I bought a used 1986 Mercedes 560sl convertible and have a question about my audio setup. The old system was a becker grand prix head unit and two six inch speakers. I replaced the head unit with an alpine CDA 9833 and the speakers with two 6.5 inch Alpine SPS170 s type two way coaxial speakers. The two speakers however hardly put out any bass. I'd like to add a pair of 6x9's behind the seats since their is room but will I need an amplifier if I get the 6x9's? I don't turn it up too loud but I still don't want the system to be distorted at low volume.
Thanks!
Replies (6)
swez on 09/30/2004 12:43:34
Very good choice on the Alpine 9833 HU. It has 26 x 4 (RMS) output from internal amps and a full array of features too.
Massive bass from 6.5" door speakers are not possible in most door mount applications unless you use:
A. Larger power amps to drive the speakers
B. Use sound dampening materials on the inner door panels to improve low end resonse.
C. Quality Component systems are often superior to Coaxials in fron stage applications (especially when amped to 50 RMS or more per driver)
You might want to consider upgrading to quality Components up front like MA Audio or CDT and install the present 6.5" coaxials in the rear deck lid. A decent 2/4 channel amp would be adequate to power the front speakers and power the rear speakers off the HU amps.
Adding a modest sub in the trunk will give you the bass that is lacking. Can use a small 10-12" sub in sealed enclosure and power the sub off the rear channels of a 4 channel amp (bridged).
One product that is really well suited to your desires would be the MRV-F450, 5 channel amplifier. This amp is pretty well designed and under $300.00 if you shop it hard. Can bridge the 4 channels into a more potent 2 channel version and use the sub channel to power the bass machine.
A 2nd option for Bass, could be the Infinity Basslink system. A powered 10" sub in a very compact enclosure with its own amplifier. This employs a 10" sub, a passive radiator (for better lows) and a 200 watt MONO sub amp. I have seen them for ~$200.00 off e-bay and other sites as well.
BassLink: http://www.crutchfield.com/S-XZDNUHci5JW/cgi-bin/ProdView.asp?s=0&c=10&g=51000&I=108BASSLIN
&o=p&a=0&cc=01&avf=N&search=
Alpine MRV-F450:
http://www.crutchfield.com/S-XZDNUHci5JW/cgi-bin/ProdView.
asp?s=0&c=3&g=120&I=500MRVF450&o=p&a=0&cc=01&avf=
N&search=alpine&wmsf=1
Does this have appeal to your needs and budget?
Swez
Delti_91 on 09/30/2004 13:03:09
Thanks alot! That was a quick reponse! I would have gotten 6.5 inch boston acustics speakers but they were too deep and couldn't fit.
I'm completely new to high performance car audio and am not a serious audiphile but I can still appreciate good sound. The infinity basslink sounds right up my alley but do you think I could hook up a pair of 6x9s without the need of an amp?
I have friends who can hardly keep their headlights on because of their systems and my car's battery options are very limited. The infinity is great unless I can power the 6x9's without an amp.
swez on 09/30/2004 20:18:34
Yes, the 6x9's or whatever you elect to install in the back lid will give adequate SPL from off the HU amps. These are just rear fill anyway and not intended to have as much output as the front channel speakers.
Boston Acoustics are good products... but I cannot say they are worth the $400.00 a set. Same with MB Quartz Comps. Sound great... but not a great value. The CDT CL-61a's are only $150.00 a set and several guys here have bought them with high praises.
Links:
1. http://www.thezeb.com/detail.aspx?ID=1083 CDT Classics, choice of silk or Ti tweeters
2. http://www.thezeb.com/detail.aspx?ID=2801 MA Audio Comps... a very good value here
===================================================
The only thing... they need amping power to get full potential from them. Power wise, 50 RMS per speaker min. An amp that can deliver a clean 75-100 RMS/ch is perfect for these speakers. Not a huge load on the electricals either. (<30 amperes of current in most cases)
The Infinity Basslink is a very nice product in all. I believe it is fused at 25A and nominal current draw is under 20A. So really, 30-50A of current draw for both amps should be under the limits of your car electrical system needs.
FYI: Most newer cars use an 85-100A ALT. The car needs between 40-60A to run all major accessories. That leaves 30-50A of headroom for additional accessories. Do you know what the ALT output on this car is? Battery CCA rating too?
Swez
Delti_91 on 10/1/2004 09:31:27
Yes the old battery blew (i think it was the original) so I installed a new interstate mega-tron plus. The battery is also in the trunk so an amp would most likely be best there as well.
The specs are as followed according to the interstate website:
Weight: 52 pounds
Length: 14.38 inches
Width: 6.88 inches
Height: 6.88 inches
Cranking Amps: 1000
Cold Cranking Amps: 850
Voltage: 12
Termination: A
I don't have too much running on the battery except for the norms.
As for the original ALT it was replaced with a master volt alt the specs are as followed according to the website.
Model Alternator 24/150
Charge current 150A
Charge voltage - absorption 28,5
Charge voltage - float 26,5
adjustability - range 24-30
Charge regulator Alpha Pro
Pulley diameter ø 92
Belt tread 2x
Direction of revolutions both directions
Weight 13,1 kg.
Since the car is 18 years old it doesn't have much to run with the battery. Mercedes, realizing that the 560sl weighed 3687 pounds voted to forfeit many luxury items. There are no power seats, no traction control, and no other battery draining luxury goodies.
Their is a factory amp that is still in the car but the hifibuys techs bypassed it saying that the audio industry has probably evolved somewhat in 18 years. ;-). So I don't think it would be of much use.
Oh and to set a budget I wouldn't like to top 600 if you think that's possible.
Thanks
ttocs on 10/1/2004 10:20:47
wait now.....
Did you put in the deck? Did you bypass the factory fade controll in the consol? Is there a fade control in the consol?
erikcooper on 10/1/2004 13:36:31
You have plenty of room to work as far as power goes. For the modest set-up that you want your power is almost unlimited. I would suggest the CDT CL61a comp set as well. I have them, I love them, I still don't have them running off of an amp, all stock HU power. It is easy enough to find an amp to run them. With $600 - $150 for the CDTs you still have $450 to work with on bass and amps. What say you to that?
Thanks!
Replies (6)
swez on 09/30/2004 12:43:34
Very good choice on the Alpine 9833 HU. It has 26 x 4 (RMS) output from internal amps and a full array of features too.
Massive bass from 6.5" door speakers are not possible in most door mount applications unless you use:
A. Larger power amps to drive the speakers
B. Use sound dampening materials on the inner door panels to improve low end resonse.
C. Quality Component systems are often superior to Coaxials in fron stage applications (especially when amped to 50 RMS or more per driver)
You might want to consider upgrading to quality Components up front like MA Audio or CDT and install the present 6.5" coaxials in the rear deck lid. A decent 2/4 channel amp would be adequate to power the front speakers and power the rear speakers off the HU amps.
Adding a modest sub in the trunk will give you the bass that is lacking. Can use a small 10-12" sub in sealed enclosure and power the sub off the rear channels of a 4 channel amp (bridged).
One product that is really well suited to your desires would be the MRV-F450, 5 channel amplifier. This amp is pretty well designed and under $300.00 if you shop it hard. Can bridge the 4 channels into a more potent 2 channel version and use the sub channel to power the bass machine.
A 2nd option for Bass, could be the Infinity Basslink system. A powered 10" sub in a very compact enclosure with its own amplifier. This employs a 10" sub, a passive radiator (for better lows) and a 200 watt MONO sub amp. I have seen them for ~$200.00 off e-bay and other sites as well.
BassLink: http://www.crutchfield.com/S-XZDNUHci5JW/cgi-bin/ProdView.asp?s=0&c=10&g=51000&I=108BASSLIN
&o=p&a=0&cc=01&avf=N&search=
Alpine MRV-F450:
http://www.crutchfield.com/S-XZDNUHci5JW/cgi-bin/ProdView.
asp?s=0&c=3&g=120&I=500MRVF450&o=p&a=0&cc=01&avf=
N&search=alpine&wmsf=1
Does this have appeal to your needs and budget?
Swez
Delti_91 on 09/30/2004 13:03:09
Thanks alot! That was a quick reponse! I would have gotten 6.5 inch boston acustics speakers but they were too deep and couldn't fit.
I'm completely new to high performance car audio and am not a serious audiphile but I can still appreciate good sound. The infinity basslink sounds right up my alley but do you think I could hook up a pair of 6x9s without the need of an amp?
I have friends who can hardly keep their headlights on because of their systems and my car's battery options are very limited. The infinity is great unless I can power the 6x9's without an amp.
swez on 09/30/2004 20:18:34
Yes, the 6x9's or whatever you elect to install in the back lid will give adequate SPL from off the HU amps. These are just rear fill anyway and not intended to have as much output as the front channel speakers.
Boston Acoustics are good products... but I cannot say they are worth the $400.00 a set. Same with MB Quartz Comps. Sound great... but not a great value. The CDT CL-61a's are only $150.00 a set and several guys here have bought them with high praises.
Links:
1. http://www.thezeb.com/detail.aspx?ID=1083 CDT Classics, choice of silk or Ti tweeters
2. http://www.thezeb.com/detail.aspx?ID=2801 MA Audio Comps... a very good value here
===================================================
The only thing... they need amping power to get full potential from them. Power wise, 50 RMS per speaker min. An amp that can deliver a clean 75-100 RMS/ch is perfect for these speakers. Not a huge load on the electricals either. (<30 amperes of current in most cases)
The Infinity Basslink is a very nice product in all. I believe it is fused at 25A and nominal current draw is under 20A. So really, 30-50A of current draw for both amps should be under the limits of your car electrical system needs.
FYI: Most newer cars use an 85-100A ALT. The car needs between 40-60A to run all major accessories. That leaves 30-50A of headroom for additional accessories. Do you know what the ALT output on this car is? Battery CCA rating too?
Swez
Delti_91 on 10/1/2004 09:31:27
Yes the old battery blew (i think it was the original) so I installed a new interstate mega-tron plus. The battery is also in the trunk so an amp would most likely be best there as well.
The specs are as followed according to the interstate website:
Weight: 52 pounds
Length: 14.38 inches
Width: 6.88 inches
Height: 6.88 inches
Cranking Amps: 1000
Cold Cranking Amps: 850
Voltage: 12
Termination: A
I don't have too much running on the battery except for the norms.
As for the original ALT it was replaced with a master volt alt the specs are as followed according to the website.
Model Alternator 24/150
Charge current 150A
Charge voltage - absorption 28,5
Charge voltage - float 26,5
adjustability - range 24-30
Charge regulator Alpha Pro
Pulley diameter ø 92
Belt tread 2x
Direction of revolutions both directions
Weight 13,1 kg.
Since the car is 18 years old it doesn't have much to run with the battery. Mercedes, realizing that the 560sl weighed 3687 pounds voted to forfeit many luxury items. There are no power seats, no traction control, and no other battery draining luxury goodies.
Their is a factory amp that is still in the car but the hifibuys techs bypassed it saying that the audio industry has probably evolved somewhat in 18 years. ;-). So I don't think it would be of much use.
Oh and to set a budget I wouldn't like to top 600 if you think that's possible.
Thanks
ttocs on 10/1/2004 10:20:47
wait now.....
Did you put in the deck? Did you bypass the factory fade controll in the consol? Is there a fade control in the consol?
erikcooper on 10/1/2004 13:36:31
You have plenty of room to work as far as power goes. For the modest set-up that you want your power is almost unlimited. I would suggest the CDT CL61a comp set as well. I have them, I love them, I still don't have them running off of an amp, all stock HU power. It is easy enough to find an amp to run them. With $600 - $150 for the CDTs you still have $450 to work with on bass and amps. What say you to that?
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