Capacitor Wiring Help

by Porkee113
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Im pretty sure my cap isnt working right because all my lights still dim when my subs hit. i have the wire going from my battery to a distribution block and then from the distribution block i have a wire going to an amp another wire going to another amp and then i have the wire going to the cap. Do i need to get a different splitter between the distribution block and the battery? or what else could be wrong.


Replies (40)
swez on 12/10/2006 19:31:08
Did you charge the cap after installing it?

Here's a pdf page that shows the proper way to charge them: (see page 2)

http://akamaipix.crutchfield.com/Manuals/120/120PP912U.PDF

Swez

Porkee113 on 12/10/2006 19:42:48
Ya i charged it. with the little wire thing. the LCD lights up and says like 13 then goes down to 10 or 9 when it hits but all my lights dim. could it be that i need a new battery. and if so where could i get a more powerful one??


Porkee113 on 12/10/2006 19:51:21
can it be not charged enough?

swez on 12/10/2006 20:04:45
Say more about your entire system OK?

Vehicle type, amps used, wire gage from battery to amp(s) and subs.

Your voltage (LCD gage) is telling you the electrical system is having a heart attack, each time the bass hits hard. The severe drop in voltage is often a sign of a faulty Alternator or a dying battery. (Assuming the vehicle is running when you noted those voltage numbers.)

Swez

Porkee113 on 12/10/2006 20:23:01
ya thats probably the problem. i need a new battery. ive had the battery since before i got the system. i just wanted to make sure my wiring of the cap was correct. know anywhere i can get good car/audio batteries so my car doesnt die??

swez on 12/10/2006 21:24:02
Most major autoparts stores, (AutoZone, Pep Boys, Sears Auto, ect.) can test your electrical system for free and tell you exactly what needs to be replaced.

A healthy alternator is the main component to look at when using high powered audio gear. When the engine is running, all power demands are placed on the ALT. The battery is primarily there for starting the engine. It can also act as a "current buffer", (A large storage reserve) when the ALT cannot meet the full demands of a given system.

We know a battery is going bad when it does not start the vehicle after sitting over night in cold weather. We look for ALT problems when it cannot maintain a steady charging value, (13.5 -14.4 volts) after the engine starts.

Finally, when running high powered amplifiers, it is best to use a high capacity battery. (About 750 Cold Cranking Amps should do it) However, the ALT has to be up to snuff as well. Have them both checked out properly, before you buy anything.

Swez

Porkee113 on 12/10/2006 21:39:49
ok thanks for all the help. so basically i need a 750 Cold Cranking Amp battery and a better alternator. at first when i installed it i noticed everything brighter and it didnt dim. then after like a week it started to dim again. thanks for all the help

Porkee113 on 12/10/2006 21:50:15
does having a too powerfull cap like 2farad when u would only need a 1 farad matter??

cplkittle on 12/10/2006 22:19:02
caps aren't really all they are cracked up to be. If you listen to rap, there is no way your lights aren't going to dim. 10000000 capacitors wouldn't make a difference.
I can't even sell them anymore. If someone comes in to the shop and tells me they need a capacitor, I tell them not to waste their money and go get a battery. If you want eye candy, that's all they're good for.

swez on 12/10/2006 22:33:28
Sounds like your stock ALT is not handling the power demands from the amplifier(s) you have now. If you have the stock V-6 engine package, it's probably got a standard 105 amp ALT and ~600 CCA rated BAT.

FYI: This ALT only puts out about 50 amperes of current at idle. Once the engine RPM is above ~2000 RPM, then it can produce a solid 105 amps of current. Your vehicle needs about 50-60 amps of current to operate properly.

A 2 Farad cap is OK for minor light dimming issues in a healthy electrical system. However, if using high current draw amplifiers and a stock electrical system, chances are very good that your ALT is damaged and just dropping in a new/rebuilt 105A will fail again later.

Here, a better strategy is to use a H.O. ALT that can feed your amps adequately as well as meeting the cars' needs too. We also recommend upgrading the main power wires for large amp installs. Have a look at this: The Big 3 Upgrade

http://forum.sounddomain.com/forum/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=5;t=007801;p=

Swez

Porkee113 on 12/10/2006 22:40:00
could i take it into a car audio place and they do it? wat would be the price range of upgrading all my electrical stuff? and whats the best place for someone else to work on it cuz im only 17 and not the best with car electrical stuff.

cplkittle on 12/10/2006 23:00:59
We charged $65 to install a new battery. and $65 to run the wires for an amplifier install.
If you have a little patience as far as time goes, we can walk you through it, and you can spend the money you save on your equiptment.


Porkee113 on 12/11/2006 00:10:27
so what electrical stuff do i need to have a kick ass system. i have all the wires i need i just want to upgrade my sub and amp part. that would be great if u could walk me through it cuz i like doing stuff to my car, but im not going to be able to work on it and buy the stuff till around jan. feb. cuz i broke my ankle in 4 spots and its kinda hard getting around. i have to hop.
so just tell me what stuff i should get. im thinkn about getting 2 12" mtx 8500 and i dont know what amp to get for them,
thnx,
Cory

swez on 12/11/2006 00:14:29
$65.00 to install a battery??? That's highway robbery (for 20 minutes of very simple work) Kit. OMG!!!

Lemme get over the shock on that one a second OK...

Well Porkee, this is a good time to learn how to work on basic things in your car. It's not rocket science and having an older guy who is pretty well set with tools and a good working knowledge, can teach you a good deal in time.

With the proper tools and some patience, removing/installing a new battery or even a H.O. alternator are generally pretty simple on most older GM vehicles. (Especially is the alternator is up on top the engine and just off the passenger side)

These are a lead-pipe cinch with a low cost socket set, (SAE and Metric sockets 3/8" & 1/4" drive kits) The hardest part is releasing the pressure on the serpintine drive belt tensioner pully. Here again, the right tool makes this very easy too.

Do you have any buddies whos' dad's are pretty good mechanics or older relatives that can assist and loan you the proper tools? If yes, talk to them and see if you can get some time with them to guide and provide a seasoned hand.

Once you have lined up such a person, we need to look at exactly what you'll need to do and the sequence of steps to get it done well. We can walk you through the steps, but having the right tools and some basic mechanical know how sure helps.

Swez

PS If we lived in the same general area, I'd be happy to take you under my wing and teach you what you need to know. It sounds like an older man would be most helpful to you now. Even if your Dad is clueless on such matters, there msut be someone you can hook up with to mentor and oversee your future success. Think hard... who might that be?

Swez

Porkee113 on 12/11/2006 00:20:58
Ya my dad is pretty good with that stuff and my step dad has all the tools ill need probably. im in seattle washington so im a little far away. i just want to know how to get the best system, i like to listen to rap, and just blow everyone away with how much bass and sound my system has. my system now is o.k but i want to upgrade to a kick ass system.
thnx u guys for the help so far im lookin forward to talking to u guys for more help
thanks,
Cory

Porkee113 on 12/11/2006 00:21:45
i can replace the battery and the basic stuff and my dad can do the alternator. i just need to know wat battery and wat alternator to get.

swez on 12/11/2006 01:20:34
Your Battery is probably the 75 series AC/Delco model. (Rotten side mount terminals are a PITA) The Optima Red Top offers both Side and top mount terminals and a great choice for car audio connections:

http://www.1st-optima-batteries.com/

Red Top Series: 75/25 (Good)
Model: 8022-091725U SC75U
12Volts
44 AH
720 CCA
910 CA
Med-Small
Reserve Minutes:90
$139.99

Yellow Top Deep Cycle: 75/25 (Better)
Model: 8014-045 D750U SC34DU
12Volts
55 AH
750 CCA
870 CA
Medium
Reserve Mins:120
$159.99
**************************************************************************

The common ALT for most small V-6 engines is a CS130 series, 105A model. Give these guys a call and ask about their 160, 170 and 200A model versions for your make and model vehicle:

http://www.motorcityreman.com/contact.html

These guys have been in biz for a long time and many have used their products too. I have yet to hear of anyone who bought one that was not completely satisfied with what they carry and offer.

FYI: The min size I would suggest here, is the the 160A version. The 170 or 200A models would be better if you really plan to use high current amplifiers, (1500 watts RMS or higher with all amps considered)

Swez

ryan2 on 12/11/2006 12:15:18
Hey swez read through his first post again. Also Porkee tell me if this is correct.

You have a wire going from the batt. to the distribution block. Then you have 3 wires coming out of the distribution block. One wire to one amp, one wire to another amp, and one wire to the cap. Correct?

If so the cap is doing anything for the amp because the amps arent connected to the cap at all.

It should be a wire running from the batt. to the cap. And then from the positive on the cap to the distribution block. Then run two wires from the distribution block to each amp.

ravin on 12/11/2006 13:55:25
Ryan right Porkee. Make sure the juice is getting to the amps. I just saw that Costco now carries Optima batteries so you can pick them up there pretty easily if you are a member. Just thought I would mention that since I wasn't aware of it until about a month ago. Also you may want to try a larger gauge wire from your alternator to your battery before upgrading alternators. You don't even have to get rid of the factory cable just add another and run it in paralell to your battery.

Porkee113 on 12/11/2006 17:49:59
ya ryan 3 wires come out of the distribution block and one of the 3 is the cap wire. do i just cut the wire between the distribution block and battery and connect both ends to the positive? and what would happen if i got the yellow top battery but stayed with the stock alternator?

swez on 12/11/2006 18:25:36
The Cap is used to power your sub amp only. Here's how it should be wired:

D-block ------> to Cap------> to sub amp B+ terminal.

This is a basic parallel connection as the Cap and sub amp have common grounding points. The Cap is installed between the main power supply terminal, and the CAP output goes to your sub amps' B+ terminal.

Swez

Porkee113 on 12/11/2006 18:29:54
are there pictures of this. sorry i dont get how that works. wats the B+ terminal and do i just put both wires to the positives side. i already have the ground wire hooked up.

cplkittle on 12/11/2006 22:56:04
Most of the time the capacitors are used as distribution blocks. You can stack several wires on each post.. however you want to do it.
It is pretty simple power (+) comes from the battery and goes to the cap (+) and from there goes to the amplifiers (+)

The negative terminal of the capacitor goes to ground and can either go to the amplifier grounds or, the amplifiers can ground through seperate wires to the same location as the cap ground.

Porkee113 on 12/11/2006 23:18:13
so u can hook as many wires to the cap as you want??

swez on 12/12/2006 00:30:03
Again, the Cap is designed for use with sub amps. If you have more than 1 sub amp in the system, it is correct to power all sub amps off the Cap. Mid/high amps generally do not require a Cap as they don't have the huge surge currents typically found in sub amps.

Swez

PS The B+ terminal of an amplifier, is the Positive power wire input lug. They are on in the same.

Porkee113 on 12/12/2006 01:09:47
ok thanks another question though does it matter if i have 2 farad cap and i only have one for a 1 farad or even .5 farad or does it matter.??

cplkittle on 12/12/2006 02:57:28
Stinger makes a 35 farad cap that makes a significant difference compared to 2, 3, or 5 farad caps.
Capacitor farad size will make a difference. Honestly though an extra battery is better.

Porkee113 on 12/12/2006 12:02:04
i mean if you have a higher capacity cap then you actually need. will it mess anything up or is it just better??? and im probably gonna get a new battery too.

cplkittle on 12/12/2006 15:30:22
You can not have too much or too big a capacitor.
if you have a 150 watt amp and ten 5 farad capacitors, you are still no where near having too much.
For that matter I don't think you can have too many batteries either.

Porkee113 on 12/13/2006 17:18:15
ok thnx

Porkee113 on 12/14/2006 17:51:19
what if the gauge of the wire coming from distribution block to cap is bigger then all the other power wires. like 4gauge from battery to distribution then 2 gauge fromm distribution to cap then 4 guage from cap to amp??? does that matter. it is because the bigger gauge wire came with the cap i bought so i just put it on. does it mess anything up or is it fine???????

Porkee113 on 12/14/2006 22:51:44
how much would the kit cost. and i already have rca cables and remote wire.

Porkee113 on 12/14/2006 22:52:20
and i already have a 2farad cap. bought from ebay

Porkee113 on 12/14/2006 23:20:22
does the bigger wire i have in mess anything up or do anything????

cplkittle on 12/14/2006 23:45:18
The only thing that matters is that the wire is big enough to carry the current from the battery to the amp.

Porkee113 on 12/15/2006 00:09:43
so a bigger wire in one spot doesnt do anythign. right

Porkee113 on 12/15/2006 13:28:37
ok thnx,
Cory

Porkee113@hotmail.com

swez on 12/15/2006 18:21:42
Guys, since your both new here, I will just say that we generally avoid selling/trading transactions on this site. If one has a selling item and another is interested in buying, best to do this off site on private e-mails, e-bay or some other manner. We have adopted this policy for very good reasons and it just works best to keep such things off the main board.

I'll remove the posts related to this transaction and let you fellas work it out via private e-mails OK.

Thanks your full cooperation,
Swez

PS Poorkee, mind starting a new thread as this one is getting long and hard to stay current with your new ideas and needs. Time for a new doodle sheet if you would be so kind.

Porkee113 on 12/16/2006 13:50:49
ya sure and ya were talking over email now.

ShootuhMcBustaCap on 12/16/2006 15:14:53
Sorry bout that guys, go ahead and pull those off, were getting it taken care of right now.



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