as it was pitched very well from the providers training team, but once in the field, following up on company supplied leads, the warning lights on the dash came on brightly and stayed on each day I was out there. (Salesmen are often suckered by a good presentation)
Well, I gave it a week of solid effort and counted the costs VS returns and said... "this ain't adding up very well to the pitch I had been given". Being that this was a 100% commission gig and no paid expenses. The kicker was a joint conference meeting with verteran reps that had been selling for some time in the company. I heard an earful of issues from these guys. This gave me a a good "heads up" about what was ahead and how the company handles payouts to their reps. (Not a pretty sight)
When the trainer joined the conference, he was blasted with questions and concerns from the vets on the call. I just listened and took careful mental notes on his responses. My intuition was spot on and have learned to listen to those nagging gut reactions as they come up. (More dash lights came on) "Danger... Will Robinson"
Well, the die was cast and an executive decision needed to be made. (On the next page was a choice) The following morning, I waited for my manager to call with the days assignments and gave him my decision... "I'm outta here and you can have all your training manuals back as well". He tried to talk me out of it and offered to bump me to his upline manager for a debate. I said No thanks... I've seen and heard plenty and know this is the best option. Have a good day!
The lessons learned here were invaluable. May I share them with those who care to read them?
1. Learn what we are good at and press these skills to their limits.
2. Learn what we a not good at and minimize exposure to such tasks when possible.
3. Keep the eyes and ears wide open when looking at a new career path. If it sounds too good to be true, it probably is.
4. If a company is too eagar to recruit talent, there's a reason for it. (High employee turnover is usually the case)
5. Know thy self... some are hunters, some are seed planters and yet others are harvesters. Be true to ones traits, but observe the skills/traits of others as they can be combined in time to form a great team.
6. Integrity is more important then a large bank account that was filled by ill-gotten gains and deceptive dealings.
Ol man Swez is a planter/harvester type. I prefer to sew seeds, (Plant ideas) tend to them as they take root, (Consult as needed) and then harvest them in plenty in the proper season. (Reap the rewards from previous activities when the crop is ripe)
If you look back on our work together over that past few weeks, this is exactly what has taken place.
A. You had some basic ideas and I planted some fresh seeds that would net a better outcome later. (Planter)
B. We discussed the possibilities, options and potential outcomes that were possible. (Consulting) We built rapport along the way huh?
C. You followed up on such recommendations and are well on the way to an above average install. (Reaping stage = Satifaction to the nth degree)
In the meantime, we have become solidified partners in this process. You'll have an eventual system that will keep you happy for many years to come. I have the satisfaction of bringing fresh ideas to the table.
Have a great week and I hope your Infinity Comps come in soon. These will add a new dimension to your front stage that the RF's may now lack... more SQL in the front stage, a big improvement in the rear stage.
Swez
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=260083703205&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:IT&ih=016
Another question that I have concerns the inevitable, the head unit replacement. Will a decent quality aftermarket unit with 4-6v outputs automatically improve the sound of my system? I think the equalization ability will enable sound improvement but I am wondering if since I rewired my speakers directly to the 4 channel amp, if I remove the LOC and put in a decent head unit if it will make a noticable improvement. I love the fact that I have no engine noise or static at all but I would really like to be able to play mp3 discs and plug in my mp3 player. FM stations with poor reception dont sound better when amplified. What would you guys suggest? Thanks. JamesP
Replies (60)
cplkittle on 02/10/2007 18:29:11
I have always liked the sound of the type R components. The only negative thing I have to say about them is the textured cone on the mid drivers dampens the music a little compared to a solid plastic or metal cone drivers. The soft dome tweets are really sweet sounding though. As far as a difference in sound over a 6x8.. the round speaker will sound better. You get a little more midbass out of the 6x8 because of the larger surface area of the cone, but it dosen't stay clean at high volume like a round speaker.
You will notice a huge difference with an aftermarket HU as long as you buy a quality name brand unit. There are also FM boosters on the market, the only problem with them is sometimes stations further away can bleed into local stations a bit. If you install one, put a switch on it so it can be turned off. Also, some of them will not pick up AM at all.
swez on 02/10/2007 22:01:00
Dunno... installed a pair of 6x8 Infinity Coaxials w/outboard x-overs in an F-150 last summer. They were powered by a JL 300/4 and frankly, they sounded awesome and very punchy above 80 Hz.
This vehicle was well matted too. The front and rear doors and back wall only. We did not need to do the floor/roof as they were well padded well.
We also used 5.25" CDT Classic Comps up front. The silk dome tweets were very smooth, but the woofer just did not do as well with lows in the stock door locations. Very good mids, but below 120 Hz., they lacked some of the kick we were hearing in the rear speakers. A tad more power and some additional EQ would have helped, but to my ears, the CDT's probably needed a more controlled enclosure than a matted door panel.
Yes, an Aftermarket HU would definitely be a step up in overall performance here too. Adding some decent EQ will tone down the RF tweets up front. (5-15KHz range) If you wired things up well to begin with, noise problems should be nill. Proper grounds between the new HU and amp(s) is/are key to noise free setups.
We used a Nakamichi CD 400, (Very nice... simple, sleek and elegant HU) and coupled this with an outboard Bahn AEQ6 EQ/Line Driver. The LD gave up to 8 volts of signal to his 300/4 and 500/1 JL amps.
We both liked the no-menu messing around for EQ and channel allocation features. (Balance, fade, Master volume and Sub volume controls & EQ bands) Everything was in the dash and looked great and easy to adjust on the fly. This EQ also has an AUX input feature so one can easliy add MP3 or I-pod players if desired.
Comments?
Swez
jamesp on 02/10/2007 22:50:59
Thanks for the replies. Its kind of funny that when I first replaced the factory speakers a couple of months I actually that the speakers I bought sounded pretty good, I put Blauplunkt 3 ways in the front and those 4 ways in the back. I wondered why there were not any of the more expensive speakers in the Crutchfield catalog that were 3 way. I really like my RF fronts I just thought that since the back ones are so bad that ihat it mught be worthwhile to do some changung. What I probably should do is get a good set of coaxials for the back and start checking out head units. I enjoy learning my equipment but dont like scrolling through a biunch of menus each time a minor tweak is needed.
Swez, I ripped a disc of bass songs from the list in the FAQ's and I do believe my sub is broken in. I went to pick up pizza eariler tonight and had it bumpin pretty hard, I reached back with my right hand(in the dark) to feel the amount of movement and I stuck my finger in the wrong place and it jammed up my finger....I didnt know those things were dangerous. I like that sub/amp combo a lotGRIN
Blue_Oval on 02/11/2007 02:28:08
Dunno... installed a pair of 6x8 Infinity Coaxials w/outboard x-overs in an F-150 last summer. They were powered by a JL 300/4 and frankly, they sounded awesome and very punchy above 80 Hz.
Man this sounds vaguely familiar. Ha ha.
swez on 02/11/2007 11:56:35
Well, speak of the devil and he appears...hehe Good to see ya back on the board there Blue Oval.
Hoping you are as satisfied now as when the system was first installed? That was a very good project and we all learned in the process. Your rig has more or less become a personal reference point for what a good SQL system is all about!
Swez
jamesp on 02/11/2007 18:20:23
I will be giving up my CD changer with a new head unit so I really want Mp3 capability. Also, If I get a head unit with pre outs for a sub, would it be better to run a new patch cable from the head unit to the sub amp or just leave the 1 meter RCA from my 4 channel amp to my sub amp? Oh well, a new set of speakers and a head unit will give me something to keep my interest level up and something to look forward to.
Blue_Oval on 02/11/2007 18:31:36
Ha ha......Thanks Swez. Indeed, sure was an excellent learning experience. Obviously, I couldn't have done any of it without you and the all the great help here. Nothing like hands on work. While that project had somewhat of a "Ginny pig" aspect to it, I really don't see how it could have turned out any better. 6 months conceived, then born to rip your head off, which it does.
Only caveat, maybe a tad bit more front SQ. Rubbing hands together--We fix O master of SQ. hahahaha!!!
jamesp on 02/11/2007 18:31:49
What about these???
http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_6940.html
Blue_Oval on 02/11/2007 18:55:01
What about these???
I think the Kappas 680.7cs have a better quality crossover. Not only for the Xer's themselves. But I noticed the added feature of "flick a switch for an instant 3dB to the highs. That's a very nice feature. I also think the Kappa Xer's will hold up much better do to the harsh weather environment. This, obviously, is very dependent on where you choose to mount them.
jamesp on 02/11/2007 20:52:42
OK, took the cover off my RF-450.4 amp and found that I had the crossover frequency too high on my front channels...I set it down to about 75-80Hz and it improved the sound a bit. I realize that this had no effect on the tweeters but it improved the sound to me for now anyway.lol The Alpine type R's that I first liked also come in the 6-3/4 and the 5-1/4 but I see there is a line of SPR 17S(6.75') and 13S (5.25") and then there is the SPR 17LS and SPR 13LS. The LS line does have the adjustable crossover settings but are much cheaper than the "S" only line. Crutchfield has only the more expensive ones. The crossovers on the "S "line of R typeI look to be pretty substantial. have not heard any of them of course. If I get a set that sound better than the Rockfords and put them in back, I will have a killer sounding system. I know Im not a qualified judge of sound quality, but Ill be happy.
A good ,fairly simple, quality head unit that is satellite radio compatible and Mp3 player adaptable and will play wma and Mp3 files will make me happy....what do think?...Thanks
PS I used velcro to attach the RF crossovers to the factory plastic door lining material against a solid backing and there is good clearance between them and the door panels. I think I can do the same thing in the back and be completly dry and protected.
swez on 02/11/2007 23:20:55
Depending on the HU you choose, running an extra pair of sub outs might well be in order. Some HU's have bass enhancement circuits that are only available off the sub channels. Those who don't have this feature, you can do as mentioned and save some efforts. Many of the better sub amps have bass EQ circuits and a remote bass control at the dash. You can do either with very good results.
Many of the better HU's have IP-Bus or AUX inputs for MP3, DVD or I-pods now. Yes, it's nice to have a CD changer, but now that MP3's are getting better and the advent of I-Pods, leaves most CD changers in the dust.
The Infinity Kappa series Comps are the next level up on the Ref Series. The ones noted are fine and would do a very nice job though. However, the Kappa 2 ohm series definitely a step up for higher SPL. The 2 ohm load allows the amp deliver more power VS a 4 ohm speaker for most 2/4 channel amps.
The Alpine Comps are fine for some folks and they are a nice speaker set. However, after a few years with them, know more than a few who swapped them out for Kappas, Polk Momo's, Diamonds or CDT's HD Series. They (Kappa 2/4 ohms) take more power, better x-overs and you can get them in 2 ohm models when amping. (But not off the HU only.... need 4 ohm models there)
There are a few exceptions... JL's Slash series and Phoenix Gold's Xenon series. These have special power supplies that can deliver the same clarity and power to 1.5 to 4 ohm speakers w/o power losses.
Velcro is fine for attaching crossovers inside the door panels. The key is to keep window seepage moisture away from your crossovers. As long as the windows seal and drain well, most installs will be good for many years.
Swez
jamesp on 02/12/2007 07:18:59
Hi Swez, is it possible to have a 2 Ohm load on the front channels and a 4 Ohm load on the rear channels of my RF 450.4? Thanks for the advice.? What Hu's look good to you these days?
swez on 02/12/2007 11:54:42
Yes, this amp will handle 2 ohms up front, (More power where it's needed most) and 4 ohms in rear are fine. That way, one can adjust amp gains for good fade control between F/R speakers.
Tech Tip: Rear speakers often come on stronger than front stage speakers due to factory locations. GM often compensates for this by using stock 4 ohm speaker in front and 10 ohm speakers in back. Am not sure how Ford does this.
As for good HU's I like the Pioneer Premier line, Kenwood is good as are Eclipse and Alpine. Hop over to Crutchfield and read up on the features. Once you find a few that please, we can look at the install/operations manuals and then decide what makes the most sense to you.
Swez
PS Ford has a better idea when it comes to removing factory HU's. Very simple tools are needed and a conversion harness.
jamesp on 02/12/2007 12:57:02
You know, I never found a reference to a pic or diagram that shows the same 2 style plugs that my factory head unit has. Does the CD changer make it different. I can pop it out in a few seconds.I should be able to access everything I need right fro the 4 way LOC to drop a new unit in....
I cant tell the difference in Pioneer models. Many have model numbers like a DEH P6800MP...then there is a DEH P680MP that says "premier" but has the same description. like 4800 and a premier 480.
Is the "ezy eq" sufficient or does that mean non adjustable? Is 4v outs enough? 5v's? one Eclipse has 8v pre amp outs. I sure do ask a lot of questions, dont I...Thanks
swez on 02/12/2007 15:23:51
The P6800MP has good features and same with the P680MP. It mostly boils down to cost and preferences.
EZ EQ is 5 preset EQ curves. It also has 2 customized settings the user can manipulat and save as desired. These are all menu driven too. A bit cumbersome initially, but after a few days of fiddling, you'll know what sounds best for most music you like. The "Powerful" preset seems to be a good general set and forget.
Here's the manual for this model. Have a look and just take your time. You probably won't use the HU crossovers and Loudness controls though. Can play with these features, but they do some things that you may/may not not really like.
http://akamaipix.crutchfield.com/Manuals/130/130DEHP680.PDF
As for the preamp voltages stated, these tend to be a bit misleading. Some makers state 4.0 volt preamps @ 100 ohm amp impedance. Most amps are more like 10 KOhms. The main thing, your amps have enough sensitivity range to deliver full power with the signals off the HU. Most amps can handle as low as 1/4 volt, (250 mV's) and be just swell.
Wait for Kittle or ttocs to weigh in on your specific install needs. I have a hunch they will tell you to wire with RCA's only and delete the speaker outputs that have been factory amped.
Swez
jamesp on 02/13/2007 11:46:39
So, it may be possible to tape off the speaker level inputs to the LOC , unplug the RCA's from the LOC and plug those RCA's right into the new Head Unit. The speakers are already wired directly from the RF amps outputs...and Ill be good to go. If that is the case it will be an easy install. I could run 1 new pair of RCA to the sub amp from the HU if I get one w/ 3 outs if that would improve that area. I have the bass boost from the 600.1bd on the dash now. Could it be that easy???
swez on 02/13/2007 11:53:17
Yes, it is just that simple. You'll use only the RCA out on an Aftermarket HU.
Since we believe this stock system is factory amped, all that is needed, is to remove your LOC, cap off the wires or reslice them as they once were and then be sure to disconnect the REMote trigger wire for the factory amp(s). This will shut off the amp(s) and they are ready to use if you ever sell the vehicle and want to keep your aftermarket gear.
Swez
jamesp on 02/14/2007 19:05:03
This HU looks pretty good to me. Of course the 8000 series looks better. What do y'all think. Crutchfield doesnt have this model so I cant find a manual to download. I think Ill do just a new head unit first and worry about new rear speakers later. Thanks
http://cgi.ebay.com/NEW-ECLIPSE-CD4000-CD-MP3-WMA-PLAYER-iPod-SIRIUS-READY_W0QQitemZ300079224923QQihZ020QQcategoryZ18798QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
cplkittle on 02/14/2007 20:39:33
This one looks pretty nice. It should do the job.
That is a pretty nice price also.
jamesp on 02/14/2007 21:51:36
This looks like a good deal on these 2 Ohm Kappas..wonder if the seller is legit...I would need to put these up front @2Ohms and put my Rockford Fosgate comps in the back..I can send 100 watts to them
http://cgi.ebay.com/INFINITY-KAPPA-680-7CS-5x7-6x8-270-W-COMPONENT-SPEAKER_W0QQitemZ280068473982QQcmdZViewItem#OUR%20TRIPLE%20TREAT%20HOLIDAY%20SEASON%20BONANZA
swez on 02/15/2007 00:32:40
Now you have a real plan going here James. This is a solid set of Comps, your RF amp will deliver the power at 2 ohms for the front stage and just move the RF speakers to the rear.
Can you review all the gear you now have and are planning to add in this post. This will help us keep everything straight and make sure we are recommending the best possible options for your install?
Thanks,
Swez
jamesp on 02/15/2007 11:53:16
What I have so far is a factory head unit w/ 6 disc changer. Crutchfield says this system has a single factory amp based on the fact that the HU has a button labeled "Auto Set" on it. I cant verify that as I have yet to see a diagram that has the same connector plug configuration that my HU has. I black square plug w/ approx 15 wires and a thin long rectangular plug with 6 wires.I used a Scosch SLC4 LOC to utilize a 4 way RCA cord to the :
RF 450.4 amp
RF 6x8 Punch components up front..(loud and clear)
Sony 6x8 4 way in back..(junk)
Bass is provided by:
RF 600.1bd daisy chained to the 4 channel amp
Alpine 12" type R sub in a sealed box(totally happy with this)
So far, these amps have not even been warm to the touch so the must be adequately wired and not be under amped..They always seem to be at ambient temp.
Planning to add 6x8 Infinity Kappa Comps @ 2 Ohms up front and put the Rf's in back and possibly an Eclipse 4000 or maybe 5000 HU.
Im really happy with the whole setup except the rear channels speakers but I want Mp3 ability, some Eq and the ability to use my Sandisc flash Mp3 players with my system. I am hoping, of course for even better SQ with an aftermarket HU. I just cant say "there, Im done", yet. I probably will not say that for a while because I do like to tinker and am going to build a ported box for the sub to see what difference that makes.Thanks for all the help and advice.
swez on 02/15/2007 12:56:16
Beautiful! That RF450.4 is spec'd at 110 watts into a 2 ohm load and 60 watts @ 4 ohms. Knowing RF, these numbers are probably a bit conservative to what you are actually getting on their birth sheets. This should give a nice balance/fade performance factor to your new Infinity Comps and the RF's in the rear.
Looks like the next thing on the list will be your new HU. That should be relatively easy too. Ford makes it real easy to swap HU's. Plan on spending many hours tinkering and adjusting things once you get it all installed. This should keep you busy and out of wifey's hair for a while too.... Hehe
It's always a pleasure to have a good student at the table. It makes our tasks a whole bunch easier and much more enjoyable too. ;-)
Swez
jamesp on 02/15/2007 19:10:06
I just ordered the Eclipse 5000 from Sonicelectronic for a few more bucks than the 4000 model. I didnt order the speakers yet. They would not match that best price on the Kappas I found because"they are sold on an internet auction site" and the ad also says they are new 2005 stock. I dont really blame them. The head unit is several bucks cheaper on Sonics ebay site than thier regular web site too. This thing has feature descriptions that I cant even begin to know what they do...Here is a link if anybody is interested...I dont know what the box shaped device coming out of the back of the unit(shown in the detail pics) does. The 4000 model doesnt have one. What do you guys think..?
http://cgi.ebay.com/NEW-ECLIPSE-CD5000-CD-MP3-WMA-PLAYER-iPod-SIRIUS-READY_W0QQitemZ300079619260QQihZ020QQcategoryZ18798QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
JamesP #:)*
jamesp on 02/15/2007 20:29:19
I see that Crutchfield has recently reduced the price of this unit by $200.00, so it must be a discontinued model. It uses a rather obscure style of memory stick also but I think I will like a lot or some of the features it has...I hope so anyway......
swez on 02/16/2007 00:30:12
Crutch does list that model and if you want to look at the manual and read up on things, here it is:
http://akamaipix.crutchfield.com/Manuals/099/099CD5000.PDF
This is 111 pages long dude. Happy reading huh?
Man, this is a sweet HU. It has a load of nice features and should keep you busy trying them out as you go. Time alignment, DSP, 7 band Parametric EQ, HP/LP filters, 3 pair RCA's, Memory stick for Nav features and security... basically a 7 course meal here Jimmy. WOW!!!
Swez
jamesp on 02/16/2007 09:08:53
Swez, I downloaded the manual the other day. I think there are 4 saveable seating positions to choose from on the time alignment feature. This should work better than my balance button, right to left, I would think. You can save your security code/unlock info on CD-R or memory stick..not too worried about that...dont know what what DSP does yet.Got a bit to learn here I just hope the wiring harness is correct. They are sending Scosche FDK-10 and FDK-10B. The sales person said that almost all Lariats had "premium" sound...Been looking at harnesses' on line and none of the F-150 1997 stuff looks just right. The closest thing I have seen, though with small pics it is hard to tell, is a harness for the Explorer line. You would think the Expeditions would be the same as my truck..Oh well, I will see soon...Thanks.....JamesP
swez on 02/16/2007 16:48:54
DSP is Digital Sound Processing. This is a very nice feature and you'll love the things it can do. It allows one to change dull, dry and flat sounding vehicles to a large venue feel like a staduim, live concerts/ night club and Cathedral ambianeces.
I cannot say on the harnesses what will be needed here. Perhaps Kittle, UK Installer or ttocs can help fill in that gap for you.
Swez
jamesp on 02/16/2007 20:39:50
I should have this next Wednesday. I ordered it about 7pm EST last night and it was picked up and had departed LA by 1 AM. The other stuff I ordered from them went out quickly too.
I think Ill wait on the speakers, if I can make myself. That way, Ill have another project to look forward to.GRIN
swez on 02/16/2007 23:26:15
Sure, no need to break the bank or do everything in one fell swoop. (Or is that One swell Poop?) LOL I get those two sayings mixed up... Anyway... long day and I am pretty washed out. Think better tomorrow after a good snooze.
As you wish sir...
Swez
jamesp on 02/21/2007 08:12:48
My Eclipse CD 5000 is being delivered today.
I found out that the reason this model was so deeply discounted is because there is a CD 5001model out although there doesnt seem to be any of the newer model in stock anywhere. The main difference in the 2 units is that the Memory Stick format used w/ the CD 5000 model has been replaced buy a USB port. Since the memory stick format on the unit I am getting is not real popular or available with a lot of capacity the USB feature would be better for sure. That said, Im comfortable with the fact that once I have this thing set up the way I want it, I can save everything on the removable memory and burn it to a CD-R for backup. Ill probably not utilize all the features available as is but will enjoy dinking around with them.
Im sure Ill have some questions for setup and install..anyone here familar with these systems. Supposedly the pre amp outs are super low resistance, < 50 Ohms, and are 8 volts. I assume that Ill need to turn my amp gains down all the way on initial start up and go from there. Im sure I dont have much voltage between the factory head unit speaker level inputs to the 4 way LOC that sends the signal to my amps now...I wonder if the adjustable 6 to18dB/octave crossovers work well on the unit. If so do I set my amp crossovers to All Pass or use them in conjunction w/ one another.....Any advice??? Thanks...JamesP
jamesp on 02/21/2007 15:27:24
I broke down and ordered the pair of Infinity Kappa 680.7 cs 2 Ohm components a few minutes ago. Ill put my RF comps in the back and put these up front. I should have a decent system when Im done......I hope....GRIN
swez on 02/21/2007 21:39:58
Oh yes, you will definitely like the Infinity's up front as noted. The tweeters are not silk, so you may find yourself reaching for the Custom EQ functions in the Eclipse 5000 HU to tone them down a tad.
These Infinity's have good dispersion characteristics with the M.M.D. (Metal Matrix Dome) type tweeter. It may be a bit bright up front initially, but you can tone it down via the supplied crossover or attenuate as needed with EQ.
In all, I think you will be very happy with this change, after some time and tweaking the system Jimmy.
Swez
jamesp on 02/22/2007 21:22:09
It looks to me like like I only will use 1 of the connection harness adapters to get power, ground, illumination etc and just tape off the factory harness speaker wires and add 1more pair of USB patch cords for my sub and Ill be bumpin in style...does that sound about right?
Of course I now wish I had ordered the speakers together with the head unit..then I could install all of it this weekend. I tried to use a bit of self restraint.. and failed as usual...GRIN....oh well.
swez on 02/22/2007 23:10:28
Starting on page 104 of the manual shows the wiring diagram to be used.
http://akamaipix.crutchfield.com/Manuals/099/099CD5000.PDF
Here, you'll only need the following wires:
RED: ACC/IGN trigger
YELLOW: Constant +12 volt supply line
BLACK: Ground to metal in dash
BLUE/wt. stripe: REMote trigger feed line to amps
ORANGE: Not Connected (Optional but may cause noise)
Antenna: D'oh... need that too
You will also be using all 3 pairs of RCA outputs to your 4 channel amp and sub amp. No speaker lines in the HU harness are used. (Tape these off and get them out of your way.
Self-restraint? What's that? That is only possible when we are cash poor or have vast amounts of "Won't Power". Otherwise, this does not apply. GRIN and press on if neither apply.
You mentioned USB cables? I take it you meant to say RCA cables or no?
Swez
PS This HU can do just about anything but cook your dinner. Study the Install & User's manuals as needed. This will give you enough time to ponder while wating for your Infinity Comps to arrive. LOL
PSS Have you done much bowling in years gone by? This manual is 111 pages long. What does 111 mean in bowling parlance? LOL
jamesp on 02/23/2007 08:26:27
USB,RCA, hmm, I cant even blame that one on my dyslexia..Maybe wishful thinking since the new Eclipse models use USB instead of the goofy Sony Memory Stick. I do have a couple of Sony MS's. 16 whole mb each. Ill just use the stick for the security feature probably
I have a question..,I know, rare for me but...my antenna connector at the head unit pulled out of the clip/cage. The "clip" stayed in the radio. I pulled the clip out and it appears that there is a plastic insulator/isolator piece that keeps the solid cener stinger wire in position. Can I buy a replacement end piece for this or do I replace the whole antenna? It looks like it will be tough to fish a new stiff antenna wire into position even if I pull a string through from the inside when removing the stock antenna...I can probably rig up a rubber bushing to replace the broken plastic isolator piece if I have to....Thanks
Swez, dont know much about the bowling thing...111 is that all spares?? Never have bowled much..
swez on 02/23/2007 13:37:57
Oppps, have a boo-boo here Jim. You should be able to find a replacement antenna "jack" for this one at Radio Shack or an electronic supply dealer that caters to CB and various antenna connector needs
http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&Partnumber=090-455
These are coaxial cable connectors. This means we have a single center wire, (Stinger wire as you say) which is insulated in heavy plastic and wrapped over with a braided wire jacket and a cover insulator. Some are solderable while others are just crimp and go.
In bowling, 111 means their game is in the crapper if it pops up in the 9th or 10th frames. But if we see this one in the 4th or 5th frame, the bowler is on their way to a very good game. (200 +)
Swez
PS My best game ever, rolled a 300 and one
jamesp on 02/24/2007 18:22:54
There are probably many, many head units that I would be happy with, but my first day impression of the new Eclipse unit is that I made a great choice. I love this thing. I am able to turn the gains on my amps down 30% and have all the vo;umne Ill ever need x 2. I showed it to a couple of guys at the shop where I bought my RF components and they acted impressed. I realise that I have not had the opportunity to listen to a lot of quality 12V audio, but this system sounds very good. If the Infinity comps I have ordered sound better than the RF's that I am moving to the back Ill have an impressive SQL system. Thanks for all the suggestions and for steering me in the right direction. I like being a happy camperGRIN GRIN GRIN = big grin
swez on 02/24/2007 18:34:19
I take it you got that antenna jack fixed? If you like it now, wait til you install the Infinity Comps and move the RF's to the back.
Will feel about the same when I get a new 9', 2-3 pc., #5 graphite flyrod and maybe an Okuma SLV or Helios 5-6 reel to match.
Hey James, do you prefer the higher Modulus Graphites, 44-57 Million Modulus (IM7-8) with fast action or the medium action, 33 Million Modulus (IM6) rods for bass, trout and stuff under 8 lbs? (Remember, we rarely see bass above 5 lbs this far north)
They are here in some of the smaller ponds, but not the rivers and smaller lakes we tend to fish.
What lines (brands) do you prefer best and why?
Swez
jamesp on 02/24/2007 20:50:47
Swez, my big rods are all med-fast action. Big flies with a lot of line out require it. My freshwater stuff is fast action. Almost all of my fly rods were the latest generation graphite at the time of purchase. From IM-6 equivalent to IM-10 eq. in the Sage and G. Loomis. Sage has a positioning technique with the carbon fiber that seems to put what you need where you need it better than most mfg;s do In my not often sought opinion.
I have quite a few line types by 3m, Scientific Anglers is thier brand, the lines do what they are supposed to and are generally less than 100 dollors.lol. I have 2 Courtland speciality lines,I think, a Slime line and a super fast sink tip. I use Micron backing and have 1 reel with 400 yards of backing on it and have had most of it out.Some of those fly reels that I have are works of art. Made out of solid bar stock aluminum. Saltwater reels have to have incredible drag systems where most freshwater applications just require enough drag to keep the spool from overrunning.
BTW,another hobby I have had for years but have not been active in for almost 4 years is RC airplanes. I have a bunch of stuff. Bunch of cars too..I go nuts on my fun stuff. Got a 5 cylinder, 4 stroke radial and several 2, 3 and a 4 cylinder 4 stroke motors. Several 4 stroke single cyl motors and the 2 stroke singles. Im a 51 year old kid at heart...Look at all the money I saved not buying any RC stuff lately.lol
Not many here seem to like RF stuff,huh? Those comps sound great to me...cant wait for the Infinities..I ordered them from Indoaudio and it looks like they are a lot slower to ship than SonicE. Lets go fishing. JamesP
swez on 02/25/2007 00:35:18
Hehe, you do go over the top on some hobbies huh? Me too... when I get the notion.
Not that we dislike RF products, but they did take a dive in quality for a few years and that, coupled with the usual high prices, they fell out of favor for a time. They seem to have figured out some mistakes and now make some solid gear again, but still carry the premium prices.
Same here... have use SA, Cortland and am looking at Aquanova as my next series. Aqua has a specifc gravity of 0.75. (Water is 1.0) So they tend to float very well, have a very slick finish. Off e-bay, they are Buy now at $22.00 while SA's IV is about $60.00.
Same here, prefer the higher Modulus rods with faster action. Have read about the "progressive" that are out there and am sure they too are excellent. Am now using a IM7 (44 MM) #7, 3pc., from Quarrow. Fine rod for the price and compares very well to Redington's CPX series at 1/2 the price.
Just picked up a new 6/7/8 reel that has all the key features of Okuma's Helios reels. (The Cutthroat series from Gander Mt.) It's a wide arbor design and spools about 125 yds of #20 backing and WF7F (Bass Taper) It's Aircraft grade aluminum, NiCr finish, very well machined and sealed drag with plenty of range to stop a heavier fish. Probably good for larger trout, Pike, Bass and small Saltwater species.
Am focused on a #5 Rig for summer fishing and will be looking into a #10 rig for salmon and larger fresh water species in time.
Yeah, let's go ----<*}}}}}>< ing. Am sure I could learn a few tricks and tips as this is only my 2nd full season on a flyrod. Where ya from again? (South Carolina/Georgia area right?)
Swez
jamesp on 02/25/2007 15:29:16
Swez, that rig will cover a lot of bases for you. I of course love using floating lines whenever possible as sinking/sink tip lines can sometimes be more trouble than they are worth. Top water action is as good as it gets....if you are lucky enough to be in the right place at the right time with the right match of the hatch.
Im a Georgia boy and most people dont realize that we have 1100+ miles of trout streams in the state as well as good inshore and offshore salt water fishing. I lve on the west side of the state but my favorite Florida fishing is 5 hours away.
Im having fun with the Eclipse HU. Time alignment can be set simply by choosing seating position, vehicle type etc. or by plugging a microphone in the left Aux jack, positioning it where your head goes, push a button and leave the vehicle. The unit generates pink noise from the speakers and measures distances and displays the info on the display. The good thing is: there is a simpe way to adjust each function or if you choose, there is a more complex, more accurate technique that saves the info to the memory stick for each function. I can then save different set ups to memory buttons within the parameters of what the aquired data recomends
swez on 02/25/2007 15:49:07
Have tried the sinking line and sinking tips for nymphing in deep pools or heavy flows. Am learning that it's best to have a fast action, long rod and have to mend in line to about 25 feet or less, before lifting it out of the current.
Fewer false casts are needed this way and can still shoot a 40' cast if wind is down. Seems like the key here, is to bring the line up higher and keep it short. Weighted bugs can sink in the air very fast on sinking lines, so a stout, short leader/tippet combo works well to keep the bug from slapping the water behind the angler. Is that pretty much what you do too?
I had no idea GA had so much trout water in it. Where does the cool water come from that provides adequate Oxy? What species do you see down that far south?
Swez
PS Matching the hatches up here is easy and good fishing on light hatch nights. But when the hatches are very heavy and furious, we go sub-surface after dark and small popper bodies before dark. It all depends on the water conditions and how picky the fish are that night. Large and meduim streamers Like a Mickey Finn are good for early season trout. (Minnow like) But after dark, we seem to do best on the Whooly Buggers. (Weighted or not, depending on current flow and water depth)
jamesp on 02/26/2007 08:32:22
Swez, when you get a chance, could you please look at the pics of the back of the head unit and tell me what the wire w/ the rectangular metal box on the end does? It doesnt mention it in the manual. I am just curious. The 97 and 98 F-150's are unique as far as the "premium" system is concerned in that the install kit w/ pocket listed 99-04 F-150,s as the correct fit. I called the seller and was told it would work....Wrong, I had to cut a triangular chunk out of the fixed pocket to clear the assembly that the rear hanger clip slides on. I used a hot wire "knife" and all is fine. If you tried to put the pocket on the bottom this assy. prevents sliding the head unit in at all. I love this thing. Here is a link to the pics. Thanks
http://www.sonicelectronix.com/pictures.php?id=7462
PS, Wooly Boogers catch anything that swims. For Largemouths I like to fish a fur strip leech or worm w/ med. eyes. I fish them just like a plastic Zoom worm, on the bottom in farm ponds. In the spring, I use big deer hair poppers or chuggers...heart attack material when a big bass tries to murder the bug. I had a bass come out of the water at the pond edge to try and get a bug fouled in some cattails at the waters edge. It looked like it happened in slow motion. I reacted too quickly and took it away from him. Needed a couple of beers to slow reaction time a bit. It is fun stuff. Jimmy
jamesp on 02/26/2007 10:16:23
Swez, N. Georgia is the starting point of the Cumberland Plateau. The Blue Ridge and Appalacian foothills rise out of the ground about 60 miles North of here. The southernmost trout stream is only 12 miles from my house and we even found a couple of nice rainbows in our pond many years ago when it was drained for dock work.The Chattahoochie river flows near home, although it is not trout friendly this far down, from its origin in extreme NE Georgia to Atlantas lake Lanier it is trout water and for approx. 15-20 miles more downstream of the dam is sometimes incredible trout fishing. In our northern streams we have Brook, Rainbow and German Browns. The Brook Trout were native to the area.A lot of the streams are "put and take" streams but many have reproducing populations.
To change the subject...I received an e-mail from Crutchfield with the correct wiring harness pics for 97 and 98 premium sound.The colors are all correct. They said that thier research includes scavenging junk yards and service manuals. They thanked me for bringing it to thier attention as what they were providing listed "thru late 90's and then 99-03 equip. If I had this sheet from the beginning it would have save a lot of questions..oh well, I probably learned more going around the mountain and now my truck system rivals my home theatre system...That makes me GRIN.
swez on 02/27/2007 02:18:41
Hard to say exactly what that box is for Jim. I've never seen a HU that employs such a device.
That looks like it could be a power supply, noise filter or possibly an RF receiver for your remote control device?
About the bass bugs, have seen the fur strip leaches and have made up a few small plastic worm rigs for fly rods as well. Short pieces of the good ol Plow Jockey work pretty well too. They don't last long after tangling with decent sized bass though. If that's what they want on a given time, better have a few spares on hand as they get pretty mangled.
Also, that rig only has one hook and it's weight is such that casting them is a lot different that a light surface bug. It's more a "Chuck and Duck" type cast. (A variation on shooting line casting)
I still like the surface poppers for bass, just before dusk. It's really neat to watch a bass come up from the deeper pools and smash a popper at the surface and then head for the weed beds. Last season, was fishing a weed bed in a cove of a lake and had a nice LM bass pull that one on me. I had to wade around a deep sandy drop off and walk in within 10 feet of that buried fish to drag him out of the weeds. Yeah, had to really reef on him to break him free. Once free, he bolted for deeper water and the fight was back on again. (Several arials and tail walks before I finally got him thumbed in the lip) Good that he was hooked solid, but his weight and such, did manage to bend the hook on that popper. (~3.0-3.25 lbs is all, but a real scrapper) Revived him after the fight and he just swam off toward deeper waters to regroup. That was a great night in all.
Can't wait to start the season again soon!
Cheers,
Swez
cplkittle on 02/27/2007 03:11:49
I was once told that the box was the power supply for the HU. It is kept seperate to reduce heat and noise within the unit. Alpine does the same thing.
swez on 02/27/2007 10:28:45
That makes sense to me... until we hear otherwise, it's a power supply.
Swez
jamesp on 02/27/2007 10:59:59
Yea, thats it..a power supply.
So far, I like the CSII setting or Circle of Sound 2 setting better than anything I can come up with and it is a 1 button access feature. For systems with no sub, it is supposed to create a virtual sub.... I dont know about that but it does seem like it creates a center channel. It makes listeners look around on the dash to see where the speaker is...Having the sub amp signal fed from the non-fader sub outs..is very cool. I can control it much better than with the dash mounted Bass Boost knob only. Now Im sure the type R sub is broken in well.lol...
Swez, Im sure glad you steered me to a more SQ oriented sub as I was looking at other stuff installed in ported enclosures that are more for SPL that I probably would already be thinking of replacing. I had no Idea how good that Alpine 12" single sub was going to sound.Also, it was a good call on your part to nudge me toward sticking with the same brand sub amp as my I had on my highs, as I have no turn on pops or noises at all.
Since all I was originally going to do was replace front speakers... I didnt do too bad...I have only the cheap front pair, and soon the sony rear speakers will be out and my cute little powered sub to show as learning curve material so I consider myself lucky. Im giving the speakers to a needy guy at work .I was thinking about putting the powered sub in my daughters Escape..but I had to ride around with a screwdriver in my hand and change the gain when switching disks or sources...It didnt do very well as a set it and forget it unit.Ill probably leave that thing in the box on a shelf...I wish you could listen to this thing. I would like to know what you think about it.
swez on 02/27/2007 17:27:05
Well Jim, you're most welcome and it's a pleasure getting to know you better in the process. It's funny that we have so much in common too huh?
That little powered sub you had originally, does it have a remote bass control feature available? If yes, no need to tweak and drive. Just use the remote. Other wise, the HU bass tone control can be used to add or remove bass as needed. Just set the Bass control to "flat", (0 boost, 0 cut) and then dial in the amp gain to the best you can get. Then, just use the HU tone control to cut or boost bass performance as needed.
How far off I-75 are you? Mentioning this as we are planning a trip to Florida in mid-March and will be there for 2-3 weeks. Was thinking if we can swing it, may be an opportunity to detour a bit out to your place, check out your ride and perhaps grab a few hours of fishing time? Right now, it looks like the last week in March will be our return trip. (Stepdad & me)
We have family business to attend to initially, but once that is done and out of the way, will have some slack time on the way back to MI. Can adjust our plans as needed on the return dates and such. If you have the time and inclination, it would be most excellent to meet you and see your handy work. (I feel pretty well invested in your project too and would like to hear the results)
What say you?
Swez
PS If there are decent hotels/motels in the area, Pops and I can lodge there for a night or two. You're call bro!
jamesp on 02/27/2007 18:21:19
Swez, that would be cool. I live 50 miles west of Atlanta and I-75 I may be in Florida the same time as you are. What part of the sunshine state are you going to?My in-laws headed down to Longboat Key Florida today to stay on thier friends boat for a few days. The weather is beautiful here right now, 70 degrees. I was going to Daytona for 3 days for bike week but I backed out. It is unbelievably crowded during bike week these days. Im going to try to make it there for the October version called Biketoberfest. It is not so crowded then and the weather is great...usually. Maybe we can work something out .
Do you know anyone that has ordered from Indoaudio? The Fed Ex tracking number that I got on the the 21st has not even been updated to show pickup yet and the delivery date was shown as today. I have a bad feeling here. The feedback has several slow ship complaints. I had real good luck with Sonic. We will see about this company.
swez on 02/27/2007 23:30:00
Will be in Brooksville/Spring Hill area during that time mentioned. (3/16-23/07) That's about 45 mile due north of Tampa, on the west/central gulf coast. After that, it's up for grabs.
My brother is also going to be in the area for a NAM show with his wife. We are twins and both love fly/spin fishing. Not sure what his exact schedule will be, but where there's a will, there's a way huh? But if that makes a crowd, we can alwayd do the duet.
Have no clue about Indoaudio. Just keep tracking via Fed-X as they do update on a regular basis. If any concerns, just contact Fed-X and ask for tracking info on your gear.
Swez
PS Have outgrown the crowds at any major event these days. A quality day with a like-minded buddy is my preference anytime. I prefer quality over quantity anyday... Bikini's or not.
Swez
jamesp on 02/28/2007 20:29:49
Swez, maybe we can get hooked up on your return trip. Ill try to finalize my Florida trip as soon as I can get on track with my buddy. I really have lost most interest in the big events and have less tolerance for crowds as I have aged. I would have enjoyed going to bike week a bit if I had time to ride down and back at a pace that suited me. I dont care to be in a hurry on the bike and have to mind my busted back too. This getting old stuff would not be so bad if I would have been a little easier on the ol body when I was younger...cant take it back , huh?
I wish I would of paid more money and bought these comps from Sonic. I would have them by now. Indo hasnt returned my email and the FedEx tracking number still just shows the that a label ordering pickup has been scanned into the system. Oh well, Ill get em when I get em.I get impatient waiting on stuff I order but I cant put them in before the weekend anyway. GRIN and bear it.
swez on 03/1/2007 00:48:27
Indo is less wannaful than I would "risk" for any major purchases. After looking at that site and such, would rather pay a small premium to a good site then hope/wait on this guy. I hope it works out and you did use PayPal or a C/C as payment. Indo has a lower feedback rating than I am willing to tolerate. If an e-bayer is not 99.5% or higher, I tend to avoid them.
I hear ya on the crowds and all the crazies that attend large venue events. Maybe We are just getting older and wiser and such things lose their appeal over the years.
As for the trip down, we are somewhat fixed to a degree. The return time frame is a bit more open, so there's no big deal to adjust there. Just give me a heads up before we leave and perhaps we can swap phone numbers to work out the last minute details. If it works out, great! If not, that's not the end of the world. (Stuff happens)
You have my e-mail addy and I have yours. That will work for now... but I may/maynot take my computer on this trip. It's just one more thing to pack and I may elect to leave the laptop home. Here, the phone may be the best option to connect.
Swez
PS I hope your Infinity Comps come in soon. A 4-5 day turn-a-round is great from the west coast to the east coast. Much more than that would trouble me too. In the mean time, just grin & bear it. ;-)
jamesp on 03/1/2007 08:07:05
Well, this AM I have an email from Indoaudio and the tracking info from FedEx is updated. I feel good knowing FedEx has the stuff....just hope it is the right stuff. I read thier feedback before ordering and it appears that most complaints are for slow shipping.
I ordered w/ Paypal on the 21st and the money was sucked out of my account that day, which is normal. I had a tracking number the next day, but that just means that the info has been sent to the shipper. The projected delivery date was Feb 27...when that date had come and no tracking updates were posted, I emaied them. To be fair, thier FAQ section states that it may take 7 or more days before the mdse actually ships. I asked Sonic to match the price and they wouldnt do it, the net difference in price between the 2 sellers was 42 dollars. The new delivery date is March 6..the stuff just left the west coast last night. Had I ordered from Sonic, I would be installing this weekend.
I see the post above about the RF Amp, the RF6001bd, like I recently bought from sonic was advertised on Indo's site at slightly more than Sonics price which was 177.00 + 30.00 shipping but the peak RMS rating is something like 1797 watts....So if Indo says this is indeed an RF 6001bd then it is 100 bucks more than they sell that model for on thier site normally. If they are playing games like that, I have no use for them.
I feel pretty confident that Ill have my Infinity comps by March 6th but no more Indo for me. If they rip me off...I will go to California and seek gratification...lol...I know y'all believe that....In the words of Snoop Dogg, there will be no more" smokin on an indo, drinking gin and juice" for them. Note: a month ago, I had never heard that song. I have listened to a lot of stuff lately that is new to me, now that I B Bumpin.
swez on 03/1/2007 13:32:58
Ohhhh Noooo, he's listen to Rap music now... (Tearing out the hairs that remain)
After looking up the Indo site, this group has a lot of unhappy customers. Either they are very disorganized, some degree of dishonest or both. When I look at any vendor's ratings, it better be 99.5% positive or better or I'll pass. Some of the notations and complaints they have been getting, tell me it's best to avoid these guys like the plague.
Price matching with most larger sites can be done if the price is from a reputable supplier. Many will not match e-bay only sellers. An e-bayer can do a few deals at 10-20% above cost and still move products. A brick and mortor biz needs more than 20% markup to cover overhead. Ideally, they shoot for 30-50% margins. (You know all that from days in the Hardware store right?)
Swez
jamesp on 03/1/2007 21:09:41
Swez, one thing these buy it now e-bay guys have going for them is the fact that people like me are paying before we get anything...My hardware store business was about 75% credit...my best contractors and industrial accounts would put a check in the mail on the 10th, maybe. and it would be available to me as cash at the bank on the 20th, maybe. Lots of customers would send a check when they got the NEXT statement.lol...Cash customers were always great, but nobody prepaid for anything of course.If I could have used somebody elses money for even 1 week, I could have trimmed quite a few points off of my margins..Retail can be pretty brutal. Every time I collected a dollar, there was a vendor, supplier, insurer, tax man and all of the above peoples extended family members with thier hand out for it...I kind of like having someone else covering my paycheck for me every week now. It takes a little getting used to...Realistically, almost no business can truly make 99% of thier customers happy...these ebay sellers seem to work the negative gets a negative feedback angle to make those numbers look good. Probably 1% of the people that darken your business door... come in looking to cause trouble...it is a sad but true fact. There are a lot of nuts in this world but it only takes 1 or 2 good ones to make us able to see the good side of things...
swez on 03/2/2007 01:13:57
LOL... after being a self-employed contractors for about 7 years, I can honestly say I come to serve my clients to the best of my abilities. Unfortunately, not every customer seems to have the same game plan toward their service providers.
Some are just great people and are a pleasure to do business with. They stay out of the way. Are available at the appointed time, offer cold water on hot days and pay on time with cash or good checks. Have had many of these and love doing business with them.
Then there are a few horror stories in the mix. (Just as you mentioned, there's always a few train wreaks lurking in the wings) One woman in particular, stands out in my mind. She was a lonely woman, home bound to a major degree and a total basket case. (Now, I know why she was so lonely)
It started out OK with a phone call and we outlined the tasks she wanted to have done. Great, I know what tools are needed and how to do those tasks well. I gave her an hourly fee for labor and a good estimate on materials. We agreed, set an appointment date and I came out to do the work. That day went pretty well and the job got done and even came in a little under the estimate. I packed up my tools when finished and went in to collect my fees for that day. She was pleasant, wanted to chat and even gave me a snack. After that, we sat and chatted for about 30 minutes, collected my pay and left. She mentioned she had a number of other odd jobs in the hopper for another day and I said OK, when you are ready, call me and well set up another appointment.
Well, things went down hill from there my friend. On follow up trips, it was the same script. She was cranky, whiny and did not stick to the agreed upon list of tasks for that day. As a good contractor, we plan what we need and have a few extra tools on hand, just in case something else pops up. Well, they sure did.
Worked my way through her check list in a methodical and orderly manner. She must have been pretty lonely on those days as she tended to follow me around from task to task and talked about a lot of personal issues regarding her children and how they don't come for visits or do much to help her out on "little things" much any more. (There's a Red Flag moment)
Since I was done sooner than anticipated with the check list, she added a few more things to keep me around a bit long that day. OK, fine as I didn't have any more appointments for that day. She was my last stop. Well, she was in a grumpy mood that day and decided that she'd play the Drill Instructor and I could play the new recruit. I'd no sooner start one project and she'd try to direct me in 2-3 other projects, all at the same time. (Sorry, that dog won't hunt in this party)
During all this, she would complain about how other contractors, neighbors and such, rarely did what she had asked for. After 90 minutes more of this crazy dance, I knew why. Well, I finished my tasks for that day and packed up my tools and went in to settle up for the day. Again, she wanted to talk, complain and so on. Finally, I said to her, "it must be tough for you being sick, lonely and not able to get around. However, I am a contractor and am here to do the work, take care of the tasks at hand and that's all". I am not your therapist, looking for a new female friend or like being pulled in all parts of the compass as I do my work!!! If you need that, hire a private care-taker.
To make a long story short, I did a few more jobs for her in subsequent weeks, but kept my distance. When she called for additional work assignments, something in the pit of my stomach said..."Are you sure you want to go back there again?" She again tried to side-track me with other un-related things, I just stated the obvious... "Am here to do the job you asked for dear... that's all". I finished up the tasks for that day, charged her a bit more than usual, (Aggrevation premium) and left.
Well sir, that was the end of it. She never called me again and I was happy to get that monkey off my back. However, a close friend of mine who also did other errands and such for her, gave me the low-down later. My "direct and to the point speech" finally hit home. This woman was so used to manipulating and trying to control others, when she finally met me, it blew her fuses.
Hehe My name was "MUD" in her eyes and frankly, I was very happy to have it be just that way. No more phone calls, no more aggravations and I moved on. All this to say... "Some folks would not be happy, even if we offered to lend them a brand new rope to hang themselves."
Yes, it's only a 2-3% of experiences I have noted to date. But when we see these coming, better to get out of the way as soon as possible. Life is full of wonderful opportunities and dogs. The sooner we figure out which from whom, the better life is for all parties involved.
End Rant!
Swez
jamesp on 03/2/2007 08:44:57
Yes sir, there are customers out there that you just dont want.
Swez, are you selling credit/debit card capture electronic devices in your new job? I read something like that ....I think...Or maybe it is more banking type equipment??Have you hit the ground running yet. I am pretty good at getting up what someone needs to do a task, even when I have to de-code what that task is, when they come to me for it. On the other hand, I dont like going to a potential customer and trying to sell them a product. I can maybe do it, once I get there. I just dread the thought of getting there...if that makes sense.If I didnt have this little problem I could be making some real money at my brothers insurance company. There is some truth in the old saying; it takes money to make money. That guy can make more in a casual little property deal or such, than Ill make working the rest of my life. Oh well Ill get over it...
swez on 03/2/2007 13:55:20
Yes, I did hit the ground running as of the 3rd day of employment. It was a very good learning opportunity on how not to run a business. This was selling equipment and discount rate contracts to small business for electronic funds capture, gift cards and the like.
Had high hopes for this opportunity as it was pitched very well from the providers training team, but once in the field, following up on company supplied leads, the warning lights on the dash came on brightly and stayed on each day I was out there. (Salesmen are often suckered by a good presentation)
Well, I gave it a week of solid effort and counted the costs VS returns and said... "this ain't adding up very well to the pitch I had been given". Being that this was a 100% commission gig and no paid expenses. The kicker was a joint conference meeting with verteran reps that had been selling for some time in the company. I heard an earful of issues from these guys. This gave me a a good "heads up" about what was ahead and how the company handles payouts to their reps. (Not a pretty sight)
When the trainer joined the conference, he was blasted with questions and concerns from the vets on the call. I just listened and took careful mental notes on his responses. My intuition was spot on and have learned to listen to those nagging gut reactions as they come up. (More dash lights came on) "Danger... Will Robinson"
Well, the die was cast and an executive decision needed to be made. (On the next page was a choice) The following morning, I waited for my manager to call with the days assignments and gave him my decision... "I'm outta here and you can have all your training manuals back as well". He tried to talk me out of it and offered to bump me to his upline manager for a debate. I said No thanks... I've seen and heard plenty and know this is the best option. Have a good day!
The lessons learned here were invaluable. May I share them with those who care to read them?
1. Learn what we are good at and press these skills to their limits.
2. Learn what we a not good at and minimize exposure to such tasks when possible.
3. Keep the eyes and ears wide open when looking at a new career path. If it sounds too good to be true, it probably is.
4. If a company is too eagar to recruit talent, there's a reason for it. (High employee turnover is usually the case)
5. Know thy self... some are hunters, some are seed planters and yet others are harvesters. Be true to ones traits, but observe the skills/traits of others as they can be combined in time to form a great team.
6. Integrity is more important then a large bank account that was filled by ill-gotten gains and deceptive dealings.
Ol man Swez is a planter/harvester type. I prefer to sew seeds, (Plant ideas) tend to them as they take root, (Consult as needed) and then harvest them in plenty in the proper season. (Reap the rewards from previous activities when the crop is ripe)
If you look back on our work together over that past few weeks, this is exactly what has taken place.
A. You had some basic ideas and I planted some fresh seeds that would net a better outcome later. (Planter)
B. We discussed the possibilities, options and potential outcomes that were possible. (Consulting) We built rapport along the way huh?
C. You followed up on such recommendations and are well on the way to an above average install. (Reaping stage = Satifaction to the nth degree)
In the meantime, we have become solidified partners in this process. You'll have an eventual system that will keep you happy for many years to come. I have the satisfaction of bringing fresh ideas to the table.
Have a great week and I hope your Infinity Comps come in soon. These will add a new dimension to your front stage that the RF's may now lack... more SQL in the front stage, a big improvement in the rear stage.
Swez
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