Alright, first thing is first.. im new with amps/subs. Im trying and willing to learn.
I have been adding on to my car audio system for a while now, replaced head unit, interior speakers, then moved on to getting an Amp and 2 subs.
I bought, what i figured would be a good set up for a beginner like myself. Best buy had a 2-12" and 450w amp for $170, so i picked that up. I ran all the wires correctly, it works fine but there isnt much punch... I wont expect much from each sub being that they are only 300w. each. A friend told me i should Bridge them and it would hit twice as hard... he drew me a little diagram and i wired it like he drew. It deffinatly hit harder but only one of my subs worked.
Is there a way to get both to work as good as the one does now? And is it not a good idea to bridge my amp of 450w to a sub of only 300w?
My AMP:
http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?id=1069301995031&skuId=6249847&productCategoryId=cat03085&type=product
Any help or ideas?
-Thanks
Replies (11)
UKinstaller on 09/20/2004 22:31:56
well, you're not going to get crazy bass out of those subs because the amp is only 150W RMS. the max power is 450W, but max power is basically just misadvertisement by companies to make people believe they are buying something more powerful than what they really are. it sucks, but unfortunately that's just how it is.
as for only one sub working when bridged, it sounds like possibly a wiring problem. please explain which subs you have, how many ohms they are, and whether they are SVC or DVC subs, and we can tell you how to wire them correctly for the loudest, cleanest sound.
-UK
-UK
uochronos on 09/21/2004 03:07:25
i agree with UK here. this set up is not going to get loud really. honestly i dont ever suggest buying from best buy or circuit city or any similar place.
we can usualy find a better set up for the same price if you ask for that info.
however give us all the specs you have on this set up and we well guide you towards its best set up possible. first off be careful when bridging it if it wasnt already bridged it probaly wasnt for a reason if you bridge and amp with subs that are the wrong ohmage you well damage the amp in the long run.
even bridged though compared to other set ups it wont get twice as loud. every time you double the wattage you gain 3 decibals of volume. 1,2,4,8,16,32..... ect..... each time you double the wattae you only gain 3 db. basicaly what i'm getting at is if you have 2 300watts rms subs thats 600watts rms that is extremly loud. so if you invest in 1 decent 300watt sub and a decent 300watt rms amp you would be very impressed 1alpine type r and a 300watt amp would be far superior to what you have and very loud. 1 alpine type r can be had for under 150$ and a 300watt amp for under 200$ if shoped well..
ok i well leave it at that for now. just trying to lay all your options out here. please respond with questions comments etc and help us get pointed in the direction you want to go. we well help you from there.
Chronos
swez on 09/21/2004 09:42:56
Agreed, this amp is not enough power (even when bridged) to drive sub(s) to a decent SPL level w/o clipping like crazy. It is a good amp for the front stage speakers in your car though. Worth hanging on too, and just add a more robust sub amp for powering your woofers.
What woofers do you have now? Make and model # will help us to make good recommendations on a well matched sub system. If you are on a tight budget, give a price range and we can probably find something that will do the job in your budget range.
FYI: When looking at amps or other gear, look for the RMS or Continous music power ratings. This is what you really want to know... not peak watts. Peak watts ratings are not a true reflection of what you can actually expect when all is said and done.
Swez
n00b on 09/21/2004 17:30:30
Wow, awesome responses...
This is all starting to make a bit more sence to me...
The subs i have are : Lightning Audio p3.12.4
4 Ohms
300w,
Im on a limited budget, but just tell me what you think i should get in the near future...
I am new at this again and all help is awesome.
-Thanks alot.
swez on 09/21/2004 17:38:23
This amp is packaged with the subs you noted. The subs are 100 RMS each, so no need to get crazy here with a larger sub amp.
http://www.crutchfield.com/S-BYslGHydRvh/cgi-bin/ProdView.asp?i=495B22501
I would not recommend going over 300 RMS in amping power here. That would be the upper limit in a sealed box design. Subs are wired in parallel for a net 2 ohm load. If you shop this one a bit, am sure it can be had for under $75.00 (USD)
Swez
UKinstaller on 09/21/2004 19:34:56
if it were me, and i can't stress that enough, i would stick with the amp you have. if you are on a limited budget, you might as well stick with what you have because, when wired in paralell, you are pushing 75W to each sub. for me, it wouldn't be worth it to go out and find a new amp just for 25 more watts to each sub. that's just me though.
to wire your subs in parallel, wire them like this:
http://www.crutchfieldadvisor.com/ISEO-rgbtcspd/learningcenter/car/subwoofers_wiring.html?subs=2&impedance=SVC4
holler if you can't figure it out. as stated earlier, this will maximize the power of your amp, running at 2 ohms, and send 75watts to each sub.
-UK
uochronos on 09/22/2004 02:38:55
honestly if it was me i would try an sell current set up if your not happy with it. and then get a better starting system... a 300watt amp 100-200$ and a effieicient sub say 70-150$. would really blow you away compared to current set up..
by efficient sub i mean not all subs are created equal one sub with a high effciency can get alot mroe sound out of the same power as a lesser effiecient sub.
you could even keep the current amp and just get a higher effieciency sub thats 150watts rms. this would get you more volume but might still be below your expectations.
also what are you shooting for in this system
SPL - Sound Preasure Level lots of volume
SQ - Sound Quality crystal clear no distortion not for high volumes really
SQL - This is a mix of the 2 above sounds above average and can get louder then average.
Chronos
n00b on 09/22/2004 19:46:58
Alright i wired my subs like mentioned above... They played for like 20 min on the way to work fine... right before i got there they went quiet... now when i turn them on the light turns red and goes into protect... so great.
lol, i prolly messed up my amp. Im not through with this all.. its all been a learning experiance and im not about to give up.. lol..
You guys have been a awesome source of knowledge for me... thanks
uochronos on 09/22/2004 19:52:25
sounds like the wrong ohmage was input and the amp over heated... try diconecting power to amp wire subs to original configuration and rehook amp you may get lucky and it well work fine.
or you might have burnt a internal part.
Chronos
n00b on 09/22/2004 20:01:20
i did, lol... no luck, im gonna go Di** with it a bit more and see if i cant get it working again... but right not it looks as though im gonna be getting another amp sometime soon.
swez on 09/22/2004 20:37:20
If you bridged this amp and ran the subs in parallel (2 ohm load) I will bet the amp power supply or power transistors took a dive. That amp cannot handle a 2 ohm load when bridged!
If it's a new amp, check it against known good speakers to be sure the subs are not the problem. If the amp fires up with 1 speaker per channel... amp is OK. If amp does not power up... warrantee repair time.
Also, test each sub with a known good amp. If the subs still work, the amp died.
Swez
PS So much for listening to a friend with what seem like helpful advice. His advise... cost you an amp failure.
I have been adding on to my car audio system for a while now, replaced head unit, interior speakers, then moved on to getting an Amp and 2 subs.
I bought, what i figured would be a good set up for a beginner like myself. Best buy had a 2-12" and 450w amp for $170, so i picked that up. I ran all the wires correctly, it works fine but there isnt much punch... I wont expect much from each sub being that they are only 300w. each. A friend told me i should Bridge them and it would hit twice as hard... he drew me a little diagram and i wired it like he drew. It deffinatly hit harder but only one of my subs worked.
Is there a way to get both to work as good as the one does now? And is it not a good idea to bridge my amp of 450w to a sub of only 300w?
My AMP:
http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?id=1069301995031&skuId=6249847&productCategoryId=cat03085&type=product
Any help or ideas?
-Thanks
Replies (11)
UKinstaller on 09/20/2004 22:31:56
well, you're not going to get crazy bass out of those subs because the amp is only 150W RMS. the max power is 450W, but max power is basically just misadvertisement by companies to make people believe they are buying something more powerful than what they really are. it sucks, but unfortunately that's just how it is.
as for only one sub working when bridged, it sounds like possibly a wiring problem. please explain which subs you have, how many ohms they are, and whether they are SVC or DVC subs, and we can tell you how to wire them correctly for the loudest, cleanest sound.
-UK
-UK
uochronos on 09/21/2004 03:07:25
i agree with UK here. this set up is not going to get loud really. honestly i dont ever suggest buying from best buy or circuit city or any similar place.
we can usualy find a better set up for the same price if you ask for that info.
however give us all the specs you have on this set up and we well guide you towards its best set up possible. first off be careful when bridging it if it wasnt already bridged it probaly wasnt for a reason if you bridge and amp with subs that are the wrong ohmage you well damage the amp in the long run.
even bridged though compared to other set ups it wont get twice as loud. every time you double the wattage you gain 3 decibals of volume. 1,2,4,8,16,32..... ect..... each time you double the wattae you only gain 3 db. basicaly what i'm getting at is if you have 2 300watts rms subs thats 600watts rms that is extremly loud. so if you invest in 1 decent 300watt sub and a decent 300watt rms amp you would be very impressed 1alpine type r and a 300watt amp would be far superior to what you have and very loud. 1 alpine type r can be had for under 150$ and a 300watt amp for under 200$ if shoped well..
ok i well leave it at that for now. just trying to lay all your options out here. please respond with questions comments etc and help us get pointed in the direction you want to go. we well help you from there.
Chronos
swez on 09/21/2004 09:42:56
Agreed, this amp is not enough power (even when bridged) to drive sub(s) to a decent SPL level w/o clipping like crazy. It is a good amp for the front stage speakers in your car though. Worth hanging on too, and just add a more robust sub amp for powering your woofers.
What woofers do you have now? Make and model # will help us to make good recommendations on a well matched sub system. If you are on a tight budget, give a price range and we can probably find something that will do the job in your budget range.
FYI: When looking at amps or other gear, look for the RMS or Continous music power ratings. This is what you really want to know... not peak watts. Peak watts ratings are not a true reflection of what you can actually expect when all is said and done.
Swez
n00b on 09/21/2004 17:30:30
Wow, awesome responses...
This is all starting to make a bit more sence to me...
The subs i have are : Lightning Audio p3.12.4
4 Ohms
300w,
Im on a limited budget, but just tell me what you think i should get in the near future...
I am new at this again and all help is awesome.
-Thanks alot.
swez on 09/21/2004 17:38:23
This amp is packaged with the subs you noted. The subs are 100 RMS each, so no need to get crazy here with a larger sub amp.
http://www.crutchfield.com/S-BYslGHydRvh/cgi-bin/ProdView.asp?i=495B22501
I would not recommend going over 300 RMS in amping power here. That would be the upper limit in a sealed box design. Subs are wired in parallel for a net 2 ohm load. If you shop this one a bit, am sure it can be had for under $75.00 (USD)
Swez
UKinstaller on 09/21/2004 19:34:56
if it were me, and i can't stress that enough, i would stick with the amp you have. if you are on a limited budget, you might as well stick with what you have because, when wired in paralell, you are pushing 75W to each sub. for me, it wouldn't be worth it to go out and find a new amp just for 25 more watts to each sub. that's just me though.
to wire your subs in parallel, wire them like this:
http://www.crutchfieldadvisor.com/ISEO-rgbtcspd/learningcenter/car/subwoofers_wiring.html?subs=2&impedance=SVC4
holler if you can't figure it out. as stated earlier, this will maximize the power of your amp, running at 2 ohms, and send 75watts to each sub.
-UK
uochronos on 09/22/2004 02:38:55
honestly if it was me i would try an sell current set up if your not happy with it. and then get a better starting system... a 300watt amp 100-200$ and a effieicient sub say 70-150$. would really blow you away compared to current set up..
by efficient sub i mean not all subs are created equal one sub with a high effciency can get alot mroe sound out of the same power as a lesser effiecient sub.
you could even keep the current amp and just get a higher effieciency sub thats 150watts rms. this would get you more volume but might still be below your expectations.
also what are you shooting for in this system
SPL - Sound Preasure Level lots of volume
SQ - Sound Quality crystal clear no distortion not for high volumes really
SQL - This is a mix of the 2 above sounds above average and can get louder then average.
Chronos
n00b on 09/22/2004 19:46:58
Alright i wired my subs like mentioned above... They played for like 20 min on the way to work fine... right before i got there they went quiet... now when i turn them on the light turns red and goes into protect... so great.
lol, i prolly messed up my amp. Im not through with this all.. its all been a learning experiance and im not about to give up.. lol..
You guys have been a awesome source of knowledge for me... thanks
uochronos on 09/22/2004 19:52:25
sounds like the wrong ohmage was input and the amp over heated... try diconecting power to amp wire subs to original configuration and rehook amp you may get lucky and it well work fine.
or you might have burnt a internal part.
Chronos
n00b on 09/22/2004 20:01:20
i did, lol... no luck, im gonna go Di** with it a bit more and see if i cant get it working again... but right not it looks as though im gonna be getting another amp sometime soon.
swez on 09/22/2004 20:37:20
If you bridged this amp and ran the subs in parallel (2 ohm load) I will bet the amp power supply or power transistors took a dive. That amp cannot handle a 2 ohm load when bridged!
If it's a new amp, check it against known good speakers to be sure the subs are not the problem. If the amp fires up with 1 speaker per channel... amp is OK. If amp does not power up... warrantee repair time.
Also, test each sub with a known good amp. If the subs still work, the amp died.
Swez
PS So much for listening to a friend with what seem like helpful advice. His advise... cost you an amp failure.
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