ok i never had any alternator whine before and i just installed my audio control EQX finaly and now i have alternator whine not very audible when music is on but when its puased its loud and it getws louder with the rpm's going up.
i'm going to run a new ground to my HU because this one is lacking i did it in like 2 minutes in the original install. but the amp has a good ground to bare metal as does the eqx. any idea i do have a set of cheaper RCA's in between the amp and EQX that are only 6 inches long though. is that the weak part that is cuasing it perhaps?
Replies (13)
UKinstaller on 06/27/2004 16:29:39
well i don't know too much about alternator whine aside from bad grounds. i wouldn't think that a set of 6 inch rcas would cause the whine, but i guess just try removing them while the car is running and see if the whine stops.
have you considered just droppiing the EQ and making life easier??
-UK
swez on 06/27/2004 18:47:23
Ohhh Noooo... not going to get off that easy.... not this pending Gold member. Work at it until you get it right. Most likely a ground loop in the system and all audio gear MUST BE WELL GROUNDED to get this one out.
The reason you hear it now, is the gain structure and all the active filtering in the EQX. Nice toy BTW! Your ground potential at HU, EQX and amps... all have to be very close to dead on when using this level of DSP processing. More to read below...
A Quickie... just 4 for you:
How To Identify a Ground Loop:
Ground Loops occur when the ground potential between components differs in a system. Symptoms of a ground loop may include alternator whine, other clues may be indicated by components shutting down when a ground is removed elsewhere in the system. When in doubt about the identification of ground loops the best approach is to measure resistance between battery ground and the ground referenced at each component, a reading of 1 Ohm or more indicates poor ground potential. Always check resistance between battery ground and frame near negative battery connection to frame.
Avoiding Ground Loops:
Make sure components are grounded to bare metal surfaces, scrape paint with a flat blade screwdriver for 1/2" square. Check below before drilling.
Use a star washer between the component ground lug and auto chassis
Coat connection with a corrosion resistive preparation such as a light grease.
Reference: http://www.valcoelectronics.com/caudio/lineout.htm
UKinstaller on 06/28/2004 00:15:34
the reason i said drop the EQ is because in my experience, they are worthless, especially with today's high-end head units. would anyone care to share with me why an EQ is a good thing??
wokka wokka,
-UK
uochronos on 06/28/2004 03:38:30
thanks swez i think its my HU ground i checked and its grounded to a piece of metal hooked to my body not the body itself i well change that in morning and also sand under the amp and eq ground more. that hsould help me...
the reason i questioned the rcas is i hacve my nice PG shielded rca's runing to the eq(used to run to the amp before i had the eq) and now from the EQ to the amp is a piar of 2$ rcas and i think they may be [icking up some noice from the power wire which is near by...
as for the EQ UKinstaller check out the audio control EQX its a Crossover and EQ its a 16 band 1 opctave/ 1/2 octave crossover. it also takes 1 set of RCA's and turns it into 3 sets. has a gain for each channel. and has a input gain. has a light that senses too much power (clipping type stuff) also has a type of SS filter set at 33hz.. my favorite part is the 16band eq my deck a pioneer priemeer deh-p640 and it only has a 3 band eq. simply did not have the control i need/wanted. even with the whine it has now which for some reason is almost inaudible at high volume it sounds way better and crisper then with just the HU eq and other settings. and i'm still working on tuning it perfect... my end goal is to have a system to show at SQ comps ocasionaly.
thanks again swez for the input... i new my quickly done ground would catch up with me on the HU just didnt know when hehe.
UKinstaller on 06/28/2004 09:04:00
well that actually sounds pretty cool. maybe i'll check one out.
-UK
swez on 06/28/2004 09:53:04
One of the best processors on the US market.
www.audiocontrol.com
Swez
uochronos on 06/28/2004 13:17:54
Very good tech support too 10 out of 10 in my book. when i boughtmine it didnt have the wire plug for power/ground/rem and i emailed them and the next day they shipped one too me for no charge with no questions asked. very nice tech support there,.
uochronos on 06/28/2004 20:05:22
ok i grounded it to the fire wall and it still did it so i took some 12guage and wired it to the same ground as amp and eq. and still have a whine. i even upgraded the cheap RCA's to a set of gold plated shielded rca's
uochronos on 06/28/2004 20:31:23
is there by chance a device i could hook inline with the power cable to filter the engine noise out of the signal or something like that... i'm not sure what i'm looking for just anything to clean this up at this point.
i';m alswo going to resane the metal under the ground and try that hopefully it helps/
swez on 06/29/2004 08:46:37
If you have good grounds all the way back from HU through EQX and amps and still have noise, check the input gain setting to your EQ and full rang amp. If that Gain controls are set with too much sensitivity, any noise picked up by the signal lines will be amplified as well. Twisted pair RCA's help reject noise as well. The twisting of wires helps cancel out noise that can be picked up by normal RCA wires.
As for filters... you may want to consider a isolation transformer (choke filter) that passes DC power, but rejects AC noise that may be riding on the power feed lines.
http://www.davidnavone.com/filters.html
Swez
uochronos on 06/30/2004 00:39:55
ok this is funny inside the EQX is a mudule called a "ground loop isolator circuit" it has a adjustable switch as soon as i fliped it no more whine from the alternator:) listened topink floyed, queen, and aero smith all the way home from work today and alls i have to say is that EQ makes a huge differnce.
swez on 06/30/2004 09:34:59
Hummm, did not know that unit came with a GLI. How nice as when having this much gain ratio to play with, very easy to boost system noise along with signals (Music) you wish to hear.
So, are you glad you got that new toy now? Pretty slick huh?
Swez
uochronos on 06/30/2004 14:16:39
very glad i got it. even without having it tuned in 100% right yet its sounds way nicer then with just my HU's eq settings. once i get the whole system mounted properly and where its going to stay i may find a local dealer that can tune the EQ properly(better then just by ear) and then it should really amaze me.
i'm going to run a new ground to my HU because this one is lacking i did it in like 2 minutes in the original install. but the amp has a good ground to bare metal as does the eqx. any idea i do have a set of cheaper RCA's in between the amp and EQX that are only 6 inches long though. is that the weak part that is cuasing it perhaps?
Replies (13)
UKinstaller on 06/27/2004 16:29:39
well i don't know too much about alternator whine aside from bad grounds. i wouldn't think that a set of 6 inch rcas would cause the whine, but i guess just try removing them while the car is running and see if the whine stops.
have you considered just droppiing the EQ and making life easier??
-UK
swez on 06/27/2004 18:47:23
Ohhh Noooo... not going to get off that easy.... not this pending Gold member. Work at it until you get it right. Most likely a ground loop in the system and all audio gear MUST BE WELL GROUNDED to get this one out.
The reason you hear it now, is the gain structure and all the active filtering in the EQX. Nice toy BTW! Your ground potential at HU, EQX and amps... all have to be very close to dead on when using this level of DSP processing. More to read below...
A Quickie... just 4 for you:
How To Identify a Ground Loop:
Ground Loops occur when the ground potential between components differs in a system. Symptoms of a ground loop may include alternator whine, other clues may be indicated by components shutting down when a ground is removed elsewhere in the system. When in doubt about the identification of ground loops the best approach is to measure resistance between battery ground and the ground referenced at each component, a reading of 1 Ohm or more indicates poor ground potential. Always check resistance between battery ground and frame near negative battery connection to frame.
Avoiding Ground Loops:
Make sure components are grounded to bare metal surfaces, scrape paint with a flat blade screwdriver for 1/2" square. Check below before drilling.
Use a star washer between the component ground lug and auto chassis
Coat connection with a corrosion resistive preparation such as a light grease.
Reference: http://www.valcoelectronics.com/caudio/lineout.htm
UKinstaller on 06/28/2004 00:15:34
the reason i said drop the EQ is because in my experience, they are worthless, especially with today's high-end head units. would anyone care to share with me why an EQ is a good thing??
wokka wokka,
-UK
uochronos on 06/28/2004 03:38:30
thanks swez i think its my HU ground i checked and its grounded to a piece of metal hooked to my body not the body itself i well change that in morning and also sand under the amp and eq ground more. that hsould help me...
the reason i questioned the rcas is i hacve my nice PG shielded rca's runing to the eq(used to run to the amp before i had the eq) and now from the EQ to the amp is a piar of 2$ rcas and i think they may be [icking up some noice from the power wire which is near by...
as for the EQ UKinstaller check out the audio control EQX its a Crossover and EQ its a 16 band 1 opctave/ 1/2 octave crossover. it also takes 1 set of RCA's and turns it into 3 sets. has a gain for each channel. and has a input gain. has a light that senses too much power (clipping type stuff) also has a type of SS filter set at 33hz.. my favorite part is the 16band eq my deck a pioneer priemeer deh-p640 and it only has a 3 band eq. simply did not have the control i need/wanted. even with the whine it has now which for some reason is almost inaudible at high volume it sounds way better and crisper then with just the HU eq and other settings. and i'm still working on tuning it perfect... my end goal is to have a system to show at SQ comps ocasionaly.
thanks again swez for the input... i new my quickly done ground would catch up with me on the HU just didnt know when hehe.
UKinstaller on 06/28/2004 09:04:00
well that actually sounds pretty cool. maybe i'll check one out.
-UK
swez on 06/28/2004 09:53:04
One of the best processors on the US market.
www.audiocontrol.com
Swez
uochronos on 06/28/2004 13:17:54
Very good tech support too 10 out of 10 in my book. when i boughtmine it didnt have the wire plug for power/ground/rem and i emailed them and the next day they shipped one too me for no charge with no questions asked. very nice tech support there,.
uochronos on 06/28/2004 20:05:22
ok i grounded it to the fire wall and it still did it so i took some 12guage and wired it to the same ground as amp and eq. and still have a whine. i even upgraded the cheap RCA's to a set of gold plated shielded rca's
uochronos on 06/28/2004 20:31:23
is there by chance a device i could hook inline with the power cable to filter the engine noise out of the signal or something like that... i'm not sure what i'm looking for just anything to clean this up at this point.
i';m alswo going to resane the metal under the ground and try that hopefully it helps/
swez on 06/29/2004 08:46:37
If you have good grounds all the way back from HU through EQX and amps and still have noise, check the input gain setting to your EQ and full rang amp. If that Gain controls are set with too much sensitivity, any noise picked up by the signal lines will be amplified as well. Twisted pair RCA's help reject noise as well. The twisting of wires helps cancel out noise that can be picked up by normal RCA wires.
As for filters... you may want to consider a isolation transformer (choke filter) that passes DC power, but rejects AC noise that may be riding on the power feed lines.
http://www.davidnavone.com/filters.html
Swez
uochronos on 06/30/2004 00:39:55
ok this is funny inside the EQX is a mudule called a "ground loop isolator circuit" it has a adjustable switch as soon as i fliped it no more whine from the alternator:) listened topink floyed, queen, and aero smith all the way home from work today and alls i have to say is that EQ makes a huge differnce.
swez on 06/30/2004 09:34:59
Hummm, did not know that unit came with a GLI. How nice as when having this much gain ratio to play with, very easy to boost system noise along with signals (Music) you wish to hear.
So, are you glad you got that new toy now? Pretty slick huh?
Swez
uochronos on 06/30/2004 14:16:39
very glad i got it. even without having it tuned in 100% right yet its sounds way nicer then with just my HU's eq settings. once i get the whole system mounted properly and where its going to stay i may find a local dealer that can tune the EQ properly(better then just by ear) and then it should really amaze me.
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