Hey guys, this is my first posting and I just wanted to say nice website. But this is my problem, I have a 12" Mmats Dreadnaut paired with a Mmats 1500.1, The sub is in a 2.5 cu ft @ 35 hz. I was at a local sound comp that the stereo shop was holding in my area. The gain was set only half way up yet when I was playing it, all of a sudden it stopped playing and when I opened up the trunk white smoke came out SAD . when I was playing the sub the voice coils unraveled and now it sounds like a messed up slinky inside. The sub still plays, it's just the voice coils I suppose. I bought the sub from a friend so I don't think it's under warranty and I wouldn't be able to recover it from him because he's stationed in Iraq right now. So my questions are: I'd be willing to pay, but would Mmats be able to repair this? If so, how much? If not, then what other subs would be able to handle the Mmats 1500.1 (1100 rms @ 1 ohm) without any problems? Any response would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.
Replies (6)
swez on 03/27/2005 17:16:08
Sad story... feel your pain. Ya have 2 options here:
1. Have the damaged sub repaired by a qualified speaker reconditioner
2. Opt for a new sub that can handle the amp power and space in your box design.
Sub recone services could run as high as $125.00 when S/H are considered. Not a bad option if your really love that sub. Figure 2-4 weeks turnaround time as well. What would a new one cost?
That's a pretty large enclosure for a 12" sub. Not sure what the specs range are for a D-naught, but my guess is you can easily move into a 15" sub and still use the same box with a few mods. A solid 15" can take that frequency and power as well. Resonance Engineering's XXX series might hang in there very well at that power.
Anyone got a link to them?
Swez
PS Do you have a sub sonic fillter on that amp? If using a ported enclosure, tuned to 35 Hz., gotta have an SSF to block freqs below Port Tuning Freq (PTF) to prevent damage to your sub. That may be the reason it failed or just too much power for that sub, in that size box.
P0werLifter on 03/27/2005 18:33:07
Ah yes, the sweet smell and smoke of frying a VC...Least you were at a competition GRIN .
Lets get some details here, How long had you been playing (burping) the woofer for? What Volume on the HU? What Hz (or was it a song), Does your amplifier have a sub sonic filter?
I'm assuming you were at an SPL competition but please correct me if im wrong.
You said you have your gain set up half way on the amplifier? If you had your Headunit (H.U.) turned up quite a bit its possible u were clipping the amplifier sending the woofer a distorted signal. A clipped (distorted) signal to a subwoofer will fry it faster than anything else, and at high volume it makes it even worse. Many times you can run a woofer past its RMS rating and even double or tripple the power for very short burps as long as its CLEAN power.
Also you say u purchased it off a friend? How did he handle his woofers? did he consistantly play them loud? did he compete? if yes to these questions the woofer already had some abuse on it coupled with the competition might have sent it over the edge.
Your options here would be as Swez has stated above, A recone or a new subwoofer.
My suggestion is to call MMAT's and see if they can recone it, or call Resonant Engineering (www.Reaudio.com) and see if they can recone it for you. (If i remember correctly many times they will recone different woofers)
Do you by chance have the MMAT's Specs? Ill look around and run some numbers in BB6P and see the maximum power rating for your current enclosure
BTW, what was your score =)
Focus on 03/27/2005 19:59:58
My friend had the sub for about 3 months, and he would play it loud but never competed, but he had a sony 1000 watt amp @ 1 ohm, he just put it in a sealed box, maybe it's possible that he would have sent the clipped signal, weakening the coils, and with my Mmats amp I just pushed it over the edge, I only had it for a month. I don't have a subsonic filter, but maybe thats what caused it to rupture. Do you recommend any SSF's?. Also, I was playing "Da Blow" by Lil Jon & The Eastside Boys.
These are the only specs for the 12" Dreadnaut:
Voice Coil (Ohms) 2 x 2
Fs (Hz.) 36
Vas (Liters) 23.8
Qts .40
SPL (1W/1M) 86db
Power (Wrms) 1000
Mounting Depth (inches) 7
Speaker Displacement (cuft.) .25
The Amp is rated at 1100 @ 1 ohm
As for the specs for the box, well, I had called up Mmats and had asked them how big the box should be for SQL, and they told me 2.5 cu ft net, tuned to 35 hz. Would reconing it weaken the sub? Or should I just buy a XXX. And oh yeah, my score was a 137.2
P0werLifter on 03/27/2005 20:47:29
I would really advise getting an SSF for your application. Anytime you use a Ported enclosure you should have an SSF present to filter out any hz below the Port Tuning Frequency (PTF). When the woofer does not have a filter present the cone can loose control causing the cone to go past its mechanical limits on excursion. This can rip the Voice Coils right off the cone or spider if their woven in. Not only that but it causes the VC's temperature to rise excessively due to the excess heat and lack of ventilation.
I suspect this lack of an SSF to be the contributing factor combined with others such as clipping.
If your looking for a Solid SQL driver then I highly reccomend the XXX or a Brahma. Personally I run a 15" XXX and i love it. It gets very loud and stays very clean either one would be a fine choice here.
Good score for a single 12 btw, currently with my 15" XXX im hitting 142db on the Mic. Going to do some more testing and designs i should be in the 145+dB range but we'll see. Ive got a comp comming up next weekend and am going to be talking to a SPL competition team about joining up so we'll see how that goes.
Oh and Reconing the sub will not weaken it, reconing brings the subwoofer back up to factory specs making it strong, like new
-PL
Focus on 03/27/2005 22:13:36
Thanks guys, tomorrow I'm going to first call RE and ask how much a 12" or 15" XXX costs, and also ask if they can recone this paperweight. Then I'll call up Mmats to see how much it will cost to recone it as well. How about the Subsonic filter though, do you recommend any at all?
swez on 03/28/2005 08:47:56
Check prices on RE XXX subs at link noted by PL above. As for the SSF, can buy a simple plugin module from Harrison Labs. The come in pairs and the one you will need is a HPF with a value near 30-35 Hz. They can be had at Crutchfield.com, The Zeb or Parts Express. Typically $26.00 a pair. (left and right amp inputs)
The 30 Hz version:
http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=266-248
Swez
Replies (6)
swez on 03/27/2005 17:16:08
Sad story... feel your pain. Ya have 2 options here:
1. Have the damaged sub repaired by a qualified speaker reconditioner
2. Opt for a new sub that can handle the amp power and space in your box design.
Sub recone services could run as high as $125.00 when S/H are considered. Not a bad option if your really love that sub. Figure 2-4 weeks turnaround time as well. What would a new one cost?
That's a pretty large enclosure for a 12" sub. Not sure what the specs range are for a D-naught, but my guess is you can easily move into a 15" sub and still use the same box with a few mods. A solid 15" can take that frequency and power as well. Resonance Engineering's XXX series might hang in there very well at that power.
Anyone got a link to them?
Swez
PS Do you have a sub sonic fillter on that amp? If using a ported enclosure, tuned to 35 Hz., gotta have an SSF to block freqs below Port Tuning Freq (PTF) to prevent damage to your sub. That may be the reason it failed or just too much power for that sub, in that size box.
P0werLifter on 03/27/2005 18:33:07
Ah yes, the sweet smell and smoke of frying a VC...Least you were at a competition GRIN .
Lets get some details here, How long had you been playing (burping) the woofer for? What Volume on the HU? What Hz (or was it a song), Does your amplifier have a sub sonic filter?
I'm assuming you were at an SPL competition but please correct me if im wrong.
You said you have your gain set up half way on the amplifier? If you had your Headunit (H.U.) turned up quite a bit its possible u were clipping the amplifier sending the woofer a distorted signal. A clipped (distorted) signal to a subwoofer will fry it faster than anything else, and at high volume it makes it even worse. Many times you can run a woofer past its RMS rating and even double or tripple the power for very short burps as long as its CLEAN power.
Also you say u purchased it off a friend? How did he handle his woofers? did he consistantly play them loud? did he compete? if yes to these questions the woofer already had some abuse on it coupled with the competition might have sent it over the edge.
Your options here would be as Swez has stated above, A recone or a new subwoofer.
My suggestion is to call MMAT's and see if they can recone it, or call Resonant Engineering (www.Reaudio.com) and see if they can recone it for you. (If i remember correctly many times they will recone different woofers)
Do you by chance have the MMAT's Specs? Ill look around and run some numbers in BB6P and see the maximum power rating for your current enclosure
BTW, what was your score =)
Focus on 03/27/2005 19:59:58
My friend had the sub for about 3 months, and he would play it loud but never competed, but he had a sony 1000 watt amp @ 1 ohm, he just put it in a sealed box, maybe it's possible that he would have sent the clipped signal, weakening the coils, and with my Mmats amp I just pushed it over the edge, I only had it for a month. I don't have a subsonic filter, but maybe thats what caused it to rupture. Do you recommend any SSF's?. Also, I was playing "Da Blow" by Lil Jon & The Eastside Boys.
These are the only specs for the 12" Dreadnaut:
Voice Coil (Ohms) 2 x 2
Fs (Hz.) 36
Vas (Liters) 23.8
Qts .40
SPL (1W/1M) 86db
Power (Wrms) 1000
Mounting Depth (inches) 7
Speaker Displacement (cuft.) .25
The Amp is rated at 1100 @ 1 ohm
As for the specs for the box, well, I had called up Mmats and had asked them how big the box should be for SQL, and they told me 2.5 cu ft net, tuned to 35 hz. Would reconing it weaken the sub? Or should I just buy a XXX. And oh yeah, my score was a 137.2
P0werLifter on 03/27/2005 20:47:29
I would really advise getting an SSF for your application. Anytime you use a Ported enclosure you should have an SSF present to filter out any hz below the Port Tuning Frequency (PTF). When the woofer does not have a filter present the cone can loose control causing the cone to go past its mechanical limits on excursion. This can rip the Voice Coils right off the cone or spider if their woven in. Not only that but it causes the VC's temperature to rise excessively due to the excess heat and lack of ventilation.
I suspect this lack of an SSF to be the contributing factor combined with others such as clipping.
If your looking for a Solid SQL driver then I highly reccomend the XXX or a Brahma. Personally I run a 15" XXX and i love it. It gets very loud and stays very clean either one would be a fine choice here.
Good score for a single 12 btw, currently with my 15" XXX im hitting 142db on the Mic. Going to do some more testing and designs i should be in the 145+dB range but we'll see. Ive got a comp comming up next weekend and am going to be talking to a SPL competition team about joining up so we'll see how that goes.
Oh and Reconing the sub will not weaken it, reconing brings the subwoofer back up to factory specs making it strong, like new
-PL
Focus on 03/27/2005 22:13:36
Thanks guys, tomorrow I'm going to first call RE and ask how much a 12" or 15" XXX costs, and also ask if they can recone this paperweight. Then I'll call up Mmats to see how much it will cost to recone it as well. How about the Subsonic filter though, do you recommend any at all?
swez on 03/28/2005 08:47:56
Check prices on RE XXX subs at link noted by PL above. As for the SSF, can buy a simple plugin module from Harrison Labs. The come in pairs and the one you will need is a HPF with a value near 30-35 Hz. They can be had at Crutchfield.com, The Zeb or Parts Express. Typically $26.00 a pair. (left and right amp inputs)
The 30 Hz version:
http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=266-248
Swez
Copyright ClubKnowledge 2009 * All Rights Reserved
