I need help on buying an amp.I have in mind mtx 801d, orion 600d, and phoenix gold 8.0.1 For the subs I'm thinking about orion, mtx or basically anything that would withstand the power from any one of these amps without blowing the sub. Please give me opinions about these amps and what one you think would be most powerful of the three. Any suggestions on subs to go with any one of the 3 amps would be greatly appreciated.
Replies (16)
anonymous_a on 04/27/2005 21:28:36
2001 Chevy Malibu
swez on 04/28/2005 08:41:31
Each amp noted are great brand choices. You'll need a sub package that can net 2 ohms and handle the power noted. It may be cheaper in the long run, to use a pair of subs for this power rating than buying one potent sub. (if you have the space) What kind of price range are you looking at here for the kit?
Also, check out what your stock ALT/BAT packae is in this car. You may need to either limit the ampere draw or beef up the electricals when moving into 60A + current drawing amps.
Comments,
Swez
anonymous_a on 04/28/2005 16:11:20
I'm pretty much leaning towards 2 orion c12d2 (200 wrms, 400 wmax dual 2 ohm voice coil) I was thinking what would be better running the orion 600d at 1 ohm for the 600 wrms or running the mtx 801d at 800 wrms at 2 ohms. What amp offers more "true power"? And will these orion subs be able to handle the mtx 801d at 2 ohms without blowing even if I decided to run the gains close to high? Also the HU Alpine 9843 2005 model is what I currently have. Do you think with the mtx 801d, Alpine HU, and these Orion subs would all be able to go together without problems? Or if you know of some other subs that will work in conjunction with any of these amps that would be great. My subwoofer buget is around 160.00 for a pair shipped. Oh, the electrical system I'm not worried about upgrading but these are the only 3choice amps I would want to run.
swez on 04/28/2005 16:34:19
The MTX 801D is too strong for the Orion subs noted. Think you would wind up blowing them out with that much power.
If you really want those subs, stay with the Orion 600D and use a pair of 4+4 DVC subs here. That will get you 1 ohm and 600 Wrms form the kit. Plenty of power for these subs. Stick with a sealed enclosure here so you don't over drive the cones.
That HU will do the basics for a sub kit add on. If you elected to add a full range amp later, (most likely) can do but will need a line driver with multiple outs and preamp voltage booster. This HU only has 1 pair of RCA's and is rated at 2 volts. It puts out 16 Wrms x 4 channels.
Kinda weak there and you will be very bass heavy. Plan ahead when you buy your wiring kit (#4 gage kit) so you can easily add a 2-4 channel amp later.
Swez
anonymous_a on 04/28/2005 16:44:50
What subs do you recommend for the mtx amp? for about 150.00 to 160.00 shipped or even what brands and wattage handling sub should I look for? Yeah Iguess the hu kinda sucks but Ithought hey it's atleast alpine. What Iplan on doing is just using the rca outputs on the sub amp and connect it to the rca inputs on a 4 channel amp to power the full range speakers.
swez on 04/28/2005 18:04:16
The MTX 801 D is rated at 800 Wrms @ 2 ohms, 14.4 volts. Best guess, you'll get a consistant 700 Wrms @ 2 ohms here. Many of us like the Alpine Type R series subs.
These: Alpine SWR-1221D are rated at 500Wrms/sub, very solid bass engine subs too. This is a 2+2 DVC sub, so you can use 2 and get a 2 ohm load. Shop em hard off e-bay and you will probably be able to get them for under $175.00/pr. Great subs!
That Alpine HU maay give you fits with too little RCA power to feed a 4 channel + sub amp. Only 2 volts per channel here. That's why I suggest thinking about a line driver or LD/EQ here. This can give you many options and more voltage to all amp inputs.
Swez
anonymous_a on 04/28/2005 20:53:53
I don't understand what a line driver is? Is this the same thing as a equalizer?
anonymous_a on 04/28/2005 21:33:48
Now I'm thinking about 2 hifonics 12's (350 wrms, 700 wmax dual 2 ohm vc )which one of the 3 amps mentioned would you recommend to pound these without blowing them?
swez on 04/29/2005 08:15:42
All the amps noted can handle a pair of those subs. The Orion is the weak link as it can only deleiver 600 Wrms @ 1 ohm. To get a 1 ohm load, need a pair of 4+4 DVC's. The other 2 amps are 2 ohm stable and need a pair of 2+2 DVC's.
Line drivers are a preamp that allows one to split 1 set of RCA's into several pairs and amplify low HU signals as well. Adding an EQ to the package gives a notable improvement in tone control and allows one to cut/boost specific frequency bands to enhance bass and full range intelligability. Here's a low cost unit that gives a nice blend of EQ performance, extra RCA outputs (3 pairs) and only needs 1 pair of RCA inputs.
http://www.thezeb.com/p-Audiobahn-AEQ6Q-Equalizer-100317.htm
I have seen them off e-bay for ~$60.00 + S/H. A nice, compact package, full of useable features and an 8 volt max output. That's ~2.5 volts per RCA pair. You have a Master volume for full range and a sub control at your finger tips as well as 5 bands of EQ. It even has an AUX input so you can use a DVD player, I-Pod or other audio input devices.
Swez
anonymous_a on 04/29/2005 12:07:18
Thanks for all your help Swez you helped me come up with more possibilities for a nice setup but I just have 1 more question.Can a crossover with ! rca input and 1 rca outputfor subs and 1 for full range do the same thing?
swez on 04/29/2005 12:47:23
Depends on the crossover. If it's a passive crossover and has no preamp... you will not get the voltage needed to run a pair of amps well at 2 volts from the HU. Passive crossovers actually consume power in their task, so the RCA voltage going to the amps will be less than 2 volts. (not good)
If you use an active crossover that has a built in line driver, it may work to your favor. Most amps usually have adequate crossovers built in to them. A line driver is what you need to boost RCA voltage from the HU and give multiple outputs to power your amp channels. Do you have one (crossover) in mind? Link? I'll have a look and advise.
Swez
PS I really like the Bahn unit mentioned earlier as it has plenty of nice features, is active and controls both full range and Sub volumes, right at the control panel. Plus, you get a 5 band EQ as well.
anonymous_a on 04/29/2005 16:53:35
I really haven't looked at any specific one yet but someone was telling me about the soundstorm ssl-150xc or ssl-250xc. They said that they are both great for the price. All I know though is the 150xc has 1 input and 1output for the sub and 1 output for the full range. I also liked the one you described but they seem kinda pricey. Do you know where I can get a line driver for around 50.00?
anonymous_a on 04/29/2005 16:56:19
How do you know if an active crossover has a line driver?
swez on 04/29/2005 21:01:12
Active crossovers have a power line feed for preamp circuits and can cut/boost frequencies.
Passive units are only caps, coils and resistors that require no outside power sources. They only cut frequencies and tend to reduce HU RCA voltage to amp inputs or amp outs to speakers.
I did see a Bahn LD/EQ on e-bay for $25.00. Has 2 days left on the auction, but there was only one listed. The rest were AudioControl products and much higher prices... ($150 & up)
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=14931&item=5770468341&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW
Swez
anonymous_a on 04/29/2005 22:08:53
Now on an equalizer how do you tell if it has a line driver? Or does it mean it has one if there is 1 rca input and like 3 different rca outputs for subs, full,etc....? I seen an equalizer on ebay I think it was Boss that was set up like this but it didn't say if it had a LD built in. So I was just wonderin how you can tell.
swez on 04/30/2005 02:51:13
If there is a line driver in the unit, it would say so. A line driver takes a small RCA input signal from the HU and amplifies it to a higher voltage for more power to Aux amplifiers.
Which Boss x-over are you looking at?
The option I have given you is a very nice product... if you can buy it at the right price.
Boss Audio.... less that wonderful in almost every case I have see to date.
Swez
Replies (16)
anonymous_a on 04/27/2005 21:28:36
2001 Chevy Malibu
swez on 04/28/2005 08:41:31
Each amp noted are great brand choices. You'll need a sub package that can net 2 ohms and handle the power noted. It may be cheaper in the long run, to use a pair of subs for this power rating than buying one potent sub. (if you have the space) What kind of price range are you looking at here for the kit?
Also, check out what your stock ALT/BAT packae is in this car. You may need to either limit the ampere draw or beef up the electricals when moving into 60A + current drawing amps.
Comments,
Swez
anonymous_a on 04/28/2005 16:11:20
I'm pretty much leaning towards 2 orion c12d2 (200 wrms, 400 wmax dual 2 ohm voice coil) I was thinking what would be better running the orion 600d at 1 ohm for the 600 wrms or running the mtx 801d at 800 wrms at 2 ohms. What amp offers more "true power"? And will these orion subs be able to handle the mtx 801d at 2 ohms without blowing even if I decided to run the gains close to high? Also the HU Alpine 9843 2005 model is what I currently have. Do you think with the mtx 801d, Alpine HU, and these Orion subs would all be able to go together without problems? Or if you know of some other subs that will work in conjunction with any of these amps that would be great. My subwoofer buget is around 160.00 for a pair shipped. Oh, the electrical system I'm not worried about upgrading but these are the only 3choice amps I would want to run.
swez on 04/28/2005 16:34:19
The MTX 801D is too strong for the Orion subs noted. Think you would wind up blowing them out with that much power.
If you really want those subs, stay with the Orion 600D and use a pair of 4+4 DVC subs here. That will get you 1 ohm and 600 Wrms form the kit. Plenty of power for these subs. Stick with a sealed enclosure here so you don't over drive the cones.
That HU will do the basics for a sub kit add on. If you elected to add a full range amp later, (most likely) can do but will need a line driver with multiple outs and preamp voltage booster. This HU only has 1 pair of RCA's and is rated at 2 volts. It puts out 16 Wrms x 4 channels.
Kinda weak there and you will be very bass heavy. Plan ahead when you buy your wiring kit (#4 gage kit) so you can easily add a 2-4 channel amp later.
Swez
anonymous_a on 04/28/2005 16:44:50
What subs do you recommend for the mtx amp? for about 150.00 to 160.00 shipped or even what brands and wattage handling sub should I look for? Yeah Iguess the hu kinda sucks but Ithought hey it's atleast alpine. What Iplan on doing is just using the rca outputs on the sub amp and connect it to the rca inputs on a 4 channel amp to power the full range speakers.
swez on 04/28/2005 18:04:16
The MTX 801 D is rated at 800 Wrms @ 2 ohms, 14.4 volts. Best guess, you'll get a consistant 700 Wrms @ 2 ohms here. Many of us like the Alpine Type R series subs.
These: Alpine SWR-1221D are rated at 500Wrms/sub, very solid bass engine subs too. This is a 2+2 DVC sub, so you can use 2 and get a 2 ohm load. Shop em hard off e-bay and you will probably be able to get them for under $175.00/pr. Great subs!
That Alpine HU maay give you fits with too little RCA power to feed a 4 channel + sub amp. Only 2 volts per channel here. That's why I suggest thinking about a line driver or LD/EQ here. This can give you many options and more voltage to all amp inputs.
Swez
anonymous_a on 04/28/2005 20:53:53
I don't understand what a line driver is? Is this the same thing as a equalizer?
anonymous_a on 04/28/2005 21:33:48
Now I'm thinking about 2 hifonics 12's (350 wrms, 700 wmax dual 2 ohm vc )which one of the 3 amps mentioned would you recommend to pound these without blowing them?
swez on 04/29/2005 08:15:42
All the amps noted can handle a pair of those subs. The Orion is the weak link as it can only deleiver 600 Wrms @ 1 ohm. To get a 1 ohm load, need a pair of 4+4 DVC's. The other 2 amps are 2 ohm stable and need a pair of 2+2 DVC's.
Line drivers are a preamp that allows one to split 1 set of RCA's into several pairs and amplify low HU signals as well. Adding an EQ to the package gives a notable improvement in tone control and allows one to cut/boost specific frequency bands to enhance bass and full range intelligability. Here's a low cost unit that gives a nice blend of EQ performance, extra RCA outputs (3 pairs) and only needs 1 pair of RCA inputs.
http://www.thezeb.com/p-Audiobahn-AEQ6Q-Equalizer-100317.htm
I have seen them off e-bay for ~$60.00 + S/H. A nice, compact package, full of useable features and an 8 volt max output. That's ~2.5 volts per RCA pair. You have a Master volume for full range and a sub control at your finger tips as well as 5 bands of EQ. It even has an AUX input so you can use a DVD player, I-Pod or other audio input devices.
Swez
anonymous_a on 04/29/2005 12:07:18
Thanks for all your help Swez you helped me come up with more possibilities for a nice setup but I just have 1 more question.Can a crossover with ! rca input and 1 rca outputfor subs and 1 for full range do the same thing?
swez on 04/29/2005 12:47:23
Depends on the crossover. If it's a passive crossover and has no preamp... you will not get the voltage needed to run a pair of amps well at 2 volts from the HU. Passive crossovers actually consume power in their task, so the RCA voltage going to the amps will be less than 2 volts. (not good)
If you use an active crossover that has a built in line driver, it may work to your favor. Most amps usually have adequate crossovers built in to them. A line driver is what you need to boost RCA voltage from the HU and give multiple outputs to power your amp channels. Do you have one (crossover) in mind? Link? I'll have a look and advise.
Swez
PS I really like the Bahn unit mentioned earlier as it has plenty of nice features, is active and controls both full range and Sub volumes, right at the control panel. Plus, you get a 5 band EQ as well.
anonymous_a on 04/29/2005 16:53:35
I really haven't looked at any specific one yet but someone was telling me about the soundstorm ssl-150xc or ssl-250xc. They said that they are both great for the price. All I know though is the 150xc has 1 input and 1output for the sub and 1 output for the full range. I also liked the one you described but they seem kinda pricey. Do you know where I can get a line driver for around 50.00?
anonymous_a on 04/29/2005 16:56:19
How do you know if an active crossover has a line driver?
swez on 04/29/2005 21:01:12
Active crossovers have a power line feed for preamp circuits and can cut/boost frequencies.
Passive units are only caps, coils and resistors that require no outside power sources. They only cut frequencies and tend to reduce HU RCA voltage to amp inputs or amp outs to speakers.
I did see a Bahn LD/EQ on e-bay for $25.00. Has 2 days left on the auction, but there was only one listed. The rest were AudioControl products and much higher prices... ($150 & up)
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=14931&item=5770468341&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW
Swez
anonymous_a on 04/29/2005 22:08:53
Now on an equalizer how do you tell if it has a line driver? Or does it mean it has one if there is 1 rca input and like 3 different rca outputs for subs, full,etc....? I seen an equalizer on ebay I think it was Boss that was set up like this but it didn't say if it had a LD built in. So I was just wonderin how you can tell.
swez on 04/30/2005 02:51:13
If there is a line driver in the unit, it would say so. A line driver takes a small RCA input signal from the HU and amplifies it to a higher voltage for more power to Aux amplifiers.
Which Boss x-over are you looking at?
The option I have given you is a very nice product... if you can buy it at the right price.
Boss Audio.... less that wonderful in almost every case I have see to date.
Swez
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