Some Help For the New Guy

by Blaq
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This is for the gold medal guys:I have a 98 Honda Accord, and I have just purchased a new stereo that consist of a Pioneer DEH-P960MP HU, Polk MOMO 650 door components, Polk MOMO 690 rears, Polk MOMO M12 sub in factory enclosure, Audio Control Three. 1 EQ/Crossover/Linedriver, CDT M519 Upstage System, CDT SatNet-560 Crossovers to replace the Polk MOMO Component Crossovers, CDT LP-1 Component Tweeter Adjustable Control Unit, Voodoo 3 Farad rack mount cap, PPI Art Series A404 to run mids and highs, PPI Art Series A300 to run sub(bass). I have spent well over 1500.00 dollars on all, and was wondering what else do I need, not planning to compete just like nice sound quality and bass. And if this is a good setup, or should I change anything. Also looking at the HU and Three.1 specs, I have to run a input from HU into Three.1 to tie it all together, but HU does not have inputs, just outputs for high/front output, mid/rear output, and low/subwoofer output. So how do I make this work? Also how would you place your sub rear firing, or front I have the ability to lower my rear seat as a pass thru.


Replies (8)
Bassmafia on 06/16/2004 02:50:24
Very nice headunit;you've got there!
I've been looking at them also!

Blaq on 06/16/2004 13:22:39
The reason for the AC 3.1 is the 13 volt or 20db it puts out as the Pioneer HU only puts out 6.5 volts, and to maximize the amps I want to give them thirteen volts, already purchased, should have just gotten the AC overdrive for this purpose much cheaper, and no connection problems.br


Blaq on 06/16/2004 13:30:28
So the crossovers that came with the Polk 650s is better to use than the CDT SatNet-560 Crossovers? and why?

Blaq on 06/16/2004 14:29:45
SatNet-560 Crossovers:
Transient Optimized" 2-way
"Illiptic Topology Transient Optimized" Crossovers
Adjustable Tweeter Settings: For 5" and 6.5" Woofers
"Gold Plated Block" Terminals
Image Enhancement Tweeter Output
No real specs on the Polk crosover except these By-passable, vented Outboard 2nd Order x2 (High and Low) Crossover with big, beefy components for better dynamic impact and transparency. Vented Crossover Housing has multiple mounting options (screw or "zip" tie) for the ultimate system installation choices. Mating "fastons" for hassle free connections.


swez on 06/16/2004 21:32:39
Great HU here and lots of useful features. The AC 3.1 is great too... if your HU did not already have most of these features covered already. From my position, the AC 3.1 is absolutely redundant to the HU features already there. Don't see a real benefit to using it in this install unless you must have balanced line inputs to your amps.

HU = Pioneer DEH-P960MP HU $399.00
Features & Specs:

CD/ CD-R/ CD-RW/ WMA/ MP3 Player
MOSFET 4 x 50 Watts
XM Satellite Radio Ready
Motorized full flap face plate
8-character display for XM Radio text (no scroll) with GEX-P900XM or GEX-FM903XM
16-character display for XM Radio text (full display) GEX-P910XM
XM Mode (Channel/Category) key
EEQ Performance Chip
13-Band Parametric Equalizer (Adjustable Level, Frequency and Q Factor)
Easy EQ (EEQ) switches 5 Factory, 2 User EQ Presets (Super Bass, Powerful, Natural, Vocal, Flat, Custom 1 and Custom 2)
Source Custom EQ Memory (Independent Custom Memory for each source)
Selectable Loudness Control (Low/Mid/High/Off)
SFEQ (Sound Focus EQ)
Additional Independent Bass / Treble Control for Front / Rear
Two-Way Crossover
Front/Rear HPF (50/80/125Hz, -12dB/oct)
Selectable LPF (Low Pass Filter) (50/80/125Hz, -18dB/oct)
Sub-Out Level (-12dB to +12dB) and, Phase Control
Independent Subwoofer Outputs
Auxiliary Input (CD-RB10 or CD-RB20 required)
2 External Unit Control
S.L.A. (Source Level Adjustment)
ASL (Auto Sound Levelizer)
Selectable Fader Control
Hi-volt RCA Preouts (x3 pair, Front, Rear & Sub) (6.5V)
Dual Motion, Dual Display Motorization swings open to reveal "hidden" Organic EL display
Dual Display - 8 Character LCD Display plus Organic EL (128x33) Display
8-character LCD with LED backlighting on front faceplate
Organic EL (128x33) Display on rear faceplate
OEL display features Full-motion 3D graphic animations including:
2 screensavers (Jet Ski, Sky Gate)
2 Spectrum Analyzers and 3 Level Meters
6 background animations
Clock Display and Off (Text-only) modes
16-character text display capability
Adjustable brightness level (16-mode)
Cellular Mute Capability (CD-CM1 required)
Track Scan/Pause/Repeat/Random Play
Audible Fast-Forward/Reverse (CD Audio)
Playback Compatible with Digital CD-R and CD-RW
Disc Title Memory (48 Discs), CD Text
AGC (Automatic Gain Control)
WMA (Windows Media Audio) & MP3 CD-ROM Playback capability
ID3 & WMA Tag Capability (32 characters max, with Auto-Scroll)
8x oversampling, 3-beam laser pick-up, 1-bit D/A Converter
Anti-shock mechanism
Detachable Face (faceplate carrying case included)
Dual-Motion Motorized Flap Face
Supertuner III, 24-Station/6-Button (18FM / 6AM) Presets
BSM (Best Station Memory)Up/Down Seek with Selectable Local Seek Tuning

http://www.ikesound.com/product-product_id/2107

Comments:
This HU has all the basics and much more too.

a. 13 band EQ, (parametric, adjustable frequency centers & "Q" factor)
b. 5 Easy EQ presets, (3 fixed, 2 custom)
c. Selectable HP/LP filters on F&R channels
d. Selectable LPF for sub channels
e. 6 RCA outputs (F/R & Sub channels) 6.0 volts peak RCA voltage
f. Aux inputs if you wish to add other devices later (need extra hardware for this feature)
g. 25 RMS x 4 internal amps (good for add on tweeters here)

This thing will do everything but butter your toast and deliver poached eggs. Nice HU!
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Interior Speakers:

Polks MOMO MMC650 $170/pr.
Front Stage Comps:

Very good choice for high SQ performance applications. This is a COMP style with integrated swivel tweeter in one package plus a passive crossover network tailored to the drivers in this kit. Don't mess with this crossover. Use as is to maximize audio performance for these fine speakers.

http://www.cardomain.com/item/POLMMC650

==================================================
Rear Deck Speakers $199.00
Polk Momo MMC690 (3-way Coaxial w/ remote Crossovers)

Again, a nice rear deck speaker if you like full range in the rear stage. This speaker has an outboard crossover and bi-ampable. (meaning, separate amp channels to MB driver and tweeters) Can use as full range or MB only... depending on your tastes.

http://www.cardomain.com/item/POLMMC690
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Sub:

Polk MOMO MM12 in factory enclosure $180.00

Specifications:

Frequency Response: 20-200 Hz
Impedance: 4 ohms
RMS Power Handling: 500W
Peak Power Handling: 1000W
Sensitivity: 87 dB

http://www.cardomain.com/item/POLMM12
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CDT M519 are front stage ambient tweeters. Nice product in addition to Polks to raise the highs to the dashboard level and outward to windshield for a new sonic blend of highs to the ears. Several here, have tried them and liked them very much. The CDT LP-1 tweeter control (L-pad) is a nice feature as you can tone down the ambient tweeters to balance the front sound stage. Metal dome tweeters sound much brighter than soft dome sibblings. The ability to control them at your finger tips, is a definite plus.
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CDT SatNet-560 Crossovers: QUOTE: "Technically speaking, the SatNet crossover design is a fourth order/24dB per octave design supplemented by a series first order/6dB per octave on the front end. The unique combination of the two creates a virtual 10th order, 60dB per octave crossover where the critical crossover point between the mid and tweeter is.

The benefits of the design are many. First, the power transition between midrange and tweeter is virtually identical. Phase response problems and polarity shifts are almost entirely eliminated. What you HEAR, is a much more natural sounding component system, as if it were that one perfect speaker".

Great products and as I read it, were designed to improve older crossover models (SatNet 456) used with CDT 2/3 way Comp Driver sets. (HD-52 & HD-62 series) Will they improve what you hear over the Polk crossovers??? Dunno... not sure how compatible the SatNet 560 x-overs will be with your Polk Comps. Only one way to find out... try it.

Do know Polk has been making high end audiophile monitor products since the early 70's. I still use a pair of older A-7 bookshelf style monitors (circa 1978) and they still sound very good. The crossovers are generally designed with very specific filtering points that are optimized for the driver set used. When playing at this level of the SQ game, who would know better how to design a competent crossover network than the speaker makers?

IMHO... if you really want to get the most from the SatNet 560's, get a set of CDT HD-62's for front doors. They cost a lot more than the Polks, but if quality sound is a no-compromise thing to you... that's probably your best choice. Up to you sir! It's your money.
==================================================
PPI amps: Some of the best amps money can buy.

PPI Art Series A404: Older model here:

SPECS:
· One of the cleanest amps made
· Pulse-Width Modulated Switching Power Supply
· Regulated Power Supply, Full Power from 11-15 VDC
· Discrete Power Amp Circuitry
· Internally Bridgeable
· Output Short Circuit Protection
· Low Impedance Protection with Diagnostic L.E.D
· Adjustable Input Sensitivity
· Gold RCA Input Connectors
· 50 Amp Fuse
· 2 x 9.25 x 13" , 8.5 lbs.
· 4 x 50 Watts @ 4 Ohms Stereo 11-15 VDC
· 4 x 100 Watts @ 2 Ohms Stereo 11-15 VDC
· 2 x 200 Watts @ 4 Ohms Bridged 11-15 VDC
2 x 400 Watts @ 2 Ohms Bridged 11-15 VDC

I see no data on crossovers for this amp, so the HU will supply your crossover needs to same. Also, no reference to RCA input voltage limits. Hard to say what you really have here for input voltage needs. Have a look at your amp gain settings and see what range this amp can take for optimal output.
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PPI Art Series A300.2; 2 channel Sub amp:
Cannot find much detail on this amp other than ~150 RMS per channel x 2. Seems this amp has an unregulated power supply so the more voltage you feed it, the more RMS power comes out. I read a claim this amp is 1.5 ohms stable and can deliver >450 RMS. What is this amp fused at? Looks like the least you can expect from this amp when bridged MONO @ 4 ohms is 300 - 350 RMS.

Best I can say, contact PPI and see if you can get copies of the install/user manuals for bith amps. Knowing the specific details of these amps would be most helpful in regard to your final setup process.
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The 3.0 Farad Cap may help a bit with light dimming and voltage drops when you play this system hard. If you have problems with dimming after all is installed, have a few options we can hash out later. In any case, do use #4 power cable/ground (MIN.) from BAT to amps. Fuse this wire close to the battery with 80 - 100A inline fuse. This fuse protects the electricals, battery and ALT from excess current draw via amps or a shorted power line.
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Not sure if the AC 3.1 will be needed or not in this application. Since you already have it... might as well use it. You can wire this device into your system from HU output RCA's to the input side of the 3.1. The 3.1 has 6 channel output RCA's (Front L&R, Rear L&R and 2 sub outs)and 1 pair (L&R) inputs off the HU. Since the 3.1 only has 1 pair of L&R inputs, you will lose your fader control at the HU, but use the 3.1 fader and sub controls instead. The 3 band parametric EQ is redundant to what you already have in the HU. Can use it, but the HU offers more EQ features and if you combine HU EQ with the 3.1 EQ/parabass functions, be carefull not to overdrive the 3.1 or amplifier gains. Some experimentation is in order here.

As for gain control to your amps, the 3.1 has an input gain adjustment that allows you to adjust output voltage to amps, based on input voltage controls on the 3.1. The nominal RCA output voltage per channel is 9.0 volts... 13.0 volts peak. This unit also gives you the option of using balanced or unbalance signal ouputs to each amp. Factory preset is balanced enabled. Read the manual for application notes. Complete install and setup details are available from AC web site:

http://www.audiocontrol.com/PDF/OwnersManuals/MobileAudio/
Three1_CS_OM.pdf

Whew... this was a lot of research there Blaq. You will have a lot of fun in setting up this system. It would be very good to have a friend who had done a few systems of this magnitude to help you out. Once you have it right... should sound very tight!

Good luck and keep us posted OK?

Swez

PS I quit for the day... MEGO has set in... My Eyes Glaze Over
Grin

Blaq on 06/16/2004 22:33:45
Thanks alot for all the insight, I already knew all the specs of everything, but just want an opinion on the setup, and not disappointed with the responses. Also having it installed piece by piece, for whatever I can't do myself like the AC 3.1, but already have rears in and power wire ran using #2 from battery back to cap, then #4 from dist. block to amps.

Thank you again for all the help, and also CDT has a special right now on the HD-62's for 209.00, so I'll probably try to sell the Polks first and then get those, since this isn't a daily driven car can take plenty of time on the install.

Thanks Again Swez

P.S. Will be making a donation soon!!

saintanddolphin on 06/16/2004 22:41:41
I have a kitchen sink if you need anything else...hehe

Nice setup man!


Mike HAPPY

ryan on 06/17/2004 13:02:10
When you get everythign setup let me now how you like your sub. I have been looking at those Polk Momo and am wondering how they sound I want to try out a pair of 10's in my girlfriends car.



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