I am putting together an audio/video system for my car. I would like to use a JL Audio 10W3 subwoofer. These have dual voice coils. When they state that the subwoofer is a 2ohm, dual voice coil, does that mean 2 speakers at 2 ohms, or the combine unit at 2 ohms?
How do I size an amp to match up with the speaker so as it not to be under or over driven?
Thanks, John
Replies (12)
Victor on 10/27/2004 00:47:00
before commenting on the JL Audio 10W3 woofers... i would like to clear the concept of dual voice coil speakers( or woofers in this case )..
The whole idea behind makink dual voice coil woofers is better power handling.. it is somewhat like integrating the voice coils of 2 woofers but maintaining the single cone and frame structure.
now 1ohm , 2 ohm , 4ohms, 6ohms, 8 ohms are the impedence of the voice coils.
they notify the net load of a coil ..
when we talk about DVC(dual voice coil) woofers .. it means that the woofer has 2 voice coils.. when it says 2ohm DVC it means that the woofer has 2 voice coils each of 2ohms.. similarly when we say 4ohmDVC it means that the impedence of each voice coil in the woofer is 4ohms..
next step is understanding the series and parallel wiring to obtain a desired net load..
lets take and example of the product u stated..
the JL Audio 10W3 has 2 voice coils each of 2 ohms impedence..
hence if the voice coils are wired in series we can get a net load of 4 ohms for the woofer.. and if they are wired in paralle we can get a net load of 1ohm for the woofer...
now the basics are .. lower the impedence of the woofer the more power it extracts from the amplifier.. wait a sec.. that does not mean that you use a 1ohm load with a 2 ohm or 4 ohm stable amplifier..
the amplifier must be stable at the load u are going to use on it..
do u get my point??...
now regarding the amp.. are u planning to drive a single woofer or more.??
and how much would u like to spend are big factors.. along with the enclosure design and crossover network..
please give more info so that i can hlp u out..
comments..??
Victor
uochronos on 10/27/2004 02:49:16
basicaly DVC subs are to add mroe wirieng options. most people choose mono block class D or cLass T amp these are much more efficient for subs then a 2 channel class A/B amp. now if you are running 2 subs to a class d amp you well want 2ohm DVC subs if you are running just one sub you well want a 4ohm dvc sub.
as victor mentioned wireing them differnt ways nets differnt ohm values a 2ohm DVC sub can be wired for either 1ohm or 4ohm load on the amplifier. and a 4ohm DVC sub can be wired for a 2ohm or 8ohm load on the amplifier. then with 2 dvc subs the options change again
best way to explain is to show you here is a great web site that shows the possible wiring for DVC subs
http://www.phoenixgold.com/tutorial/wiring_tutor.html
best sight i have found to show wiring options it is easy to use for anyone and shows a discription and a picture so you can easily do it yourself.
hope this helps
Chronos
nasttcar on 10/27/2004 07:56:20
Thanks for your input. Here's a little more data.
My new HU is an Alpine IVAD900 audio/video player.
The amp is an ADS P640 6 channel with internal crossovers. Each channel is 40W.
My front speakers will be MB Quart 216's with high pass at 50hz, my rears will be stock Audi's with low pass at 2000hz and high pass at 150hz, and the sub(s) at low pass of 150hz.
I am wanting more to have excellent sound, and not the big thump-da-thump, but do one to get good solid lows when the DVD player is playing a movie with deep lows.
I could bridge my channels on my amp to give more power to the fronts, but then nothing would be left for subwoofer(s). Or leave as planned and bridge my last 2 channels and use a single subwoofer.
What are your thoughts?
Thanks, John
SG86 on 10/28/2004 18:47:03
with my 2 Shiva's and Jbl bp600.1, what will i be able to do with these? if i put them in parallel could i run them at 1 ohm 600 watts eeach? and will this be underpowering them?
uochronos on 10/29/2004 02:32:39
umm the most power you can get out of that amp is 300watts to each shiva... mattering what box you us that could be under powering them.
Chronos
swez on 10/29/2004 04:51:17
That 6 channel amp may be very interesting to work with. Depending on the power your front speakers can take, it would be good to bridge the amp into a 4 channel version. More power to front stage and decent power to rear channels. I looked up that amp model mentioned and cannot find it under ADS listings. Do you have a web link on it?
The MBQ's mentioned have 2 lines of Comps. (RCE/PCE series) Both are solid performers. But the PCE's are very pricey. Both series are rated 60 to 130 watts RMS power. So, adequate power to run them will come from bridging 4 amp channels into a potent 2 channel version for the MBQ's and the remaining channels to the rear stocks should work out for now.
Sub... a single 10" or 12" sub should be plenty of bass to give you solid DVD movie performance. No need for a huge subs here. A well designed enclosure, that fits well into the TT is a good plan. Not sure how much cargo space you heve to spare here, but a small sealed enclosure, (<1.0 cf) should be fine in performance with a good sub and mayby 200-300 watts (RMS) of amping power. The JL10W3v2 fits the bill sub wise. Question is, what amp to power it with? Depends on your budget and features required.
The amp that best suits that sub from JL is the 250/1 series.
http://www.jlaudio.com/amps/2501.html
This will deliver a solid 250 RMS at 1.5 - 4.0 ohms. The correct sub choice is the 2+2 DVC, wired in series for a 4 ohm load.
FYI: Since you are running 2 modest amps here, need to figure out how much current both amps will draw when you really want full sound. The 250/1 will draw close to 25 of current alone. The 6 channel amp may pull upwards of 30A at full power. So, we're looking at enough ALT/BAT power to deliver pretty close to 100A off the ALT.
Do you know the ALT amperage rating numbers at idle and say 2000 RPM?
Comments?
Swez
nasttcar on 10/29/2004 10:33:41
Swez, do you have an email where I can send you a couple of PDF files on the amp and head unit I will be using?
I am working on getting the alternator information.
You sound like you could help me alot on this.
Thanks, John iluvtt@gmail.com
swez on 10/29/2004 10:55:24
Sure John,
E-mail: swezdp@juno.com
Swez
nasttcar on 10/29/2004 15:47:30
Sending you an email now. I hope juno can take the attachments. I really appreciate your help on this.
John
swez on 10/30/2004 11:32:37
Did not get it. Also tried to send you an e-mail, but that space between John and il... did not take. Most use a space character or all one word in that field.
Example:
John iluvtt@gmail.com (NG)
John_iluvtt@gmail.com will fly
Johniluvtt@gmail.com will too
Swez
nasttcar on 10/30/2004 12:57:34
Swez, I will try again except this time without large attachments. Also, my other email you can try is istay@earthlink.net
Again, your help is greatly appreciated.
John
nasttcar on 10/30/2004 18:46:16
Swez, you got mail.
John
How do I size an amp to match up with the speaker so as it not to be under or over driven?
Thanks, John
Replies (12)
Victor on 10/27/2004 00:47:00
before commenting on the JL Audio 10W3 woofers... i would like to clear the concept of dual voice coil speakers( or woofers in this case )..
The whole idea behind makink dual voice coil woofers is better power handling.. it is somewhat like integrating the voice coils of 2 woofers but maintaining the single cone and frame structure.
now 1ohm , 2 ohm , 4ohms, 6ohms, 8 ohms are the impedence of the voice coils.
they notify the net load of a coil ..
when we talk about DVC(dual voice coil) woofers .. it means that the woofer has 2 voice coils.. when it says 2ohm DVC it means that the woofer has 2 voice coils each of 2ohms.. similarly when we say 4ohmDVC it means that the impedence of each voice coil in the woofer is 4ohms..
next step is understanding the series and parallel wiring to obtain a desired net load..
lets take and example of the product u stated..
the JL Audio 10W3 has 2 voice coils each of 2 ohms impedence..
hence if the voice coils are wired in series we can get a net load of 4 ohms for the woofer.. and if they are wired in paralle we can get a net load of 1ohm for the woofer...
now the basics are .. lower the impedence of the woofer the more power it extracts from the amplifier.. wait a sec.. that does not mean that you use a 1ohm load with a 2 ohm or 4 ohm stable amplifier..
the amplifier must be stable at the load u are going to use on it..
do u get my point??...
now regarding the amp.. are u planning to drive a single woofer or more.??
and how much would u like to spend are big factors.. along with the enclosure design and crossover network..
please give more info so that i can hlp u out..
comments..??
Victor
uochronos on 10/27/2004 02:49:16
basicaly DVC subs are to add mroe wirieng options. most people choose mono block class D or cLass T amp these are much more efficient for subs then a 2 channel class A/B amp. now if you are running 2 subs to a class d amp you well want 2ohm DVC subs if you are running just one sub you well want a 4ohm dvc sub.
as victor mentioned wireing them differnt ways nets differnt ohm values a 2ohm DVC sub can be wired for either 1ohm or 4ohm load on the amplifier. and a 4ohm DVC sub can be wired for a 2ohm or 8ohm load on the amplifier. then with 2 dvc subs the options change again
best way to explain is to show you here is a great web site that shows the possible wiring for DVC subs
http://www.phoenixgold.com/tutorial/wiring_tutor.html
best sight i have found to show wiring options it is easy to use for anyone and shows a discription and a picture so you can easily do it yourself.
hope this helps
Chronos
nasttcar on 10/27/2004 07:56:20
Thanks for your input. Here's a little more data.
My new HU is an Alpine IVAD900 audio/video player.
The amp is an ADS P640 6 channel with internal crossovers. Each channel is 40W.
My front speakers will be MB Quart 216's with high pass at 50hz, my rears will be stock Audi's with low pass at 2000hz and high pass at 150hz, and the sub(s) at low pass of 150hz.
I am wanting more to have excellent sound, and not the big thump-da-thump, but do one to get good solid lows when the DVD player is playing a movie with deep lows.
I could bridge my channels on my amp to give more power to the fronts, but then nothing would be left for subwoofer(s). Or leave as planned and bridge my last 2 channels and use a single subwoofer.
What are your thoughts?
Thanks, John
SG86 on 10/28/2004 18:47:03
with my 2 Shiva's and Jbl bp600.1, what will i be able to do with these? if i put them in parallel could i run them at 1 ohm 600 watts eeach? and will this be underpowering them?
uochronos on 10/29/2004 02:32:39
umm the most power you can get out of that amp is 300watts to each shiva... mattering what box you us that could be under powering them.
Chronos
swez on 10/29/2004 04:51:17
That 6 channel amp may be very interesting to work with. Depending on the power your front speakers can take, it would be good to bridge the amp into a 4 channel version. More power to front stage and decent power to rear channels. I looked up that amp model mentioned and cannot find it under ADS listings. Do you have a web link on it?
The MBQ's mentioned have 2 lines of Comps. (RCE/PCE series) Both are solid performers. But the PCE's are very pricey. Both series are rated 60 to 130 watts RMS power. So, adequate power to run them will come from bridging 4 amp channels into a potent 2 channel version for the MBQ's and the remaining channels to the rear stocks should work out for now.
Sub... a single 10" or 12" sub should be plenty of bass to give you solid DVD movie performance. No need for a huge subs here. A well designed enclosure, that fits well into the TT is a good plan. Not sure how much cargo space you heve to spare here, but a small sealed enclosure, (<1.0 cf) should be fine in performance with a good sub and mayby 200-300 watts (RMS) of amping power. The JL10W3v2 fits the bill sub wise. Question is, what amp to power it with? Depends on your budget and features required.
The amp that best suits that sub from JL is the 250/1 series.
http://www.jlaudio.com/amps/2501.html
This will deliver a solid 250 RMS at 1.5 - 4.0 ohms. The correct sub choice is the 2+2 DVC, wired in series for a 4 ohm load.
FYI: Since you are running 2 modest amps here, need to figure out how much current both amps will draw when you really want full sound. The 250/1 will draw close to 25 of current alone. The 6 channel amp may pull upwards of 30A at full power. So, we're looking at enough ALT/BAT power to deliver pretty close to 100A off the ALT.
Do you know the ALT amperage rating numbers at idle and say 2000 RPM?
Comments?
Swez
nasttcar on 10/29/2004 10:33:41
Swez, do you have an email where I can send you a couple of PDF files on the amp and head unit I will be using?
I am working on getting the alternator information.
You sound like you could help me alot on this.
Thanks, John iluvtt@gmail.com
swez on 10/29/2004 10:55:24
Sure John,
E-mail: swezdp@juno.com
Swez
nasttcar on 10/29/2004 15:47:30
Sending you an email now. I hope juno can take the attachments. I really appreciate your help on this.
John
swez on 10/30/2004 11:32:37
Did not get it. Also tried to send you an e-mail, but that space between John and il... did not take. Most use a space character or all one word in that field.
Example:
John iluvtt@gmail.com (NG)
John_iluvtt@gmail.com will fly
Johniluvtt@gmail.com will too
Swez
nasttcar on 10/30/2004 12:57:34
Swez, I will try again except this time without large attachments. Also, my other email you can try is istay@earthlink.net
Again, your help is greatly appreciated.
John
nasttcar on 10/30/2004 18:46:16
Swez, you got mail.
John
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