whats up guys i have a problem with power in my car. i drive a 95 probe gt, i have a pioneer 940mp going to an Audiocontrol EQS, 3 amps: Coustic 401(tweeters) Coustic 601(mids) and Power Acoustic 1800db (subs: 2 cerwin vega vegas dvc wired to 1 ohm)
here is the problem:
so i am playing a song, for example Oh I Think They Like Me, by Franchise Boys. the bass on the deck is turned down to 50hz at -24. the song will play for a minute, then the entire system will shut off( all 3 amps, EQS,) except for the CD player which will still be going strong. after a half minute, it wil turn back on without me touching a thing. here is the weird part, the amps do not got to protect, the breaker does not trip, and the Voltage is Still at around 12. i turn the deck off then on and get nothing, turn the car off then on, and still nothing. it is as if you pulled the power right from the battery. the only way for it to play again is for it to do it by itself. i know it is not the deck, because i had an alpine 9847 with a Visonik 1000 for the mids and highs and did the same thing. i have 4awg power and grounds to all amps. the mids and tweeters are at 2 ohms. THINK i need help on this one ....thanks alot
Replies (19)
MrBrownstone on 02/4/2006 23:59:22
There's likely 1 problem...your head unit is turning on too many things with one little remote turn on.
Basically, your head unit and it's remote on (or power antenna wire) are designed to put out a little pulse, and that's it. Once you add 3 or 4 pieces of equipment (such as amps and crossovers/eqs) it doesn't have enough power to handle this.
If you guy a relay, it will likely solve your problem. Basically, the relay is nothing more than an 'amplifier' for your remote turn on. Bosch makes them, and the good news is that you can find one at just about any auto parts store...and it doesn't matter the brand.
UKinstaller on 02/5/2006 00:29:40
try hooking up one amp to the remote wire and 2 of them to the ignition (red) wire on your radio harness.
-UK
ttocs on 02/5/2006 11:49:53
or just switch your remote to the +12 volt switched behind the deck.
MrBrownstone on 02/6/2006 12:24:49
ttocs
That would mean the amps, etc., would come on every time the ignition switch is on...even if the stereo isn't desired. that is quite the easy way to do it though, as that should be able to power a number of pieces.
ttocs on 02/6/2006 14:51:56
yes, the amps will turn on with the key, just like every other accesory.
ok, wait a min.
The GT models normally come with the JBL premium sound. IF it is not bypassed properly it could be putting your deck into a protect mode.
Victor on 02/7/2006 16:45:52
I would suggest using a relay here, and as Mr.B suggested bosch makes some really good switching relays, I have made it a habit to use a relay when i have to switch on more than 2 equipmets thru the HU remote lead...
Victor...
swez on 02/8/2006 13:17:11
Agreed! Most HU remotes can supply 250-300 mA of current to all devices on that line. That usually means a max of 2 amps and perhaps 1 processor.
If we go over that limit, the HU remote will often act up or fail altogether. The best option is to employ a common Bosch relay that the solinoid is activated by the Rem signal, and other termination devices are powered by a constant 12 volt supply. This allows for 10-40A of power, off the relay output leads and plenty to power many devices. (depends on the relay used)
Swez
cleanup on 02/8/2006 15:36:02
thanks alot i will try that in a week or two, so "hard asses " are stealing sterios around campus, (happened to 3 cars last night) so i am gonna take my stuff out. it isnt like i am too descrete with my system either. but that sounds like what the problem would be. thanks alot guys
swez on 02/8/2006 18:13:48
Sounds like some "hard arsez" need a good lesson about "Eminenent Domain". Well, a slight deviiation of that anyway...
" Yo! Touch my stuff and you will meet my friend Mr. Shotgun. He is full of rock salt and if you get a butt full of him, you can't even sit in a snow bank for relieve of the itching and burning of these little roids."
Two things I hate:
1. Liars and manipulators
2. Thieves
Swez
cleanup on 03/22/2006 16:58:01
ok so the system is back in, new alarm (prestiege aps997) and the relay was installed......still no go... i connected a hot wire to the batt to a switch and then to the amps and still shuts off after a while. there is no remote from the deck to any amps or eq. basically i have given up.....i am gonna just drive this hoe off a cliff
swez on 03/22/2006 17:33:39
Hummm, this is a very unusual set of issues. Since you have some very strong amps here, the stock electrical system is going to be very stressed on long, loud bass notes. Large current spikes are likely and could be the root cause. The PA 1800dB alone, would be enough to run a stock electrical system into mayhem.
Also, If both amps are pulling more than 80A's of current per each, #4 gage wire may not handle this much current well either.
A 3rd option to consider, is the Audio Control EQ crapping out for a time and this shuts the amps off? This is the device I would probably probe 1st. If this EQ shuts off, (for some unforeseen reason) everthing connected to it will go out as well.
Do you have a multimeter to test DC/AC voltages and ohmic loads? This would be a very helpful diagnostic tool. For $20.00, Radio Shack has a nice handheld, digital meter that will help you diagnose many circuits.
If you are willing to take on the task, we can walk you through some basic electrical tests that may help eliminate the problem. The challenge is to take AC & DV voltage readings while the system is working properly. Then, when the system goes out, run the tests again ASAP and see what readings have changed. That should give more clues.
Don't give up now. This is what separates the "determined" man, from the "I'm a quitter" mentality. Hang tough and get out the test meter and a scratch pad.
Gung-Ho bud,
Swez USFLAG
cleanup on 03/22/2006 21:47:00
yeah i was thinking the bass was just sucking too much outta it, but i turned the amp off and had the mids and tweeters alone going and that botch still shut off, but it turns back on fairly quickly....i am tinking i have a loose wire somewhere so this weekend it is gonna tear down and rebuild....and probally gonna get a new breaker, that one might just me too rattled out
swez on 03/22/2006 23:27:40
Yes, this may indeed be a possible problem. When a breaker trips, all power to amps will stop and it takes a while for the bi-metal strips to cool and return to closed circuit position. They can go bad too. Under the hood, is a very extreme environment. Fuses tend to be more reliable. Either they work or they blow.
What size is that breaker anyway? A Maxi or ANL type fuse would solve this issue, if that is the origin or your situation.
Swez
cleanup on 03/23/2006 12:05:49
i have a 200amp, but it is kinda old, i am gonna pick up a waffer fuse today and install it
swez on 03/23/2006 12:19:34
Good plan Stan. If it blows when you really push the system, we know you need to go higher in amoerage ratings.
BTW, what gage power wire is now in use from the fuse/breaker, back to your amps? For a 200A fuse, the wire gage should be #2 minimum or a pair of #4's in parallel, at the outputside of the fuse holder.
Swez
cleanup on 03/26/2006 03:08:46
so i messed w/ the position of the breaker, and checked all ther wires, and so far so good....gonna see what happens next
swez on 03/26/2006 09:20:59
If you can remove the breaker, pull off the cap and then inspect the bi-metal strips for burn marks or rust. If you can clean off the oxides with fine steel wool pad or a very fine grit emery paper, it may work just fine again.
If that fails to produce the desired results, scrap the breaker and install a wafer fuse.
Good luck,
Swez
PS Breakers are fine for controlled temperature, humidity and indoor conditions. However, I have had problems with home circuit breakers that were installed in the garage. Especially the high current one that fused the external AC condenser unit.
cleanup on 03/27/2006 22:42:42
thanks, i think i am gonna change it, if i dont sell the car first that is. i let the car sit for a while, got out, and let the system play for a while, and it shut off still so i dont think it is a wire, so wafer it is. . . .keep yall updated, thanks for all the help and ideas
Clean UP
swez on 03/27/2006 22:50:19
Everything noted so far, points to your breaker. It's tripping prematurely, stays off til cool, then re-connects later and it back through the cycle again.
One good thing about a fuse... it's good or it ain't. No guess work involved. Get a spare too.
Swez
here is the problem:
so i am playing a song, for example Oh I Think They Like Me, by Franchise Boys. the bass on the deck is turned down to 50hz at -24. the song will play for a minute, then the entire system will shut off( all 3 amps, EQS,) except for the CD player which will still be going strong. after a half minute, it wil turn back on without me touching a thing. here is the weird part, the amps do not got to protect, the breaker does not trip, and the Voltage is Still at around 12. i turn the deck off then on and get nothing, turn the car off then on, and still nothing. it is as if you pulled the power right from the battery. the only way for it to play again is for it to do it by itself. i know it is not the deck, because i had an alpine 9847 with a Visonik 1000 for the mids and highs and did the same thing. i have 4awg power and grounds to all amps. the mids and tweeters are at 2 ohms. THINK i need help on this one ....thanks alot
Replies (19)
MrBrownstone on 02/4/2006 23:59:22
There's likely 1 problem...your head unit is turning on too many things with one little remote turn on.
Basically, your head unit and it's remote on (or power antenna wire) are designed to put out a little pulse, and that's it. Once you add 3 or 4 pieces of equipment (such as amps and crossovers/eqs) it doesn't have enough power to handle this.
If you guy a relay, it will likely solve your problem. Basically, the relay is nothing more than an 'amplifier' for your remote turn on. Bosch makes them, and the good news is that you can find one at just about any auto parts store...and it doesn't matter the brand.
UKinstaller on 02/5/2006 00:29:40
try hooking up one amp to the remote wire and 2 of them to the ignition (red) wire on your radio harness.
-UK
ttocs on 02/5/2006 11:49:53
or just switch your remote to the +12 volt switched behind the deck.
MrBrownstone on 02/6/2006 12:24:49
ttocs
That would mean the amps, etc., would come on every time the ignition switch is on...even if the stereo isn't desired. that is quite the easy way to do it though, as that should be able to power a number of pieces.
ttocs on 02/6/2006 14:51:56
yes, the amps will turn on with the key, just like every other accesory.
ok, wait a min.
The GT models normally come with the JBL premium sound. IF it is not bypassed properly it could be putting your deck into a protect mode.
Victor on 02/7/2006 16:45:52
I would suggest using a relay here, and as Mr.B suggested bosch makes some really good switching relays, I have made it a habit to use a relay when i have to switch on more than 2 equipmets thru the HU remote lead...
Victor...
swez on 02/8/2006 13:17:11
Agreed! Most HU remotes can supply 250-300 mA of current to all devices on that line. That usually means a max of 2 amps and perhaps 1 processor.
If we go over that limit, the HU remote will often act up or fail altogether. The best option is to employ a common Bosch relay that the solinoid is activated by the Rem signal, and other termination devices are powered by a constant 12 volt supply. This allows for 10-40A of power, off the relay output leads and plenty to power many devices. (depends on the relay used)
Swez
cleanup on 02/8/2006 15:36:02
thanks alot i will try that in a week or two, so "hard asses " are stealing sterios around campus, (happened to 3 cars last night) so i am gonna take my stuff out. it isnt like i am too descrete with my system either. but that sounds like what the problem would be. thanks alot guys
swez on 02/8/2006 18:13:48
Sounds like some "hard arsez" need a good lesson about "Eminenent Domain". Well, a slight deviiation of that anyway...
" Yo! Touch my stuff and you will meet my friend Mr. Shotgun. He is full of rock salt and if you get a butt full of him, you can't even sit in a snow bank for relieve of the itching and burning of these little roids."
Two things I hate:
1. Liars and manipulators
2. Thieves
Swez
cleanup on 03/22/2006 16:58:01
ok so the system is back in, new alarm (prestiege aps997) and the relay was installed......still no go... i connected a hot wire to the batt to a switch and then to the amps and still shuts off after a while. there is no remote from the deck to any amps or eq. basically i have given up.....i am gonna just drive this hoe off a cliff
swez on 03/22/2006 17:33:39
Hummm, this is a very unusual set of issues. Since you have some very strong amps here, the stock electrical system is going to be very stressed on long, loud bass notes. Large current spikes are likely and could be the root cause. The PA 1800dB alone, would be enough to run a stock electrical system into mayhem.
Also, If both amps are pulling more than 80A's of current per each, #4 gage wire may not handle this much current well either.
A 3rd option to consider, is the Audio Control EQ crapping out for a time and this shuts the amps off? This is the device I would probably probe 1st. If this EQ shuts off, (for some unforeseen reason) everthing connected to it will go out as well.
Do you have a multimeter to test DC/AC voltages and ohmic loads? This would be a very helpful diagnostic tool. For $20.00, Radio Shack has a nice handheld, digital meter that will help you diagnose many circuits.
If you are willing to take on the task, we can walk you through some basic electrical tests that may help eliminate the problem. The challenge is to take AC & DV voltage readings while the system is working properly. Then, when the system goes out, run the tests again ASAP and see what readings have changed. That should give more clues.
Don't give up now. This is what separates the "determined" man, from the "I'm a quitter" mentality. Hang tough and get out the test meter and a scratch pad.
Gung-Ho bud,
Swez USFLAG
cleanup on 03/22/2006 21:47:00
yeah i was thinking the bass was just sucking too much outta it, but i turned the amp off and had the mids and tweeters alone going and that botch still shut off, but it turns back on fairly quickly....i am tinking i have a loose wire somewhere so this weekend it is gonna tear down and rebuild....and probally gonna get a new breaker, that one might just me too rattled out
swez on 03/22/2006 23:27:40
Yes, this may indeed be a possible problem. When a breaker trips, all power to amps will stop and it takes a while for the bi-metal strips to cool and return to closed circuit position. They can go bad too. Under the hood, is a very extreme environment. Fuses tend to be more reliable. Either they work or they blow.
What size is that breaker anyway? A Maxi or ANL type fuse would solve this issue, if that is the origin or your situation.
Swez
cleanup on 03/23/2006 12:05:49
i have a 200amp, but it is kinda old, i am gonna pick up a waffer fuse today and install it
swez on 03/23/2006 12:19:34
Good plan Stan. If it blows when you really push the system, we know you need to go higher in amoerage ratings.
BTW, what gage power wire is now in use from the fuse/breaker, back to your amps? For a 200A fuse, the wire gage should be #2 minimum or a pair of #4's in parallel, at the outputside of the fuse holder.
Swez
cleanup on 03/26/2006 03:08:46
so i messed w/ the position of the breaker, and checked all ther wires, and so far so good....gonna see what happens next
swez on 03/26/2006 09:20:59
If you can remove the breaker, pull off the cap and then inspect the bi-metal strips for burn marks or rust. If you can clean off the oxides with fine steel wool pad or a very fine grit emery paper, it may work just fine again.
If that fails to produce the desired results, scrap the breaker and install a wafer fuse.
Good luck,
Swez
PS Breakers are fine for controlled temperature, humidity and indoor conditions. However, I have had problems with home circuit breakers that were installed in the garage. Especially the high current one that fused the external AC condenser unit.
cleanup on 03/27/2006 22:42:42
thanks, i think i am gonna change it, if i dont sell the car first that is. i let the car sit for a while, got out, and let the system play for a while, and it shut off still so i dont think it is a wire, so wafer it is. . . .keep yall updated, thanks for all the help and ideas
Clean UP
swez on 03/27/2006 22:50:19
Everything noted so far, points to your breaker. It's tripping prematurely, stays off til cool, then re-connects later and it back through the cycle again.
One good thing about a fuse... it's good or it ain't. No guess work involved. Get a spare too.
Swez
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