Just want to say thanks to all that have helped my pick my sub and amp in the past. I went with the JBL 300.1 and a 12" Alpine Type R sub, it sounds great.
But now I am thinking about capping my front stage speakers. I'm only going to have this car for another 6months to a year and I dont want to buy new speakers.
How do capacitors on speakers work and what frequency should I filter the low bass at? Should I block it where my subs LPF is set at so they will play everything above 90hz
Oh yah my interior speakers are four 5.25" speakers running off a Kenwood KDC-2019 head unit.
Thanks in advance for the help,
Jay
Replies (22)
LC1 on 07/14/2004 21:13:14
Also one other question.
I pulled my left front speaker out of the door and I was wondering which wire was the + and -. There was a green and a black wire, and I am assuming the black was - and green was + but I just want to make sure.
Thanks,
Jay
aposynthesi on 07/14/2004 21:23:03
The wires are different on every car, but most likely your power will be coloured.
I'm automatically going to say that you wont need a capacitor for your setup since your system doesn't pull enough power. Capacitors are used to store power temporarily in case a peak occurs.
For easy information check this out, it tells you what they do in further detail:
http://electronics.howstuffworks.com/capacitor3.htm
For our future reference, could you tell us the brand & model of your speakers?
Swez is on his way...
aposynthesi on 07/14/2004 21:23:59
Fix for the first sentence:
POSITIVE will be a colour, not POWER.
LC1 on 07/14/2004 22:08:20
Thanks for the attemp to try and help me, but I'm not asking about power capacitors. I'm talking about speaker caps to filter low frequencies. When Swez or anyone else who knows anything about car audio will know what I am talking about. Thanks anyways
Jay
aposynthesi on 07/14/2004 22:42:33
Oh, those are crossovers.
Most people usually use a high-pass crossover at ~80-90Hz.
LC1 on 07/14/2004 23:04:09
I guess I should be more specific in my question. What I am not sure of is what microfarad cap I should use and what frequency does it filter?
aposynthesi on 07/14/2004 23:30:55
Capacitors don't filter anything, they strictly electrical.
A microfarad is a unit of measure, one million microfarads make 1 farad. One farad = one amp second. Most car audio capacitors are 1 farad... meaning they are for electrical peaks.
Crossovers are the "filters," meaning they block out frequencies you don't want.
You could have the names mixed up.
swez on 07/14/2004 23:55:37
Apo... you are confused as to his need. Sit back and watch a minute OK? (Geez-0-peas) lol lol lol my side hurts from this one..no offense meant APO.... S.N.A.F.U. here
Filter cap for 4 ohms bass blocker: Between 300 -500uF will do it. A 5.25" is good down to ~70 Hz and still take some power.
350 uF = -6dB/octave @ 120 Hz
500 uF = -6dB slope/octave, @ 80 Hz.
Use a nonpolorized cap of choice uF, min., of >25 volts is fine.
I'd shoot at closer to 300 uF for these.
www.partsexpress.com
Swez
aposynthesi on 07/15/2004 00:05:40
That sounds like a crossover to me FROWN
LC1 on 07/15/2004 00:12:40
Swez, thanks for the help. "Bass blockers" thats the phrase i was looking for to describe them to aposynthesi.
Anyways, just a quick question, these speakers are OEM in a 1993 Plymouth Acclaim. I took one out of the door and the brand is Oxford. What I am not sure of is what impendance they are. Would you happen to know because that plays a factor in what cap to pick doesnt it?
aposynthesi on 07/15/2004 00:28:44
Swez you... you... eh.
I didn't know WHAT he was talking about... I was getting kind of mad; talking about a capacitor, describing a crossover, then you're all like "HEREICOMETOSAVETHEDAY - BASS BLOCKER."
P0werLifter on 07/15/2004 00:37:09
Alright now...DONT MAKE ME TURN THIS CAR AROUND...shake hands and make up GRIN ...."Are we there yet"
aposynthesi on 07/15/2004 00:44:07
Ha ha Swez and I go WAY back... he knows I'm just kidding.
P0werLifter on 07/15/2004 01:02:39
lol i know im just being a smart@ss GRIN thought it might be a good time to bust on in hehe
ttocs on 07/15/2004 01:15:45
and just so that you know it does not matter where you put the cap, it will block the bass since they are both in series with one another. It is generally said to go on the + side, but will work the same on the negative.
this was a good post then as we were able to inform 2 people.........
swez on 07/15/2004 07:39:32
Yes... busted as charged APO... was just having some fun with you too.
He was asking about bass blocking Caps, not power caps. Don't we all like to have a save the day answer once in a while too? Sure... we all do right. And nope, I did not mean to offend you in any way. But if I did, I am truly repentant...sorry bud. SAD
Back to the origin of this topic, 5.25" speakers can be many values in OEM designs. Oxford makes a decent speaker too. I have been to their facility in Chicago to see their production lines. Used to sell the ferrite magnets to them.
Get out an ohm meter and take a reading on the speaker while disconnected from the HU. Once you have that, use this formula to determine your filtering cap needs. The reading you get from a meter will be a DC resistance value. A reading of 3.6 ohms is a 4 ohm voice coil.
Highpass Filtering:
To determine the crossover frequency a certain amount of capacitance will give you, use the formula:
F = 0.159/(C x Rh)
Explanation of Terms:
C = is the capacitance value (in Farads) [1Farad = 1,000,000 uF]
Rh = is speaker impedance (usually 2, 4 or 8 ohms)
F = is the crossover frequency
Hope that helps,
Swez
racerbizoehm on 07/16/2004 10:54:24
I got another question about those bass blocker things, I got a boss 6.5 inch component system in my truck and crossover all that stuff. when i crank it up to keep up with the subs i get some popping or i guess its distortion, but would those bass blockers help and if they do where could i hook it up, factory wire that goes to crossover? or the mid range or tweeter>....
swez on 07/16/2004 12:17:58
If these Boss speakers are run off an amp with a High Pass filter, try setting the HPF @ ~80 - 100 Hz and see what you get.
If you are running them off the HU amps, the HU is running out of gas and you'll get clipping and high distortion by-products. This is not good and bass blockers will not help here alone. The HU bass settings might, if you back off on the HU bass control and set the sub amp gains to match HU high/mids.
No, it won't be as loud as you might want... but it will be clean signals to your mids/highs. Amping the mids/highs are your best option. You will get more clean mid/high signals from the HU this way. Bumping up the sub amp gain a tad... will restore your bass.
Say more OK?
Swez
racerbizoehm on 07/16/2004 14:05:24
yeh I think I can raise the amp gain prety sure I have it in about the middle right now, and the EQ on the HU setting I had it on was super bass so that would cause it to do that, yeh for everyday stuff usually have it on the vocal setting and that still has some decent bass to it. thanks i'll do that, o another thing i ran into a problem my 60A fuse on the wire going to amp went to hell, cant see any physical problems with fuse but no power goes through so its ebay crap and i'll replace it.
swez on 07/16/2004 16:47:52
Some cheap fuse holders will do that sometimes. A 60A flow of current is nothing to trifle with. Some of the better fuse holder designs I have seem are from:
http://www.knukonceptz.com
Have a look around... good stuff at reasonable prices too.
Swez
racerbizoehm on 07/19/2004 14:22:58
hey i fixed those speakers, the negative wire kinda fell of the mid range and was just shorting it out, so now it sounds as it as its gonna be so thanks anyways
swez on 07/19/2004 20:35:29
Cool!
Swez
But now I am thinking about capping my front stage speakers. I'm only going to have this car for another 6months to a year and I dont want to buy new speakers.
How do capacitors on speakers work and what frequency should I filter the low bass at? Should I block it where my subs LPF is set at so they will play everything above 90hz
Oh yah my interior speakers are four 5.25" speakers running off a Kenwood KDC-2019 head unit.
Thanks in advance for the help,
Jay
Replies (22)
LC1 on 07/14/2004 21:13:14
Also one other question.
I pulled my left front speaker out of the door and I was wondering which wire was the + and -. There was a green and a black wire, and I am assuming the black was - and green was + but I just want to make sure.
Thanks,
Jay
aposynthesi on 07/14/2004 21:23:03
The wires are different on every car, but most likely your power will be coloured.
I'm automatically going to say that you wont need a capacitor for your setup since your system doesn't pull enough power. Capacitors are used to store power temporarily in case a peak occurs.
For easy information check this out, it tells you what they do in further detail:
http://electronics.howstuffworks.com/capacitor3.htm
For our future reference, could you tell us the brand & model of your speakers?
Swez is on his way...
aposynthesi on 07/14/2004 21:23:59
Fix for the first sentence:
POSITIVE will be a colour, not POWER.
LC1 on 07/14/2004 22:08:20
Thanks for the attemp to try and help me, but I'm not asking about power capacitors. I'm talking about speaker caps to filter low frequencies. When Swez or anyone else who knows anything about car audio will know what I am talking about. Thanks anyways
Jay
aposynthesi on 07/14/2004 22:42:33
Oh, those are crossovers.
Most people usually use a high-pass crossover at ~80-90Hz.
LC1 on 07/14/2004 23:04:09
I guess I should be more specific in my question. What I am not sure of is what microfarad cap I should use and what frequency does it filter?
aposynthesi on 07/14/2004 23:30:55
Capacitors don't filter anything, they strictly electrical.
A microfarad is a unit of measure, one million microfarads make 1 farad. One farad = one amp second. Most car audio capacitors are 1 farad... meaning they are for electrical peaks.
Crossovers are the "filters," meaning they block out frequencies you don't want.
You could have the names mixed up.
swez on 07/14/2004 23:55:37
Apo... you are confused as to his need. Sit back and watch a minute OK? (Geez-0-peas) lol lol lol my side hurts from this one..no offense meant APO.... S.N.A.F.U. here
Filter cap for 4 ohms bass blocker: Between 300 -500uF will do it. A 5.25" is good down to ~70 Hz and still take some power.
350 uF = -6dB/octave @ 120 Hz
500 uF = -6dB slope/octave, @ 80 Hz.
Use a nonpolorized cap of choice uF, min., of >25 volts is fine.
I'd shoot at closer to 300 uF for these.
www.partsexpress.com
Swez
aposynthesi on 07/15/2004 00:05:40
That sounds like a crossover to me FROWN
LC1 on 07/15/2004 00:12:40
Swez, thanks for the help. "Bass blockers" thats the phrase i was looking for to describe them to aposynthesi.
Anyways, just a quick question, these speakers are OEM in a 1993 Plymouth Acclaim. I took one out of the door and the brand is Oxford. What I am not sure of is what impendance they are. Would you happen to know because that plays a factor in what cap to pick doesnt it?
aposynthesi on 07/15/2004 00:28:44
Swez you... you... eh.
I didn't know WHAT he was talking about... I was getting kind of mad; talking about a capacitor, describing a crossover, then you're all like "HEREICOMETOSAVETHEDAY - BASS BLOCKER."
P0werLifter on 07/15/2004 00:37:09
Alright now...DONT MAKE ME TURN THIS CAR AROUND...shake hands and make up GRIN ...."Are we there yet"
aposynthesi on 07/15/2004 00:44:07
Ha ha Swez and I go WAY back... he knows I'm just kidding.
P0werLifter on 07/15/2004 01:02:39
lol i know im just being a smart@ss GRIN thought it might be a good time to bust on in hehe
ttocs on 07/15/2004 01:15:45
and just so that you know it does not matter where you put the cap, it will block the bass since they are both in series with one another. It is generally said to go on the + side, but will work the same on the negative.
this was a good post then as we were able to inform 2 people.........
swez on 07/15/2004 07:39:32
Yes... busted as charged APO... was just having some fun with you too.
He was asking about bass blocking Caps, not power caps. Don't we all like to have a save the day answer once in a while too? Sure... we all do right. And nope, I did not mean to offend you in any way. But if I did, I am truly repentant...sorry bud. SAD
Back to the origin of this topic, 5.25" speakers can be many values in OEM designs. Oxford makes a decent speaker too. I have been to their facility in Chicago to see their production lines. Used to sell the ferrite magnets to them.
Get out an ohm meter and take a reading on the speaker while disconnected from the HU. Once you have that, use this formula to determine your filtering cap needs. The reading you get from a meter will be a DC resistance value. A reading of 3.6 ohms is a 4 ohm voice coil.
Highpass Filtering:
To determine the crossover frequency a certain amount of capacitance will give you, use the formula:
F = 0.159/(C x Rh)
Explanation of Terms:
C = is the capacitance value (in Farads) [1Farad = 1,000,000 uF]
Rh = is speaker impedance (usually 2, 4 or 8 ohms)
F = is the crossover frequency
Hope that helps,
Swez
racerbizoehm on 07/16/2004 10:54:24
I got another question about those bass blocker things, I got a boss 6.5 inch component system in my truck and crossover all that stuff. when i crank it up to keep up with the subs i get some popping or i guess its distortion, but would those bass blockers help and if they do where could i hook it up, factory wire that goes to crossover? or the mid range or tweeter>....
swez on 07/16/2004 12:17:58
If these Boss speakers are run off an amp with a High Pass filter, try setting the HPF @ ~80 - 100 Hz and see what you get.
If you are running them off the HU amps, the HU is running out of gas and you'll get clipping and high distortion by-products. This is not good and bass blockers will not help here alone. The HU bass settings might, if you back off on the HU bass control and set the sub amp gains to match HU high/mids.
No, it won't be as loud as you might want... but it will be clean signals to your mids/highs. Amping the mids/highs are your best option. You will get more clean mid/high signals from the HU this way. Bumping up the sub amp gain a tad... will restore your bass.
Say more OK?
Swez
racerbizoehm on 07/16/2004 14:05:24
yeh I think I can raise the amp gain prety sure I have it in about the middle right now, and the EQ on the HU setting I had it on was super bass so that would cause it to do that, yeh for everyday stuff usually have it on the vocal setting and that still has some decent bass to it. thanks i'll do that, o another thing i ran into a problem my 60A fuse on the wire going to amp went to hell, cant see any physical problems with fuse but no power goes through so its ebay crap and i'll replace it.
swez on 07/16/2004 16:47:52
Some cheap fuse holders will do that sometimes. A 60A flow of current is nothing to trifle with. Some of the better fuse holder designs I have seem are from:
http://www.knukonceptz.com
Have a look around... good stuff at reasonable prices too.
Swez
racerbizoehm on 07/19/2004 14:22:58
hey i fixed those speakers, the negative wire kinda fell of the mid range and was just shorting it out, so now it sounds as it as its gonna be so thanks anyways
swez on 07/19/2004 20:35:29
Cool!
Swez
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