Hello gang!
So I finally got all my components. Phoenix Gold Octane 800 x4ch amp.
PG Xenon component speakers.
and of course the old polks and sony HU.
so here is my question:
when i test for voltage at the amp im only getting 8 volts.
when i pull out the amp fuses i get 12.8 volts at the amp.
im putting my test leads on both power and ground and also remote turn-on power and ground.
I have 4g streetwires for power and ground. ground is connected to the seat bolt which is attached to the chassis. everthing was sanded and cleaned.
all connections are soldered.
RCA jacks are set up correctly.
dont know if this makes a difference but i have not hooked up my sub to the amp, just the components...thats all for now.
HELP , the only thing i can think of thats causing the problem is a bad power supply in the amp.
argh
thanks in advance for any input.
Replies (19)
UKinstaller on 11/4/2005 12:42:43
have you tried swapping your fuses?? just because they don't look blown doesn't necessarily mean they aren't. swap em!! if you still have the same problem, could be a bad amp. does it turn on??
-UK
ttocs on 11/4/2005 13:04:45
did this ever work and just started doing this? or did you just install it?
where is it gounded, where did you get pwr, how it is ran? The more you give us the better we can help?
Spaz89 on 11/4/2005 14:44:05
nope havent tried swapping fuses..they ohm'd out ok...but its worth a shot.
it turns on for a few seconds here and there.
fresh install and also my first ever install.
the streetwires kit starts at the pos terminal on the cars battery...then it hits an 80 amp fuse about 6 to 8 inches away then its run through my firewall, beside the door panels to the back fold down seat, where its hooked to the pos terminal of the amp. the ground is a 4 gauge wire thats about 18 inches long thats bolted to the chassis.
i hope that what you mean by how its ran.
swez on 11/4/2005 15:24:13
Before moving your ground wire to a new location, do a voltage check between + power lug on amp to a new ground site. If you get proper voltage that way, I suspect your present ground is not adequate.
Way too much voltage drop going on here. I can see maybe 1/4 - 1/2 volt drop at the power lug/ground, but 4.5 volts suggests problems with your amp ground or BAT/GND connections.
Swez
Spaz89 on 11/4/2005 15:59:35
oh man i hope you are correct. i will check it out as soon as i get home tonight!
thanks guys!
ttocs on 11/5/2005 12:36:56
did you scrape the paint to get a clean ground?
"when i pull out the amp fuses i get 12.8 volts at the amp."
that part still confuses me. Your pulling the fuse by the battery, or the fuse in the amp? When you pull the fuse out, does it turn on with 12v on it?
The only think I can think of, is are you SURE you hooked up to the posative side of the battery? It don't make sense........
Spaz89 on 11/5/2005 14:18:40
sorry for being such a noob at this.
i go out to the car just now to go through a few troubleshooting steps just to make sure all my info is right.
with the car off i have 12v all across the board, at the battery, at the pos and grnd on the amp and also pos and the spot where its grounded. that is with the amp fuses in. also double checked and i am connected to the pos terminal on the battery.
so i then turn the car on. this is where i usually see the voltage drop (when the fuses are in the amp) at the amp.
this time though the amp doesnt even turn on for a split second like normal. it does nothing. so i check voltages at the same spots as listed above. amp fuses are still in. everything is fine EXCEPT now im not getting any voltage from my remote turn on. i just dont get it...the remote turn was always 12v when the radio was on.
so this is what im gonna do.
pull all the wires off their connections. make sure i have no polarity or short issues. double check the ground. and im thinking about doing a T splice off ignition behind the HU...just to rule out any remote turn on issues.
since im at work today it will have to wait till tomorrow, i will keep ya posted.
thanks again for all your help guys!
Spaz89 on 11/5/2005 14:53:28
trust me im not blonde.
i got to thinking...i was listening to a cd before i tested the amp a few min ago...and i remembered some cars the power antenna only worked when the radio turned on. so i went back out put the HU on the radio and did the same steps as listed in the previous post.
with the car running and the fuses in the amp and none of the speaker wire or rca cables hooked up. ( just the power antenna, power from the battery, and ground) voltage was around 6v between pos and grnd at the amp, at the ground, and at remote turn on.
with the car off 12+ all around.
ill re-grind my ground to double check that tonight other than that....i guess it will have to be returned.
swez on 11/5/2005 18:22:01
Hummm, this is a very strange set of results. Don't think I have seen anything like this in the 6 years I have been at CK either.
You mentioned all connections were soldered? Which connections are we talking about and what type of solder was used? A cold solder joint on the main power lead wire to a connector "might" cause this. When soldering a #4 gage wire to a connector, you need lots of heat to per-tin the power wire.
Also, you said a Sony HU here right. They usually have 2 blue wires. One is for power antenna (solid blue) and the other for REM lead on amps. I believe the blue & white stripe are for the REM.
Also, the HU ground is best connected to the fire wall or floor pan. (not the harness ground) Is that how you did the HU ground? If not, get back in there and fix that. This "could" be part of the problem as well.
Finally, as a test, remove the REM power lead from the amp. Run a small jumper wire from the B+ lug on the amp, to the REM lug. (This is best done with the main fuse at BAT removed.) Now, reinstall the fuse and see if the amp turn on. Measure voltage between B+ lug and bare metal ground. You should get the same voltage values here as you get at the BAT + & - terminals. If not within 0.5 volts, something is wrong.
Swez
PS Is this a new amp? If not, did it work before you installed it?
trunkisloud on 11/5/2005 18:32:07
with the car off i have 12v all across the board, at the battery, at the pos and grnd on the amp and also pos and the spot where its grounded. that is with the amp fuses in. also double checked and i am connected to the pos terminal on the battery.
so i then turn the car on. this is where i usually see the voltage drop (when the fuses are in the amp) at the amp.
notice he stated that with the car off...he gets 12 volts to everything...but when he turns on the car....he loses voltage...could some accessory be draining the voltage or maybe a charging issue....alternator problems??...is the hu wired to the factory harness or is it tied into something else?...
swez on 11/6/2005 05:54:36
Thought about that too... there are few things in a vehicle that could cause this level of voltage drop. One would almost have to turn on most accessories, (blower motor, lights, rear window defogger) to get this kind of voltage drop.
The other possible cause, is a dying battery. But that would lead to the car not starting without a jump. To test that theory, a trip to the local auto parts store is in order. Testing the battery and charging system would be advised to confirm this. (these tests are usually free)
Since this is a 2000 Jeep, it's possible that this is the original BAT. If yes, it's probably on its last leg. Most OEM batteries will last 4-5 years, depending on driving habits and severity of your winters.
Try testing the voltage at the battery with key off and then on. If you see a drop of more then 1.5 volts, take the main fuse out of the power line to amp and test again. Does it change readings with the main fuse out of the line?
After the vehicle is started and running, the voltage output from ALT to BAT should be close to 14.2 volts for a few minutes. Then, the voltage will gradually slip back to a steady 13.? output. If not, "Houston, we havve a problem here".
Swez
Spaz89 on 11/9/2005 09:06:26
So you guys are not gonna believe this. The voltage drop was cause by a 'candy caned' fuse. The main fuse just off the battery in the street wires kit was bad. I swapped it out that night and everthing runs fine.
I dont know if it sounds weird to you guys but I have never seen a fuse pass voltage just fine until a load is added. Definatly a new one on me.
Thanks Swez for finding the info on the HU...thats been driving me crazy...my universal wiring kit does not have a wire for the amp, and the Sony manual does not give you a wiring diagram.
Thanks once again for all the help...I was so close to sending the amp back...I was a big help just to be able to talk to different people and troubleshoot different parts of the system instead of giving up and going to a local shop to have them fix a simple issue.
Finally the fun part....making it look nice and tuning!
I'm sure I will be back for more advise in the near future
swez on 11/9/2005 09:23:08
Fuse failures are not alway obvious. UK & ttocs mentioned them before as potential faults. They should know... they have been installing gear for a good while.
Am very glad you have cracked the case and are now getting the desired results. Imagine that... a $2.00 part was the culprit all along.
Swez
PS Feel free to drop some change into the donation kitty. Every little bit helps, to keep this site going. Where would other folks go to get free advice, if this site folded?
Spaz89 on 11/9/2005 17:03:13
Not a problem.
no excuse not to have a pay pal account now i suppose.
;)
swez on 11/9/2005 17:08:55
You can contact Walter via Club mail and forward a simple check if you wish. I have done that in lieu of paypal.
Swez
Spaz89 on 11/9/2005 17:16:18
sweet that's exactly what i will do!
swez on 11/9/2005 17:19:14
;-)
Spaz89 on 11/9/2005 17:21:53
umm ok where is this email im looking for lol
swez on 11/9/2005 17:52:02
You would have to ask that would'nt you... LOL
Search Club Mail for: "Find People" tab
1. admin
2. Walter (WallyGator)
That'll get you to him,
Swez
So I finally got all my components. Phoenix Gold Octane 800 x4ch amp.
PG Xenon component speakers.
and of course the old polks and sony HU.
so here is my question:
when i test for voltage at the amp im only getting 8 volts.
when i pull out the amp fuses i get 12.8 volts at the amp.
im putting my test leads on both power and ground and also remote turn-on power and ground.
I have 4g streetwires for power and ground. ground is connected to the seat bolt which is attached to the chassis. everthing was sanded and cleaned.
all connections are soldered.
RCA jacks are set up correctly.
dont know if this makes a difference but i have not hooked up my sub to the amp, just the components...thats all for now.
HELP , the only thing i can think of thats causing the problem is a bad power supply in the amp.
argh
thanks in advance for any input.
Replies (19)
UKinstaller on 11/4/2005 12:42:43
have you tried swapping your fuses?? just because they don't look blown doesn't necessarily mean they aren't. swap em!! if you still have the same problem, could be a bad amp. does it turn on??
-UK
ttocs on 11/4/2005 13:04:45
did this ever work and just started doing this? or did you just install it?
where is it gounded, where did you get pwr, how it is ran? The more you give us the better we can help?
Spaz89 on 11/4/2005 14:44:05
nope havent tried swapping fuses..they ohm'd out ok...but its worth a shot.
it turns on for a few seconds here and there.
fresh install and also my first ever install.
the streetwires kit starts at the pos terminal on the cars battery...then it hits an 80 amp fuse about 6 to 8 inches away then its run through my firewall, beside the door panels to the back fold down seat, where its hooked to the pos terminal of the amp. the ground is a 4 gauge wire thats about 18 inches long thats bolted to the chassis.
i hope that what you mean by how its ran.
swez on 11/4/2005 15:24:13
Before moving your ground wire to a new location, do a voltage check between + power lug on amp to a new ground site. If you get proper voltage that way, I suspect your present ground is not adequate.
Way too much voltage drop going on here. I can see maybe 1/4 - 1/2 volt drop at the power lug/ground, but 4.5 volts suggests problems with your amp ground or BAT/GND connections.
Swez
Spaz89 on 11/4/2005 15:59:35
oh man i hope you are correct. i will check it out as soon as i get home tonight!
thanks guys!
ttocs on 11/5/2005 12:36:56
did you scrape the paint to get a clean ground?
"when i pull out the amp fuses i get 12.8 volts at the amp."
that part still confuses me. Your pulling the fuse by the battery, or the fuse in the amp? When you pull the fuse out, does it turn on with 12v on it?
The only think I can think of, is are you SURE you hooked up to the posative side of the battery? It don't make sense........
Spaz89 on 11/5/2005 14:18:40
sorry for being such a noob at this.
i go out to the car just now to go through a few troubleshooting steps just to make sure all my info is right.
with the car off i have 12v all across the board, at the battery, at the pos and grnd on the amp and also pos and the spot where its grounded. that is with the amp fuses in. also double checked and i am connected to the pos terminal on the battery.
so i then turn the car on. this is where i usually see the voltage drop (when the fuses are in the amp) at the amp.
this time though the amp doesnt even turn on for a split second like normal. it does nothing. so i check voltages at the same spots as listed above. amp fuses are still in. everything is fine EXCEPT now im not getting any voltage from my remote turn on. i just dont get it...the remote turn was always 12v when the radio was on.
so this is what im gonna do.
pull all the wires off their connections. make sure i have no polarity or short issues. double check the ground. and im thinking about doing a T splice off ignition behind the HU...just to rule out any remote turn on issues.
since im at work today it will have to wait till tomorrow, i will keep ya posted.
thanks again for all your help guys!
Spaz89 on 11/5/2005 14:53:28
trust me im not blonde.
i got to thinking...i was listening to a cd before i tested the amp a few min ago...and i remembered some cars the power antenna only worked when the radio turned on. so i went back out put the HU on the radio and did the same steps as listed in the previous post.
with the car running and the fuses in the amp and none of the speaker wire or rca cables hooked up. ( just the power antenna, power from the battery, and ground) voltage was around 6v between pos and grnd at the amp, at the ground, and at remote turn on.
with the car off 12+ all around.
ill re-grind my ground to double check that tonight other than that....i guess it will have to be returned.
swez on 11/5/2005 18:22:01
Hummm, this is a very strange set of results. Don't think I have seen anything like this in the 6 years I have been at CK either.
You mentioned all connections were soldered? Which connections are we talking about and what type of solder was used? A cold solder joint on the main power lead wire to a connector "might" cause this. When soldering a #4 gage wire to a connector, you need lots of heat to per-tin the power wire.
Also, you said a Sony HU here right. They usually have 2 blue wires. One is for power antenna (solid blue) and the other for REM lead on amps. I believe the blue & white stripe are for the REM.
Also, the HU ground is best connected to the fire wall or floor pan. (not the harness ground) Is that how you did the HU ground? If not, get back in there and fix that. This "could" be part of the problem as well.
Finally, as a test, remove the REM power lead from the amp. Run a small jumper wire from the B+ lug on the amp, to the REM lug. (This is best done with the main fuse at BAT removed.) Now, reinstall the fuse and see if the amp turn on. Measure voltage between B+ lug and bare metal ground. You should get the same voltage values here as you get at the BAT + & - terminals. If not within 0.5 volts, something is wrong.
Swez
PS Is this a new amp? If not, did it work before you installed it?
trunkisloud on 11/5/2005 18:32:07
with the car off i have 12v all across the board, at the battery, at the pos and grnd on the amp and also pos and the spot where its grounded. that is with the amp fuses in. also double checked and i am connected to the pos terminal on the battery.
so i then turn the car on. this is where i usually see the voltage drop (when the fuses are in the amp) at the amp.
notice he stated that with the car off...he gets 12 volts to everything...but when he turns on the car....he loses voltage...could some accessory be draining the voltage or maybe a charging issue....alternator problems??...is the hu wired to the factory harness or is it tied into something else?...
swez on 11/6/2005 05:54:36
Thought about that too... there are few things in a vehicle that could cause this level of voltage drop. One would almost have to turn on most accessories, (blower motor, lights, rear window defogger) to get this kind of voltage drop.
The other possible cause, is a dying battery. But that would lead to the car not starting without a jump. To test that theory, a trip to the local auto parts store is in order. Testing the battery and charging system would be advised to confirm this. (these tests are usually free)
Since this is a 2000 Jeep, it's possible that this is the original BAT. If yes, it's probably on its last leg. Most OEM batteries will last 4-5 years, depending on driving habits and severity of your winters.
Try testing the voltage at the battery with key off and then on. If you see a drop of more then 1.5 volts, take the main fuse out of the power line to amp and test again. Does it change readings with the main fuse out of the line?
After the vehicle is started and running, the voltage output from ALT to BAT should be close to 14.2 volts for a few minutes. Then, the voltage will gradually slip back to a steady 13.? output. If not, "Houston, we havve a problem here".
Swez
Spaz89 on 11/9/2005 09:06:26
So you guys are not gonna believe this. The voltage drop was cause by a 'candy caned' fuse. The main fuse just off the battery in the street wires kit was bad. I swapped it out that night and everthing runs fine.
I dont know if it sounds weird to you guys but I have never seen a fuse pass voltage just fine until a load is added. Definatly a new one on me.
Thanks Swez for finding the info on the HU...thats been driving me crazy...my universal wiring kit does not have a wire for the amp, and the Sony manual does not give you a wiring diagram.
Thanks once again for all the help...I was so close to sending the amp back...I was a big help just to be able to talk to different people and troubleshoot different parts of the system instead of giving up and going to a local shop to have them fix a simple issue.
Finally the fun part....making it look nice and tuning!
I'm sure I will be back for more advise in the near future
swez on 11/9/2005 09:23:08
Fuse failures are not alway obvious. UK & ttocs mentioned them before as potential faults. They should know... they have been installing gear for a good while.
Am very glad you have cracked the case and are now getting the desired results. Imagine that... a $2.00 part was the culprit all along.
Swez
PS Feel free to drop some change into the donation kitty. Every little bit helps, to keep this site going. Where would other folks go to get free advice, if this site folded?
Spaz89 on 11/9/2005 17:03:13
Not a problem.
no excuse not to have a pay pal account now i suppose.
;)
swez on 11/9/2005 17:08:55
You can contact Walter via Club mail and forward a simple check if you wish. I have done that in lieu of paypal.
Swez
Spaz89 on 11/9/2005 17:16:18
sweet that's exactly what i will do!
swez on 11/9/2005 17:19:14
;-)
Spaz89 on 11/9/2005 17:21:53
umm ok where is this email im looking for lol
swez on 11/9/2005 17:52:02
You would have to ask that would'nt you... LOL
Search Club Mail for: "Find People" tab
1. admin
2. Walter (WallyGator)
That'll get you to him,
Swez
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