would the following subwoofers be underpowered if hooked up as follows?
sony 444 amplifier
Amplifier Type Multi Channels
Power Output
RMS Power at 2 Ohms 40 W x 4
RMS Power at 4 Ohms 35 W x 4
Performance
Frequency Response 5 Hz - 80000 Hz
Signal to Noise Ratio 100 dB
THD at Rated RMS Power .01 %
this amp is powering these subs:
mtx thunder 6000 10" 4 ohm 250 watts rms
rockford punch stage 1 10" 4 ohm 150 watts rms
infinity 7520A amplifier
# Of Channels 2
1 OHM Output Power - Full Range Not Applicable
14.4V Dynamic Power At 2 Ohms 142 Watts
2 OHM Output Power - Full Range 190 Watts
4 OHM Output Power - Full Range 97 Watts
Bass Boost Variable
Bridgeable Yes
Bridged Power At 2 OHMS - Full Range 142 Watts
Bridged Power At 4 OHMS - Full Range 97 Watts
this amp is powering these subs:
rockford punch stage 1 10" 4 ohm 150 watts rms
alpine type s 10" 4 ohm 300 watt rms
this system belongs to a freind who wired 2 subs per amp both bridged off the same channel. when i had seen what he'd done i thought that he was surely underpowering these subs pretty bad but he thought that i was wrong so i'm here to ask the experts. so what do you think?
Replies (10)
uochronos on 09/19/2004 21:57:33
well aside from other things he is defiantly underpower these subs at best all 4 subs have a combined total of arounf 300watts rms going to them probaly a bit less....just the one alpine is rated at 300watts,
then there is the fact he is running 3 completly differnt subs here that i would think may cause cancelation but i'm unsure.
i think he would be bwtter off running just the 2 rockfords or just the alpine... remember 300watts rms is 300watts rms spliting this between 4 subs or 1 sub gets the same volume, if he is going for spl using the most efficient sub well net the loudest system if he is going for sq then choosing the best sq sub would net better results then using all 4.
basicaly i see few advantages to this system and alot of downfalls.
Chronos
P0werLifter on 09/19/2004 23:19:17
Im with Chronos on this one..all of these subs are underpowered, not only that but i dont recommend mixing subwoofer brands together.
Your best bet is to run either the one Apline..or the 2 Rockfords Rather then the mixed 4.
If your going for SQ,,,go with a sealed enclosure, Or..if your going for SPL,,,id go ported.
-Jason
oldmazda on 09/20/2004 00:31:34
well i'm glad to see you guys are with me. i think that he's just trying to get more subs in his vehicle just to look impressive. for some reason he has this idea in his head that the infinity amp that he purchased was capable of doing so much. the salesmen at the store said that this amp could potentially move a alpine type X 10". this is when i had to call bullpoop and check out the specs because there is no way any amplifier could make 1000 watts out of a 30 amp draw. but anyways.... how long will it take for the subs to become damaged and how damaged will they get if he continues with this setup. also i don't really know about the wiring what he essentially has done is bridged one sub off of the amp then has the second one in a parallel circuit with that one. they are all SVC 4 ohm subs so wouldn't doing this wiring knock down the ohms to 2 ohm?
P0werLifter on 09/20/2004 00:54:59
I dont mean to come off offensive, but in all honesty, the more speakers you have doesnt make it more impressive. What makes a system impressive if how it sounds, or if your a SPL nut like myself, what type of system your running,,,,how many Watts, and what kind of numbers your hitting on the termlab meter.
Sure more speakers can look impressive, but at the same time, are they the same type? brand? etc.,,,how are they ran etc and do you have the gear to support those woofers.
The main issue i see here with your friend is the possibity of damage to the speakers from the amplifier Clipping. Im assuming your buddy has the Bass cranked all the way up..and at high volume when the amp cant produce a clean signal anymore it sends clipped distorted power to your speakers causing damage.
Id recommend telling him to run 1 Alpine off a single amplifer,,or 2 Rockfords off one amplifier so he doesnt have to worry about it..and he'll be happier with it than what hes running now.
-Jason
swez on 09/20/2004 09:58:41
The Infinity is the best amp for the sub application. The Sony is pretty weak and best for running full range speakers. Having it bridged into a stronger 2 channel configuration nets about 80 RMS per channel. Not bad for front speakers... too weak for subs as it will clip like crazy. Not good for the amp or woofers.
Agree with Chronos and PL... this system would be best if he used the Rockfords or a single Alpine off the Infinity amp. The plan he is running with now is very poor choice. As my Uncle Bob used to say... this plan sounds like "Hammered Poop" to me. Can you picture hammered poop? Pretty bad idea! Yes, Bob's my uncle.
Anyway, no offense meant here... but do you really think your friend will listen to good advice? Some guys just gotta do it their own way, regardless of how many ppl tell him he's off the tracks.
Good luck selling the better plan,
Swez
oldmazda on 09/20/2004 17:58:12
hey guys, don't really think that he's gonna listen to me he's got it set in his mind that the nonothing salesmen at futureshop has a better idea of what he's doing than you guys do... i know different though. i just have one last question though, how long will it be before noticable damage is inflicted to either the amp or the sub, and which would be the first to go?
swez on 09/20/2004 18:02:32
Hard to say as it really depends on his listening habits and such. My money is on the Sony to crap out first and maybe take a few subs out when it blows.
Swez
P0werLifter on 09/20/2004 19:02:03
Well then you've done all you can in this matter. He'll just have to learn on his own, and the chances are the more he listens to what a salesman says, the less he's going to find out and the more trouble hes going to run into.
As far as what goes 1st...im taking my bet with Swez,it'll be the Sony that takes a crap 1st and fry the subs while its at it possibly. Buy hey..you did your part so no worries right? Just wash you hands of the issue
-Jason
oldmazda on 09/20/2004 19:47:51
ya well i tried helping him with his but now i think i have my eyes set on my own stereo. i'm gonna have a different truck so i'm gonna start shopping around for subs, and an amp that'll power them. i was thinking a pair of alpine type Rs or Ss 12" and although i would like to power them with a jbl 600.2 i don't think i'll be able to find one around here. do you suggest buying off the net... even with the ridiculous shipping costs? i'm just shopping around now and nothing is set in stone so if anyone has had some great results with a particular pair of 12s i wouldn't mind hearing. also what is the deal with rockford p1s are they decent subs... i can't really imagine a decent sub being sold for that cheap.
uochronos on 09/21/2004 03:14:29
i'm with swez and pl the sony well liklly crap out first. i was offered that same amp new for 30$ at a shop that was trying to get rid of sony stuff. the guy said they tended to crap out in the first place. also had a friend with that amp and the amp went out shortly.
as for buying off the net i 100% suggest it. i have bought almost my whole system off the net. as far as ridiculous shipping.... i dont know about that i think for maybe 10car audio items i have paid 100$ in shipping. many of the items where free shipping. evrything from the zeb is free shipping as far as i know. most other stores have similar or cheap shipping. and ebay is usualy reasonable mattering who you buy from.
i had a set of type R's and i loved them.
Chronos
sony 444 amplifier
Amplifier Type Multi Channels
Power Output
RMS Power at 2 Ohms 40 W x 4
RMS Power at 4 Ohms 35 W x 4
Performance
Frequency Response 5 Hz - 80000 Hz
Signal to Noise Ratio 100 dB
THD at Rated RMS Power .01 %
this amp is powering these subs:
mtx thunder 6000 10" 4 ohm 250 watts rms
rockford punch stage 1 10" 4 ohm 150 watts rms
infinity 7520A amplifier
# Of Channels 2
1 OHM Output Power - Full Range Not Applicable
14.4V Dynamic Power At 2 Ohms 142 Watts
2 OHM Output Power - Full Range 190 Watts
4 OHM Output Power - Full Range 97 Watts
Bass Boost Variable
Bridgeable Yes
Bridged Power At 2 OHMS - Full Range 142 Watts
Bridged Power At 4 OHMS - Full Range 97 Watts
this amp is powering these subs:
rockford punch stage 1 10" 4 ohm 150 watts rms
alpine type s 10" 4 ohm 300 watt rms
this system belongs to a freind who wired 2 subs per amp both bridged off the same channel. when i had seen what he'd done i thought that he was surely underpowering these subs pretty bad but he thought that i was wrong so i'm here to ask the experts. so what do you think?
Replies (10)
uochronos on 09/19/2004 21:57:33
well aside from other things he is defiantly underpower these subs at best all 4 subs have a combined total of arounf 300watts rms going to them probaly a bit less....just the one alpine is rated at 300watts,
then there is the fact he is running 3 completly differnt subs here that i would think may cause cancelation but i'm unsure.
i think he would be bwtter off running just the 2 rockfords or just the alpine... remember 300watts rms is 300watts rms spliting this between 4 subs or 1 sub gets the same volume, if he is going for spl using the most efficient sub well net the loudest system if he is going for sq then choosing the best sq sub would net better results then using all 4.
basicaly i see few advantages to this system and alot of downfalls.
Chronos
P0werLifter on 09/19/2004 23:19:17
Im with Chronos on this one..all of these subs are underpowered, not only that but i dont recommend mixing subwoofer brands together.
Your best bet is to run either the one Apline..or the 2 Rockfords Rather then the mixed 4.
If your going for SQ,,,go with a sealed enclosure, Or..if your going for SPL,,,id go ported.
-Jason
oldmazda on 09/20/2004 00:31:34
well i'm glad to see you guys are with me. i think that he's just trying to get more subs in his vehicle just to look impressive. for some reason he has this idea in his head that the infinity amp that he purchased was capable of doing so much. the salesmen at the store said that this amp could potentially move a alpine type X 10". this is when i had to call bullpoop and check out the specs because there is no way any amplifier could make 1000 watts out of a 30 amp draw. but anyways.... how long will it take for the subs to become damaged and how damaged will they get if he continues with this setup. also i don't really know about the wiring what he essentially has done is bridged one sub off of the amp then has the second one in a parallel circuit with that one. they are all SVC 4 ohm subs so wouldn't doing this wiring knock down the ohms to 2 ohm?
P0werLifter on 09/20/2004 00:54:59
I dont mean to come off offensive, but in all honesty, the more speakers you have doesnt make it more impressive. What makes a system impressive if how it sounds, or if your a SPL nut like myself, what type of system your running,,,,how many Watts, and what kind of numbers your hitting on the termlab meter.
Sure more speakers can look impressive, but at the same time, are they the same type? brand? etc.,,,how are they ran etc and do you have the gear to support those woofers.
The main issue i see here with your friend is the possibity of damage to the speakers from the amplifier Clipping. Im assuming your buddy has the Bass cranked all the way up..and at high volume when the amp cant produce a clean signal anymore it sends clipped distorted power to your speakers causing damage.
Id recommend telling him to run 1 Alpine off a single amplifer,,or 2 Rockfords off one amplifier so he doesnt have to worry about it..and he'll be happier with it than what hes running now.
-Jason
swez on 09/20/2004 09:58:41
The Infinity is the best amp for the sub application. The Sony is pretty weak and best for running full range speakers. Having it bridged into a stronger 2 channel configuration nets about 80 RMS per channel. Not bad for front speakers... too weak for subs as it will clip like crazy. Not good for the amp or woofers.
Agree with Chronos and PL... this system would be best if he used the Rockfords or a single Alpine off the Infinity amp. The plan he is running with now is very poor choice. As my Uncle Bob used to say... this plan sounds like "Hammered Poop" to me. Can you picture hammered poop? Pretty bad idea! Yes, Bob's my uncle.
Anyway, no offense meant here... but do you really think your friend will listen to good advice? Some guys just gotta do it their own way, regardless of how many ppl tell him he's off the tracks.
Good luck selling the better plan,
Swez
oldmazda on 09/20/2004 17:58:12
hey guys, don't really think that he's gonna listen to me he's got it set in his mind that the nonothing salesmen at futureshop has a better idea of what he's doing than you guys do... i know different though. i just have one last question though, how long will it be before noticable damage is inflicted to either the amp or the sub, and which would be the first to go?
swez on 09/20/2004 18:02:32
Hard to say as it really depends on his listening habits and such. My money is on the Sony to crap out first and maybe take a few subs out when it blows.
Swez
P0werLifter on 09/20/2004 19:02:03
Well then you've done all you can in this matter. He'll just have to learn on his own, and the chances are the more he listens to what a salesman says, the less he's going to find out and the more trouble hes going to run into.
As far as what goes 1st...im taking my bet with Swez,it'll be the Sony that takes a crap 1st and fry the subs while its at it possibly. Buy hey..you did your part so no worries right? Just wash you hands of the issue
-Jason
oldmazda on 09/20/2004 19:47:51
ya well i tried helping him with his but now i think i have my eyes set on my own stereo. i'm gonna have a different truck so i'm gonna start shopping around for subs, and an amp that'll power them. i was thinking a pair of alpine type Rs or Ss 12" and although i would like to power them with a jbl 600.2 i don't think i'll be able to find one around here. do you suggest buying off the net... even with the ridiculous shipping costs? i'm just shopping around now and nothing is set in stone so if anyone has had some great results with a particular pair of 12s i wouldn't mind hearing. also what is the deal with rockford p1s are they decent subs... i can't really imagine a decent sub being sold for that cheap.
uochronos on 09/21/2004 03:14:29
i'm with swez and pl the sony well liklly crap out first. i was offered that same amp new for 30$ at a shop that was trying to get rid of sony stuff. the guy said they tended to crap out in the first place. also had a friend with that amp and the amp went out shortly.
as for buying off the net i 100% suggest it. i have bought almost my whole system off the net. as far as ridiculous shipping.... i dont know about that i think for maybe 10car audio items i have paid 100$ in shipping. many of the items where free shipping. evrything from the zeb is free shipping as far as i know. most other stores have similar or cheap shipping. and ebay is usualy reasonable mattering who you buy from.
i had a set of type R's and i loved them.
Chronos
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