hello guys well my best friend bought a new car 97 caviler 2 door. he wants to get a new cd player fornt and rear speakers and maybe an amp to power them with.he has a budjet of about 400 or 500. i showed him the pioneer premire deh-p480mp
http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/pna/v3/pg/product/details/0,,2076_310069882_291078841_tab=B,00.html?compName=PNA_V3_ProductDetailsComponent
he liked the price and features so as far as a cd player i think we have that taken care of but when it comes to speakers i need some help he would like some tweets in the front i checked at crutchfield the factory front speakers are 4x6 in the door and 6x9 in the rear they say that you canput an adaptor and fit a 5 1/4 if this is a posibility dose anybody know where to get some of those ?any sudjestions on fronts rears and posible an amp would be great and the cd player i found about 120 so that leaves about 300 to 400 as a budjet
Replies (13)
ttocs on 11/8/2006 23:42:08
deck is a bit of a pain, you have to take the entire top of the dash off before removing the black plastick that surrounds the radio and gauges.
ryan2 on 11/9/2006 01:26:18
You can fit 5 1/4" speakers in there with a breeze. Crutchfield probably has the adapters or you can just cut a wood baffle and mount that to the door. You can also fit a 6 1/2" speaker in there but that is a tight squeeze from the back of the magnet to the window rolled down. But I would recommend going with the 5 1/4" speakers.
I had 6 1/2" in my 97 Cavalier using a 3/4" wooden baffle.
swez on 11/9/2006 08:44:26
The 4x6 front speakers are OK for mids and highs. If you stick with this format, use bass blockers above 250 Hz on them and get your midbass from the 6x9's in the rear. Imaging will be fair with 2-way coaxials or Comps. However, outboard amping will really bring things to life.
Does this car have factory amps? The Premium audio package (Monsoon systems) do offer it and if he swaps out the stock radio, there are kits available to use the factory amps w/ Aftermarket HU's.
He can also opt for HU or outboard amping if desired. That HU has plenty of nice features and he'll get the best results if using outboard amps and decent aftermarket speakers.
Comments,
Swez
raulbustos on 11/9/2006 11:08:07
ok well after doing some searches i liked these speakers what do you guys think ?
front
http://www.crutchfield.com/S-zwfcQ9DvQFS/cgi-bin/ProdView.asp?g=400&I=1085010CS
rear
http://www.crutchfield.com/S-zwfcQ9DvQFS/cgi-bin/Prodview.asp?readmore=true&g=400&I=1086927I#Tab
and no he dosent have th monson setup although after looking at the car i noticed that some one had already instaled a kenwood tape deck so i dont have to worry about a dash kit if you guys aprove of these speakers what amp would you sudjest to use with this there is about 150 left for an amp
swez on 11/9/2006 11:32:16
The front speakers are a good choice. A little careful shopping may bring the price down enough to buy a good amp. I recommend the Infinity Kappa 52.7i up front as these are 2 ohm units also.
The rear speakers are 2 ohm versions. This would allow you to run a smaller amp and still get good power. However, the system will be difficult to balance properly. I've installed the 6x8 version of this series and found them very strong and efficient. The tweeters are a bit bright on the normal crossover settings, but can be adjusted with the built in attenuator circuit that comes with the tweeter. (+3or 0dB adjustment switch)
Again, shop around for the best price you can get on the speakers noted. Once you have a remaining budget figure, we can look for a suitable 4 channel amp in that price range.
Swez
raulbustos on 11/9/2006 11:46:56
so you think these frons would do beter than the comps?
only one problem is that i noticed that crutchfield says they wont fit
http://www.crutchfield.com/S-CBZOSUa90tJ/cgi-bin/ProdView.asp?search=Kappa+52%2E7i&i=108527I
dont know why what you think. one plus is these are a litle cheaper
swez on 11/9/2006 16:41:27
If you want Comps up front, then go for these:
http://www.crutchfield.com/S-0j2BSyho3ni/cgi-bin/ProdView.asp?g=410&I=108507CS ($280.00)
Want a better price?
http://www.etronics.com/planding.asp?dp=E2F2C21222E682525373D363F3B357E373637353333303&stk_code=inf507cs&svbname=403 ($160)
6x9's
http://www.etronics.com/planding.asp?dp=E2F2024222E682325363D363F3B357E3736373D3333303&stk_code=inf6927i&svbname=30 ($200.00 @ Crutch, <$120.00 here)
Pioneer DEH-P480MP:
http://www.etronics.com/product.asp?stk_code=piodehp480mp&store=&catid=317 ($122)
How's that float your boat? (160 + 120 + 122) = $402.00 + S/H
Amp: Infinity Reference 7541a: $140.00 + S/H
http://www.bargainunlimited.com/servlet/Detail?no=68
There, under $600.00 for the whole package + your wiring and additional hardware.
Primo amp here dude. Installed the JBL's smaller sister (6 channel amp) amp for a customer a few months back and he used Infinity's in back, CDT Classic Comps up front and even 2 channels for a sub. (300 RMS @ 4 ohm loads) and yes, this smaller amp rocked with 2 ohm speakers. This one will work nice, if you need a modest sub channel too:
http://www.crutchfield.com/S-KeMMsILYUsX/cgi-bin/ProdView.asp?g=120&I=108R5761A ($214)
http://www.bargainunlimited.com/servlet/Detail?no=302
Swez
raulbustos on 11/11/2006 09:30:10
well let me ask you this what woud be the diference between
http://www.crutchfield.com/S-0j2BSyho3ni/cgi-bin/ProdView.asp?g=410&I=108507CS
http://www.crutchfield.com/S-CBZOSUa90tJ/cgi-bin/ProdView.asp?search=Kappa+52%2E7i&i=108527I
swez on 11/11/2006 10:24:28
About $150.00 is the difference as near as I can tell. GRIN (At least at Crutchfield anyway)
One is a 2 ohm set of Comps that handles 85 watts RMS. The other is a Coaxial set, also 2 ohms and rated at 55 watts RMS.
Both have outboard crossovers in the kit and probably similar speakers are used. The Coaxials have fixed tweeters that pivot for good stereo imaging characteristics, These would also be a bit easier to install too. If you are looking to cut cost and install time, use these.
The Comps give the user more options on where to install the tweeter. Here, optimal stereo imaging is available as you can mount the tweeters anywhere you like. If you are after an optimal install and price is not an issue, go for the Comps.
swez
raulbustos on 11/11/2006 21:18:00
i have a question about the amp the front speakers only handel 55watts rms and the rear handel 110rms but the nfinity Reference 7541a makes 140rms @2 ohms isnt this a little much for these speakers?
swez on 11/11/2006 22:34:48
Depending on how one sets things up, it sure can be. However, a sharp installer will allow additional "clean" power from the amp w/o harming the speakers that are rated at somewhat lower power.
It's all about gain structure and setting speaker power based on voltage and impedence limits of the weakest link.
Hint: A 50 watt (RMS) speaker can handle short duration peaks of clean music power, well above RMS ratings. It when we greatly exceed the RMS power of a given speaker and keep it that way, it's considered abuse and speaker failure is imminent.
Also, you'll want your strongest, (Best) speakers up front. (Not in the back) If you wish to save money and get a good mix, use 2 ohm Comps up front and 4 ohm Coaxials in the back. Here, we get plenty of clean power where we want it... (Front stage) and good fill from the rear stage.
It's all about how one tweaks the amp at the final stage of the install.... (With a voltmeter, a good set of ears and skillful tweaking to balanace it all out)
Do you get all this?
Swez
raulbustos on 11/11/2006 23:00:11
all rite sounds good ill show him both the comps and coaxials and see whats in his price range
swez on 11/12/2006 09:46:51
Good plan Raul. It's his dime and he can choose how he wishes to spend it.
If you do the install work, make sure you have a meter handy when dialing in the amp gains. I can give you the approximate voltage targets off the amp outputs, once the speaker choices have been made.
Again, put the best speakers up front!
Swez
http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/pna/v3/pg/product/details/0,,2076_310069882_291078841_tab=B,00.html?compName=PNA_V3_ProductDetailsComponent
he liked the price and features so as far as a cd player i think we have that taken care of but when it comes to speakers i need some help he would like some tweets in the front i checked at crutchfield the factory front speakers are 4x6 in the door and 6x9 in the rear they say that you canput an adaptor and fit a 5 1/4 if this is a posibility dose anybody know where to get some of those ?any sudjestions on fronts rears and posible an amp would be great and the cd player i found about 120 so that leaves about 300 to 400 as a budjet
Replies (13)
ttocs on 11/8/2006 23:42:08
deck is a bit of a pain, you have to take the entire top of the dash off before removing the black plastick that surrounds the radio and gauges.
ryan2 on 11/9/2006 01:26:18
You can fit 5 1/4" speakers in there with a breeze. Crutchfield probably has the adapters or you can just cut a wood baffle and mount that to the door. You can also fit a 6 1/2" speaker in there but that is a tight squeeze from the back of the magnet to the window rolled down. But I would recommend going with the 5 1/4" speakers.
I had 6 1/2" in my 97 Cavalier using a 3/4" wooden baffle.
swez on 11/9/2006 08:44:26
The 4x6 front speakers are OK for mids and highs. If you stick with this format, use bass blockers above 250 Hz on them and get your midbass from the 6x9's in the rear. Imaging will be fair with 2-way coaxials or Comps. However, outboard amping will really bring things to life.
Does this car have factory amps? The Premium audio package (Monsoon systems) do offer it and if he swaps out the stock radio, there are kits available to use the factory amps w/ Aftermarket HU's.
He can also opt for HU or outboard amping if desired. That HU has plenty of nice features and he'll get the best results if using outboard amps and decent aftermarket speakers.
Comments,
Swez
raulbustos on 11/9/2006 11:08:07
ok well after doing some searches i liked these speakers what do you guys think ?
front
http://www.crutchfield.com/S-zwfcQ9DvQFS/cgi-bin/ProdView.asp?g=400&I=1085010CS
rear
http://www.crutchfield.com/S-zwfcQ9DvQFS/cgi-bin/Prodview.asp?readmore=true&g=400&I=1086927I#Tab
and no he dosent have th monson setup although after looking at the car i noticed that some one had already instaled a kenwood tape deck so i dont have to worry about a dash kit if you guys aprove of these speakers what amp would you sudjest to use with this there is about 150 left for an amp
swez on 11/9/2006 11:32:16
The front speakers are a good choice. A little careful shopping may bring the price down enough to buy a good amp. I recommend the Infinity Kappa 52.7i up front as these are 2 ohm units also.
The rear speakers are 2 ohm versions. This would allow you to run a smaller amp and still get good power. However, the system will be difficult to balance properly. I've installed the 6x8 version of this series and found them very strong and efficient. The tweeters are a bit bright on the normal crossover settings, but can be adjusted with the built in attenuator circuit that comes with the tweeter. (+3or 0dB adjustment switch)
Again, shop around for the best price you can get on the speakers noted. Once you have a remaining budget figure, we can look for a suitable 4 channel amp in that price range.
Swez
raulbustos on 11/9/2006 11:46:56
so you think these frons would do beter than the comps?
only one problem is that i noticed that crutchfield says they wont fit
http://www.crutchfield.com/S-CBZOSUa90tJ/cgi-bin/ProdView.asp?search=Kappa+52%2E7i&i=108527I
dont know why what you think. one plus is these are a litle cheaper
swez on 11/9/2006 16:41:27
If you want Comps up front, then go for these:
http://www.crutchfield.com/S-0j2BSyho3ni/cgi-bin/ProdView.asp?g=410&I=108507CS ($280.00)
Want a better price?
http://www.etronics.com/planding.asp?dp=E2F2C21222E682525373D363F3B357E373637353333303&stk_code=inf507cs&svbname=403 ($160)
6x9's
http://www.etronics.com/planding.asp?dp=E2F2024222E682325363D363F3B357E3736373D3333303&stk_code=inf6927i&svbname=30 ($200.00 @ Crutch, <$120.00 here)
Pioneer DEH-P480MP:
http://www.etronics.com/product.asp?stk_code=piodehp480mp&store=&catid=317 ($122)
How's that float your boat? (160 + 120 + 122) = $402.00 + S/H
Amp: Infinity Reference 7541a: $140.00 + S/H
http://www.bargainunlimited.com/servlet/Detail?no=68
There, under $600.00 for the whole package + your wiring and additional hardware.
Primo amp here dude. Installed the JBL's smaller sister (6 channel amp) amp for a customer a few months back and he used Infinity's in back, CDT Classic Comps up front and even 2 channels for a sub. (300 RMS @ 4 ohm loads) and yes, this smaller amp rocked with 2 ohm speakers. This one will work nice, if you need a modest sub channel too:
http://www.crutchfield.com/S-KeMMsILYUsX/cgi-bin/ProdView.asp?g=120&I=108R5761A ($214)
http://www.bargainunlimited.com/servlet/Detail?no=302
Swez
raulbustos on 11/11/2006 09:30:10
well let me ask you this what woud be the diference between
http://www.crutchfield.com/S-0j2BSyho3ni/cgi-bin/ProdView.asp?g=410&I=108507CS
http://www.crutchfield.com/S-CBZOSUa90tJ/cgi-bin/ProdView.asp?search=Kappa+52%2E7i&i=108527I
swez on 11/11/2006 10:24:28
About $150.00 is the difference as near as I can tell. GRIN (At least at Crutchfield anyway)
One is a 2 ohm set of Comps that handles 85 watts RMS. The other is a Coaxial set, also 2 ohms and rated at 55 watts RMS.
Both have outboard crossovers in the kit and probably similar speakers are used. The Coaxials have fixed tweeters that pivot for good stereo imaging characteristics, These would also be a bit easier to install too. If you are looking to cut cost and install time, use these.
The Comps give the user more options on where to install the tweeter. Here, optimal stereo imaging is available as you can mount the tweeters anywhere you like. If you are after an optimal install and price is not an issue, go for the Comps.
swez
raulbustos on 11/11/2006 21:18:00
i have a question about the amp the front speakers only handel 55watts rms and the rear handel 110rms but the nfinity Reference 7541a makes 140rms @2 ohms isnt this a little much for these speakers?
swez on 11/11/2006 22:34:48
Depending on how one sets things up, it sure can be. However, a sharp installer will allow additional "clean" power from the amp w/o harming the speakers that are rated at somewhat lower power.
It's all about gain structure and setting speaker power based on voltage and impedence limits of the weakest link.
Hint: A 50 watt (RMS) speaker can handle short duration peaks of clean music power, well above RMS ratings. It when we greatly exceed the RMS power of a given speaker and keep it that way, it's considered abuse and speaker failure is imminent.
Also, you'll want your strongest, (Best) speakers up front. (Not in the back) If you wish to save money and get a good mix, use 2 ohm Comps up front and 4 ohm Coaxials in the back. Here, we get plenty of clean power where we want it... (Front stage) and good fill from the rear stage.
It's all about how one tweaks the amp at the final stage of the install.... (With a voltmeter, a good set of ears and skillful tweaking to balanace it all out)
Do you get all this?
Swez
raulbustos on 11/11/2006 23:00:11
all rite sounds good ill show him both the comps and coaxials and see whats in his price range
swez on 11/12/2006 09:46:51
Good plan Raul. It's his dime and he can choose how he wishes to spend it.
If you do the install work, make sure you have a meter handy when dialing in the amp gains. I can give you the approximate voltage targets off the amp outputs, once the speaker choices have been made.
Again, put the best speakers up front!
Swez
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